MLS is about to take over the NHL in average attendance

[DodgerKing]

Just to restate the title -


Major League Soccer is Poised to Overtake the NHL as the 4th Most Popular Professional Sports League in the U.S.


She does not say it is more popular, nor does she say how long it may take to OVERTAKE the NHL.

I never thought I would ever be on the side of the NHL in any debate. Heck, I much rather watch soccer than hockey.

With that said, poised or not poised to do or already did, does not change the fact that she is basing her arguments on data that is not accurately represented and creating comparisons between two populations when there are too many confounding and lurking variables

 

[yaz96]

OK, you're right...at the word 'poised' if you like. But my point is that the data she uses to support that theory is purposely misleading and leaves out some very important information.

According to her criteria the MLS is 'poised' to overtake the NBA in popularity as well. Will anyone actually say that with a straight face?


Sandra

See my other post regarding Hispanic population increase. That seems to be what it's based on.

 

[salsadancer7]

That doesn't matter. The average attendance is higher. There is no ignoring, because you can't ignore what doesn't exist.
You guys are playing the straw game adding the what ifs......and the but, but, buts........


Popularity is a subjective issue, sure, but butts in the seats are a hard fact.

Correct.

 

[SandraC]

I never thought I would ever be on the side of the NHL in any debate. Heck, I much rather watch soccer than hockey.

With that said, poised or not poised to do or already did, does not change the fact that she is basing her arguments on data that is not accurately represented and creating comparisons between two populations when their is too many confounding and lurking variables

And she's also manipulating data and leaving out some important facts that do not advance her position.


Sandra

 

[DodgerKing]

I think you were looking at the wrong data. See my other post regarding Hispanic population increase. That seems to be what it's based on.

And I would bet that a higher percentage of them follow other leagues vs MLS. Of course that is mostly anecdotal.

 

[yaz96]

It does matter. I am a stats teacher. You cannot justifiably compare numbers when their is too much variability between the two subjects. In order to make an accurate comparison one has to control all of the other variables. In order to accurately compare numbers one has to control ticket prices, stadium sizes, and number of games.

Example:

Sport A one year has an average seating of say 10,000 and all teams 10 teams sellout every game for 50 home games. That makes an average of 10,000 per game or a total of 5.0 fans.
Sport B one year has an average seating of say 50,000 and all 5 teams average 50% capacity for 10 home games. That makes and average of 25,000 per game or a total of 1.25 million fans.

I can then claim that Sport B surpasses Sport A in average attendance, even though they attracted 25% of the total fans of Sport A.

To accurately compare average fans per game we need to determine how many fans Sport A would attract if they too had average seating of 50,000 or Sport B had average seating of 10,000, and ticket prices are the same

To accurately compare total number of fans for a whole season we would need to compare the same total number of home games, the same total number of teams, and the same total average when seating capacity and ticket prices are held constant

Imaginary statistics are a straw man's argument.

 

[DodgerKing]

Imaginary statistics are a straw man's argument.

Exactly. Which is why her numbers do not accurately support her argument. Good to see you understand Sanra's and my point

 

[yaz96]

And I would bet that a higher percentage of them follow other leagues vs MLS.

Well, would you bet that the sun will or will not explode tomorrow, as well? We don't know.

You may be a stats teacher, but I guess logic doesn't come into play in stats.

 

[riffjim4069]

U.S. Republicans to debate in Iowa this evening; Palin, Perry Romney, etc. to take center stage. Can we please close this thead since it has turned political debate. I'll be busy discussing hockey, football and baseball.

 

[yaz96]

U.S. Republicans to debate in Iowa this evening; Palin, Perry Romney, etc. to take center stage. Can we please close this thead since it has turned political debate. I'll be busy discussing hockey, football and baseball.

What the hell are you talking about? Just stay out Jim.

 

[salsadancer7]

It does matter. I am a stats teacher. You cannot justifiably compare numbers when their is too much variability between the two subjects. In order to make an accurate comparison one has to control all of the other variables. In order to accurately compare numbers one has to control ticket prices, stadium sizes, and number of games.

Example:

Sport A one year has an average seating of say 10,000 and all teams 10 teams sellout every game for 50 home games. That makes an average of 10,000 per game or a total of 5.0 fans.
Sport B one year has an average seating of say 50,000 and all 5 teams average 50% capacity for 10 home games. That makes and average of 25,000 per game or a total of 1.25 million fans.

I can then claim that Sport B surpasses Sport A in average attendance, even though they attracted 25% of the total fans of Sport A.

