Dish Continues to Lose Pay-TV Subscribers

[Lue]

Will Dish, SlingTV, or any of the many others just starting up even need a DVR?
All content outside of sports and news will be VOD over the internet says Dish CEO and other media CEO's.

Looking out five years, Ergen predicted All TV programs will be stored “in the cloud” for on-demand viewing and delivered via the Internet, given the lower cost and ubiquity of connected devices
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ees-fit-with-t-mobile-as-he-develops-sling-tv

Where is TV headed?

A: To me, it's pretty clear that all TV is going to be streamed. It's either going to be streamed to a smart TV, a gaming console or a streaming player. That's the way people are going to watch TV. Things like DVD players are going to go away. Cable boxes are obviously going away, too. DVRs are just a stepping stone technology. When everything is on demand, you won't have to record anything anymore so that's going to disappear.

http://www.mercurynews.com/business/ci_25957292/roku-ceo-its-pretty-clear-that-all-tv

 

[Bruce]

Will Dish, SlingTV, or any of the many others just starting up even need a DVR?
All content outside of sports and news will be VOD over the internet says Dish CEO and other media CEO's.

Looking out five years, Ergen predicted All TV programs will be stored “in the cloud” for on-demand viewing and delivered via the Internet, given the lower cost and ubiquity of connected devices

A: To me, it's pretty clear that all TV is going to be streamed. It's either going to be streamed to a smart TV, a gaming console or a streaming player. That's the way people are going to watch TV. Things like DVD players are going to go away. Cable boxes are obviously going away, too. DVRs are just a stepping stone technology. When everything is on demand, you won't have to record anything anymore so that's going to disappear.

Translation-Forced Commercials like we have now when we watch TV Channel apps on the Roku type boxes and Phone/Tablets/etc.

 

[Yespage]

Will Dish, SlingTV, or any of the many others just starting up even need a DVR?
All content outside of sports and news will be VOD over the internet says Dish CEO and other media CEO's.

Looking out five years, Ergen predicted All TV programs will be stored “in the cloud” for on-demand viewing and delivered via the Internet, given the lower cost and ubiquity of connected devices
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ees-fit-with-t-mobile-as-he-develops-sling-tv

Where is TV headed?

A: To me, it's pretty clear that all TV is going to be streamed. It's either going to be streamed to a smart TV, a gaming console or a streaming player. That's the way people are going to watch TV. Things like DVD players are going to go away. Cable boxes are obviously going away, too. DVRs are just a stepping stone technology. When everything is on demand, you won't have to record anything anymore so that's going to disappear.

http://www.mercurynews.com/business/ci_25957292/roku-ceo-its-pretty-clear-that-all-tv

Just because it is "in the cloud" doesn't mean you'll get to have unrestricted access to it.

 

[Bruce]

TV Predictions just reported another 81,000 gone from Dish.

http://www.tvpredictions.com/dish080515.htm

 

[Radioguy41]

I find it hilarious how people continue to predict the demise of OTA TV while OTA TV is in the midst of probably the biggest growth spurt in history with the possible exception of the late 1940s. The FCC estimates as many as 2 million new antennas being installed per year and that, combined with the explosion of diginets, doesn't support the notion that OTA TV is going away, quite the opposite in fact. What is obvious, however, is that broadcasters can forsee the demise of cable and sat TV and are making a transition back to that old fashioned notion of relying on advertisers for income as income from rebroadcasters starts to disappear.

 

[Yespage]

I find it hilarious how people continue to predict the demise of OTA TV while OTA TV is in the midst of probably the biggest growth spurt in history with the possible exception of the late 1940s. The FCC estimates as many as 2 million new antennas being installed per year and that, combined with the explosion of diginets, doesn't support the notion that OTA TV is going away, quite the opposite in fact. What is obvious, however, is that broadcasters can forsee the demise of cable and sat TV and are making a transition back to that old fashioned notion of relying on advertisers for income as income from rebroadcasters starts to disappear.

Transition back? You mean, have to deal with the loss in revenue caused by the cord cutting which was a result of those channels continuing to demand more and more money every three years, right?

Your post seems to gloss over the reality that cable/sat is struggling because the channels got greedy.

 

[Juan]

I find it hilarious how people continue to predict the demise of OTA TV while OTA TV is in the midst of probably the biggest growth spurt in history with the possible exception of the late 1940s. The FCC estimates as many as 2 million new antennas being installed per year and that, combined with the explosion of diginets, doesn't support the notion that OTA TV is going away, quite the opposite in fact. What is obvious, however, is that broadcasters can forsee the demise of cable and sat TV and are making a transition back to that old fashioned notion of relying on advertisers for income as income from rebroadcasters starts to disappear.

