MLS is about to take over the NHL in average attendance

[salsadancer7]

Here is another stupid quote from Ms. Ortiz that show how she manipulates data to further her agenda:




Goodness gracious, this is like reading newspapers in Cuba or North Korea, where they only tell you what they want you to know.


Sandra

So she is lying...is that what you are saying?

 

[SandraC]

So she is lying...is that what you are saying?

There are three things from her statements that jump out at you right off the bat that show you how she manipulated the data. See if you can figure out what they are.


Sandra

 

[salsadancer7]

There are three things from her statements that jump out at you right off the bat that show you how she manipulated the data. See if you can figure out what they are.


Sandra

I am not asking you if she manipulated the data because i know you are very big on 'data can be manipulated'...I am asking you, is she lying? AND again, what his her agenda?

 

[SandraC]

I am not asking you if she manipulated the data because i know you are very big on 'data can be manipulated'...I am asking you, is she lying? AND again, what his her agenda?

Well without looking them up, I'm just going to assume her data is correct and not demand you show me links to the actual data.

But she it totally manipulating what she is comparing to further her agenda. Are you really clueless to what her agenda is?


Sandra

 

[Peter Parker]

I really don't see how this has legs. to begin with attendance is only one measure of popularity and comparing the average attendance of a sport played in indoor arenas to one played in outdoor stadiums seems ridiculously unfair.

as for agenda why not just the agenda of constructing a headline in such a way to draw attention? it happens all the time in print and electronic media. heck many of the thread titles here are constructed to grab attention as opposed to enlighten the reader.

 

[cosmo_kramer]

Maybe in TV rating, but not so much in attendance. Now, it seems that they are getting their act together on the TV side.

NBC Signs Three-Year Deal With MLS For Fox Soccer's Television Package - SportsBusiness Daily | SportsBusiness Journal

It's a start. The bulk of the games will be on the new NBC Sports Network (Versus), replacing Fox Soccer. Only four games will be on NBC itself, two regular season and 2 playoff games....

 

[salsadancer7]

Well without looking them up, I'm just going to assume her data is correct and not demand you show me links to the actual data.

But she it totally manipulating what she is comparing to further her agenda. Are you really clueless to what her agenda is?


Sandra

Thank you for the clueless... but I am curious to know what YOU think her agenda is. Because obviously, if you do not agree with something, it's a "straw man agenda" going on... So please appease my cluelessness with what this agenda is....

 

[Hart5150]

I took a straw poll of 25000 people in Boston. 24998 liked the Bruins more than the Revolution, 2 preferred the Revs.

 

[DodgerKing]

Here is another stupid quote from Ms. Ortiz that show how she manipulates data to further her agenda:

Goodness gracious, this is like reading newspapers in Cuba or North Korea, where they only tell you what they want you to know.


Sandra

I used that quote earlier as well. She is comparing apples to oranges, a low rated network not carried by all providers to the highest rated sports network carried by all providers in all packages

 

[yaz96]

Did you see what I quoted about the declining MLS ratings?


Sandra

You mentioned ONE game. That's going to be your factual basis for stating that ratings overall are declining, IF it's even true?

Garber praised Fox Soccer, saying it has "turned into a much more professionally produced cable network" under Nathanson. But he said he could not pass up the added reach that Versus (76 million homes) has over Fox Soccer (39 million homes).

This should help. It helped he NHL.

Plus, MLS is still on ESPN as well.

 

[DodgerKing]

Thank you for the clueless... but I am curious to know what YOU think her agenda is. Because obviously, if you do not agree with something, it's a "straw man agenda" going on... So please appease my cluelessness with what this agenda is....

Is she not using data incorrectly, rather purposefully or unintentionally, to support a particular view? In doing so over and over with a theme about how soccer is surpassing hockey, is that not pushing an agenda?

 

[yaz96]

Attendance is a straw man argument anyway...


Sandra

How so? It's hard numbers.

The author bases the "average" attendance for a league that consists of half as many teams playing a much short schedule (30 games vice 82) in much larger venues. I can't wait to see the 112,000+ fans fill the Big House should the NHL ever decide to host a Winter Classic in Michigan Stadium.

That's ONE special event game.

Sorry riff, logic is not allowed here...just fluffy statements to advance an agenda.


Sandra

C'mon Sandra.....

 

[yaz96]

.

 

[DodgerKing]

How so? It's hard numbers.

Because they are ignoring several confounding variables, such as number of games, price of tickets, and size of stadiums

 

[yaz96]

Because they are ignoring several confounding variables, such as number of games, price of tickets, and size of stadiums

That doesn't matter. The average attendance is higher. There is no ignoring, because you can't ignore what doesn't exist.

You guys are playing the straw game adding the what ifs......and the but, but, buts........


Popularity is a subjective issue, sure, but butts in the seats are a hard fact.

 

[SandraC]

Thank you for the clueless... but I am curious to know what YOU think her agenda is. Because obviously, if you do not agree with something, it's a "straw man agenda" going on... So please appease my cluelessness with what this agenda is....