To accurately compare average fans per game we need to determine how many fans Sport A would attract if they too had average seating of 50,000 or Sport B had average seating of 10,000, and ticket prices are the same

To accurately compare total number of fans for a whole season we would need to compare the same total number of home games, the same total number of teams, and the same total average when seating capacity and ticket prices are held constant

So why is this only applied to the soccer argument? I mean NO ONE applies this line of thinking when it comes to NFL vs MLB or NBA vs. NFL. It would be nice if all sports stadiums held the exact amount for all professional teams and they all played the exact amount of games and they all charged the exact amount per ticket prices. BUT they don't. So until they do start, the fact remains, MLS is about to surpass the NHL in average attndance.

 

[yaz96]

Exactly. Which is why her numbers do not accurately support her argument. Good to see you understand Sanra's and my point

You are going to argue that the Hispanic population is not increasing in the US?

Go back and read the post I quoted about that. http://www.satelliteguys.us/263102-mls-about-take-over-nhl-average-10.html#post2606883

THAT is her point.

You guys are focusing on her TV numbers. Look at the reason why the increase in fans. Hispanic population.

 

[SandraC]

the fact remains, MLS is about to surpass the NHL in average attndance.

The MLS is about to pass the NBA in attendance too. Why are we only discussing the NHL?


Sandra

 

[SandraC]

You are going to argue that the Hispanic population is not increasing in the US?

Go back and read the post I quoted about that. http://www.satelliteguys.us/263102-mls-about-take-over-nhl-average-10.html#post2606883

THAT is her point.

You guys are focusing on her TV numbers. Look at the reason why the increase. Hispanic population.

My point is that her TV numbers are manipulated, leave out important information, and are not representative of a true comparison.

 

[salsadancer7]

My point is that her TV numbers are manipulated, leave out important information, and are not representative of a true comparison.

But you tell me WHAT news story does not do that, regardless of the subject? Does that mean there is a "agenda"?

 

[yaz96]

And I would bet that a higher percentage of them follow other leagues vs MLS. Of course that is mostly anecdotal.

I see you edited your post.

My question to you -

Why can't they follow the local MLS team AS WELL AS other leagues? You are excluding one for the other. They are not mutually exclusive.

 

[SandraC]

I see you edited your post.

My question to you -

Why can't they follow the local MLS team AS WELL AS other leagues? You are excluding one for the other. They are not mutually exclusive.

The dopey Ms. Ortiz is the one who began comparisons. It's not either/or. Obviously some people (like me) follow both sports.


Sandra

 

[DodgerKing]

So why is this only applied to the soccer argument? I mean NO ONE applies this line of thinking when it comes to NFL vs MLB or NBA vs. NFL. It would be nice if all sports stadiums held the exact amount for all professional teams and they all played the exact amount of games and they all charged the exact amount per ticket prices. BUT they don't. So until they do start, the fact remains, MLS is about to surpass the NHL in average attndance.

I do. Which is why I never compare attendance figures between the 4 leagues.

Football holds the most which means their average attendance will always be higher than any of the other 3 major leagues, but their total will always be lower since they only have 8 home games

Baseball will always have the second highest average since their stadiums have the second highest seating, but their total will always be the highest since they have the second largest stadiums and the most home games, 81

The only two you can accurately compare is hockey and basketball, since they play in the same arenas (about the same number of seats), play the same number of games, play during the same time of the year, and have more or less the same number of teams. But these two will always be less in average to baseball and football since their arenas are the smaller than stadiums, and their totals will be less than baseball because of smaller arenas and half as many home games

 

[DodgerKing]

You are going to argue that the Hispanic population is not increasing in the US?

Go back and read the post I quoted about that. http://www.satelliteguys.us/263102-mls-about-take-over-nhl-average-10.html#post2606883

THAT is her point.

You guys are focusing on her TV numbers. Look at the reason why the increase in fans. Hispanic population.

Your reply has nothing to do with my post you quoted.

 

[salsadancer7]

The MLS is about to pass the NBA in attendance too. Why are we only discussing the NHL?


Sandra

Not quite...but not too far off.

NBA Attendance Up Slightly From '09-10; Heat Top All Teams In Road Attendance

Published April 14, 2011

NBA teams averaged 17,323 fans per game this season, up slightly from 17,165 last season. The Bulls led all teams for the second straight year with 21,792 fans per game, up 5.1% from their home mark last year. The Heat saw the biggest gain, up 11.6% at AmericanAirlines Arena, while the Pistons saw the sharpest drop, down 11.2% at the Palace of Auburn Hills. During their first season at Amway Center, the Magic saw attendance rise 8.7%. The Nets played their first season at Prudential Center, with attendance up 8.2%.

NBA Attendance Up Slightly From '09-10; Heat Top All Teams In Road Attendance - SportsBusiness Daily | SportsBusiness Journal