The FCC keeps reassigning frequencies from ota to cellular and other uses..the end is much closer than you realize..has nothing to do with popularity.. $$$$$ from wireless providers is the culprit

 

[Lue]

Everything you need to know, straight from the horses mouth.

http://blogs.wsj.com/cmo/2015/03/25/dishs-charlie-ergen-says-sling-tv-will-cannibalize-business/

https://deadline.com/2015/02/charlie-ergen-millennial-watch-tv-mobile-devices-1201379659/

Ergen has been amassing wireless spectrum to help make the satellite company — which he describes as “a mature business” — more relevant in the Internet era. It will include “a heavy dose of video and content.” He sees Sling as “a precursor to do that on a wireless network.”

What is the earliest that the Echostar IP, Air interface sats can be operational in the U.S. 2017, 2018?

http://www.satelliteguys.us/xen/threads/dish-all-ip-satellite-air-interface-in-the-u-s.352347/

Ergen said during Monday's call that Dish's pay-TV service is a mature business.

That's why he made a $13.3 billion bid on wireless spectrum, which could be used to expand video to mobile users, offer Internet or partner with others.

http://www.denverpost.com/business/ci_27584809/dish-reports-net-income-gains-founder-ergen-returns

 

[MikeD-C05]

So 81,000 lost 2nd quarter on top of 44,000 lost 1st quarter. But strangely DISH continues to make more profits than the quarter before. At this rate DISH will drop down under 13 million subs. Cord cutting ,cord nevers and straight up competition is really hurting DISH. I keep saying that they need to rethink some of their various FEES. If DISH would be the first company to offer REDUCED or NO Dvr fees and REDUCED additional receiver fees, they might see some of those subs return. All you have to do is look back in the early 2000s when they offered NO DVR FEE Dvrs like the 500 and 501 dvrs- they added like 2 million subs in short order. It might make sense for DISH to stop looking at making more profits short term each quarter and start ADDING more subs for long term sustainability and dare I say GROWTH of the company. It would also help if DISH would work a deal with T-mobile and use some of that bandwith before they have to give it back to the government in 1 year and a half. Come on Charlie , you are smarter than this.

 

[Lue]

So 81,000 lost 2nd quarter on top of 44,000 lost 1st quarter. But strangely DISH continues to make more profits than the quarter before. At this rate DISH will drop down under 13 million subs. Cord cutting ,cord nevers and straight up competition is really hurting DISH. I keep saying that they need to rethink some of their various FEES. If DISH would be the first company to offer REDUCED or NO Dvr fees and REDUCED additional receiver fees, they might see some of those subs return. All you have to do is look back in the early 2000s when they offered NO DVR FEE Dvrs like the 500 and 501 dvrs- they added like 2 million subs in short order. It might make sense for DISH to stop looking at making more profits short term each quarter and start ADDING more subs for long term sustainability and dare I say GROWTH of the company. It would also help if DISH would work a deal with T-mobile and use some of that bandwith before they have to give it back to the government in 1 year and a half. Come on Charlie , you are smarter than this.

Charlie is smarter than that, he is putting his money into SlingTV and the satellites that will carry the company into the future, Charlie has stated over and over that the Satellite and Cable TV models are MATURE and DECLINING.

“At some point in time the video business as we know it will change dramatically enough that the current business will go from a mature business to a declining business,” he said. “What chairman do you know goes on a conference call and says ‘We’re in a mature business’? They talk about the future and say we’re gonna do this and that, but they don’t normally say ‘We’re in a declining business.’ And we’ve been saying that for five years.

I would’ve thought we would be in a decline mode already,” he added. “Obviously it hasn’t declined yet, but its’ going to happen.”
http://www.forbes.com/sites/jeffber...-twc-surprised-our-business-hasnt-been-worse/

 

[Bruce]

So 81,000 lost 2nd quarter on top of 44,000 lost 1st quarter. But strangely DISH continues to make more profits than the quarter before. At this rate DISH will drop down under 13 million subs. Cord cutting ,cord nevers and straight up competition is really hurting DISH.

They lost more then 44,000 in the first quarter based on this-

Net Pay-TV subscribers declined by approximately 134,000 in the first quarter.


http://dish.client.shareholder.com/releasedetail.cfm?ReleaseID=912135

 

[Yespage]

That's why he made a $13.3 billion bid on wireless spectrum, which could be used to expand video to mobile users, offer Internet or partner with others.

http://www.denverpost.com/business/ci_27584809/dish-reports-net-income-gains-founder-ergen-returns

Not mobile, to all users. The future is wireless, but not from a Sat.

 

[Yespage]

So 81,000 lost 2nd quarter on top of 44,000 lost 1st quarter. But strangely DISH continues to make more profits than the quarter before. At this rate DISH will drop down under 13 million subs. Cord cutting ,cord nevers and straight up competition is really hurting DISH.