Her agenda is in the title of her article. That soccer is more popular than hockey.

In this quote...

With regard to ratings, MLS also is making a surge. The league’s televised 2011 opener between the Galaxy and Sounders on ESPN was up 129 percent in ratings and 112 percent in viewership, drawing 604,000 English-language viewers. The game’s Spanish-language broadcast on ESPN Deportes drew another 79,000 viewers, an increase of 84 percent from a year ago.

Those TV viewer numbers rival – or surpass – those of almost every nationally televised NHL game this year on Versus. And no league can come close to boasting that kind of jump in viewership.

...she's manipulating data and leaving out information.


Sandra

 

[yaz96]

Her agenda is in the title of her article. That soccer is more popular than hockey.


Sandra

Just to restate the title -


Major League Soccer is Poised to Overtake the NHL as the 4th Most Popular Professional Sports League in the U.S.


She does not say it is more popular, nor does she say how long it may take to OVERTAKE the NHL.

 

[yaz96]

Quote- "As data from the 2010 Census emerges, the cultural demographic of the U.S. population is shifting. It’s only a matter of time until our sports landscape catches up.

While multiple factors are responsible for MLS growth, the 16-year-old league’s ascension to the top ranks of professional sports has a large amount to do with the sport’s popularity among the Latino community. This rise is in no small part due to MLS efforts, since its inception, to market to this important demographic.

“Other leagues have the advantage that they’ve been there longer, but there’s no doubt that [idea of the four professional sports leagues] is starting to change, and I think that’s about a demographic change,” Eduardo Carvacho, senior director of Hispanic sales and marketing for F.C. Dallas. “It doesn’t take too long to realize, reading the highlights that are coming out of the Census, that demographics are changing in America.”
Census data released so far has shown the number of Hispanics in this country is rising fast. Data in almost every state show a higher Hispanic population than expected, with projections for the U.S. Hispanic population to be around 55 million, or 17 percent.
The population shift isn’t just in states along the U.S.-Mexico border, New York and Florida. It’s happening in places like Washington (where the Hispanic population grew by nearly 71 percent) and Missouri (where it skyrocketed by 79 percent). For the record, both states tout MLS teams.

Of the U.S. Hispanic population, 85 percent trace their roots to countries where soccer is the premier sport.
In 2009, 33 percent of MLS fans were Hispanic, more than twice that of any other league. (The NBA is second with 16.) That same year, 40 percent of fans that attended an MLS game were Hispanic. Those numbers alone are overwhelming evidence as to just how influential the Hispanic fan base is for MLS and its growth.

The expected rise of the U.S. Hispanic population will undoubtedly provide an added boost.

Just how much of a boost?

“As the Hispanic community continues to grow and becomes the largest minority group in America, I believe we [at MLS] have the opportunity to leapfrog No. 4 [U.S. sports league] and are poised to become that No. 3,” Carvacho said.
In 2000, such projections would have been deemed wishful thinking. Now, they seem well within the realm of possibility.
After all, if we’ve learned anything, it’s that a lot can change between now and the next Census."


Read more: Major League Soccer is Poised to Overtake the NHL as the 4th Most Popular Professional Sports League in the U.S. - Fox News Latino







It seems to me that her agenda is showcasing the increasing Hipanic population in the US, and how that will affect what sports will see an increase in fans.

 

[SandraC]

Just to restate the title -


Major League Soccer is Poised to Overtake the NHL as the 4th Most Popular Professional Sports League in the U.S.


She does not say it is more popular, nor does she say how long it may take to OVERTAKE the NHL.

OK, you're right...at the word 'poised' if you like. But my point is that the data she uses to support that theory is purposely misleading and leaves out some very important information.

According to her criteria the MLS is 'poised' to overtake the NBA in popularity as well. Will anyone actually say that with a straight face?


Sandra

 

[DodgerKing]

That doesn't matter. The average attendance is higher.

You guys are playing the straw game adding the what ifs......and the but, but, buts........


Popularity is a subjective issue, sure, but butts in the seats are a hard fact.

It does matter. I am a stats teacher. You cannot justifiably compare numbers when their is too much variability between the two subjects. In order to make an accurate comparison one has to control all of the other variables. In order to accurately compare numbers one has to control ticket prices, stadium sizes, and number of games.

Example:

Sport A one year has an average seating of say 10,000 and all teams 10 teams sellout every game for 50 home games. That makes an average of 10,000 per game or a total of 5.0 fans.
Sport B one year has an average seating of say 50,000 and all 5 teams average 50% capacity for 10 home games. That makes and average of 25,000 per game or a total of 1.25 million fans.

I can then claim that Sport B surpasses Sport A in average attendance, even though they attracted 25% of the total fans of Sport A.

To accurately compare average fans per game we need to determine how many fans Sport A would attract if they too had average seating of 50,000 or Sport B had average seating of 10,000, and ticket prices are the same

To accurately compare total number of fans for a whole season we would need to compare the same total number of home games, the same total number of teams, and the same total average when seating capacity and ticket prices are held constant