The competition isn't any competition when it comes to straight up price except Directv. Dish's receiver fees are nothing like what other cable companies charge! And Dish offers the lowest fees to the frugal subscriber than any other company. Dish can be losing because the price overall keeps going up and the amount of content seems to be stagnant. Also people are gaming the system going from provider to provider to get the special two year offers.

 

[Lue]

Not mobile, to all users. The future is wireless, but not from a Sat.

TMobile or another to help Charlie?
It used to be "Content is King" now it is who controls the last mile. Tables have turned, Disney/ESPN answers Charlies calls on the first ring now. Charlie will be one of the new kings. Apple is working on the same concept as well as AT&T, Verizon, Sprint, etc, while Windstream, Frontier,CenturyLink, Community owned Fiber etc etc. etc. are working on the fiber buildouts in rural areas. Lots more competition coming in this market, which is good news for the consumer. Happening quickly, other states looking at their cellular grid to insure connectivity in every last nook and cranny of their states.
https://governor.iowa.gov/2015/06/gov-branstad-signs-connect-every-acre-bill-into-law

connectivity will be improved by providing a uniform statewide framework for locating cell towers,

http://farmprogress.com/story-branstad-signs-connect-every-acre-bill-law-9-129212

The state has an Office of Broadband Development. And while it was only a fraction of the $100 million deemed necessary by experts, $10.6 million was allocated during the Legislature’s special session last month for the state’s Border-to-Border Broadband Infrastructure grant program.

http://www.duluthnewstribune.com/opinion/our-view/3781653-our-view-federal-hope-broaden-broadband

Lets not forget the two sat operators entering the broadband market.

http://www.satelliteguys.us/xen/threads/new-satellite-internet-provider.350955/

 

[MikeD-C05]

They lost more then 44,000 in the first quarter based on this-

Net Pay-TV subscribers declined by approximately 134,000 in the first quarter.


http://dish.client.shareholder.com/releasedetail.cfm?ReleaseID=912135

I took that figure from their release statement that I got in my email this morning. But , I got it wrong because those numbers were comparing the 44,000 lost from 2nds quarter of 2014. Either way they are losing subs faster than they need to. Charlie needs to get a cell company partner quickly if he wants to compete much longer. As for SLING , I believe that they counted their sub numbers in with the DISH subs to keep their totals up,if I read their release statement right this morning. It would make sense, since both companies are run by DISH and part of DISH.

 

[sam_gordon]

The FCC keeps reassigning frequencies from ota to cellular and other uses..the end is much closer than you realize..has nothing to do with popularity.. $$$$$ from wireless providers is the culprit

You do realize existing OTA channels keep their spectrum, just at a different frequency, right? And that's *IF* the repack even goes through. I don't think OTA is going anywhere anytime soon. Too many people still rely on it for local programming. Does that mean ALL OTA stations will still be around in 20 years? No. I can see MAYBE 1/3 go dark. But OTA will still be here.

 

[Juan]

You do realize existing OTA channels keep their spectrum, just at a different frequency, right? And that's *IF* the repack even goes through. I don't think OTA is going anywhere anytime soon. Too many people still rely on it for local programming. Does that mean ALL OTA stations will still be around in 20 years? No. I can see MAYBE 1/3 go dark. But OTA will still be here.

The total available amount drops for tv stations..and some channels go dark..some share with sister stations..some get new frequencies

 

[nelson61]

the second quarter SEC 10K with all the dirty details.

https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1001082/000110465915056055/a15-12058_110q.htm

 

[Yespage]

I took that figure from their release statement that I got in my email this morning. But , I got it wrong because those numbers were comparing the 44,000 lost from 2nds quarter of 2014. Either way they are losing subs faster than they need to. Charlie needs to get a cell company partner quickly if he wants to compete much longer. As for SLING , I believe that they counted their sub numbers in with the DISH subs to keep their totals up,if I read their release statement right this morning. It would make sense, since both companies are run by DISH and part of DISH.

It'd appear so.
"During 2015, we launched our Sling domestic and Sling Latino services. For the three and six months ended June 30, 2015, we have included all Sling TV subscribers in our Pay-TV subscriber count. As of June 30, 2015, we had 13.932 million Pay-TV subscribers in the United States."

 

[harshness]

You do realize existing OTA channels keep their spectrum, just at a different frequency, right?

The TV band has been squeezed from both ends. That the broadcasters are being painted into a corner costs them alot to move and certainly doesn't facilitate the kind of expansion that many are hooting about. At some point they're going to get into a situation where there simply aren't enough frequencies because the frequencies have been sold or turned over to "emergency services".

Aren't we down to about 35 RF channels now? I remember when there were around 81 with a fraction of the networks.