Likelihood of failure of non-burial grade coax?

[msa6]

My dish was installed on a long run to the house nearly three years ago. I've now determined that the coax used in the install was not direct burial. I don't know what exactly it was, but Dish installer and supervisor at the house over the weekend said it was the wrong stuff (done by a contractor) that they would never have used.

My question is how given to failure might the wrong coax be after three years in the ground? I realize that more info on exactly what was in the ground would help, but for now I don't have that info. If it matters, we're not in a particularly cold part of the country (VA).

Thanks.

 

[Stargazer]

I've seen nonburial used many years ago and still in use today in the ground. It probably depends on the moisture in the ground where the wire is laid at. I am sure the same thing has been done over the years at many locations but is being done much less than what it used to be done.

 

[Liquidforce88]

Years is how long it will last. Look at old C-Band cable, it was not flooded and I have seen that stuff after 20 years still working fine.

 

[msa6]

Thanks for the replies. What's interesting to me is that both runs from the dish failed within a couple of weeks of each other.

Curious to see what these runs look like (presuming we pull them up) when the new (BG) coax goes in. Wonder if the installer complicated things with a splice somewhere along the way.

 

[Hemi 6.1]

The only case I know of was ,RG6 buried in the ground for 2 years before it failed. Depending how it was buried ,would determin that. Wire in pvc pipe would hve much greater life span,then a wire just dropped in a trench.Anyone that would just throw a wire in the dirt and cover it with more dirt is a slob. I don't care if its underground cable or not.

 

[Jared Twomey]

Anyone that would just throw a wire in the dirt and cover it with more dirt is a slob. I don't care if its underground cable or not.

or doesnt get paid enough to dig a trench and provide conduit

everything is free, free, free nowadays, no one wants to pay for anything.

I use burial cable, but for dish and direct, I don't use pvc. For Wildblue and hughesnet I do, but then again, I am getting paid a more reasonable rate for those

 

[Hemi 6.1]

or doesnt get paid enough to dig a trench and provide conduit

everything is free, free, free nowadays, no one wants to pay for anything.

And don't think this doesn't reflect on D* and E* . Its still shotty work whether its free or not.. I refused to let D* or E* bury any wire in my yard without being in some type of Pipe.So I guess if I wanted it done right ,I had to do it myself. So both companys left me the wire and they just mounted the Dishes ONLY! So who really should have gotten paid ? You take the good with the bad my friend ,There's a ton of cases where you get paid a ton for nothing and get paid nothing for a ton. Tell me when does the customer get paid? No matter what the excuses are its still sloppy workmanship.

 

[Bob Haller]

I ran a RG6 in a trench to my shed, it was a last minute addition, it lasted about 5 years.

it was kinda nice having sat tv in my 16 by 20 foot shed, but i lost interest.

main purpose of trench was power to the shed, that still works fine

 

[Van]

It is a good idea to run any coax or related cable through conduit when burying but that would add to the cost of the install that everyone wants for free.

Non burial will last 20 years or more so long as its not in rocky soil. For the OP I would say that the contractor did the typical thing that most of them do and most likely there are barrels in each line in the ground.

 

[dishcomm]

My dish was installed on a long run to the house nearly three years ago. I've now determined that the coax used in the install was not direct burial. I don't know what exactly it was, but Dish installer and supervisor at the house over the weekend said it was the wrong stuff (done by a contractor) that they would never have used.

My question is how given to failure might the wrong coax be after three years in the ground? I realize that more info on exactly what was in the ground would help, but for now I don't have that info. If it matters, we're not in a particularly cold part of the country (VA).

Thanks.

never had any problems using non burial in the ground. I wouldn't run it thru a swamp or across a high ater table area ..In fact some mfgs insist their non flooded cable can be buried. I beleive it. Because I have never gone to a job where the cable has failed unless it was cut or damaged and allowed moisture to tranfer into the cable. Flooded cbale is prohibitively expensive. And since we are not required to use it, no sense buying it...we have dense clay soil here that does not hold moisture. But i imagine areas where the soil is loamy or brown or black dirt, the need for flooded cable may be a good idea because these soils tend ot hold more moisture.

 

[dishcomm]

Thanks for the replies. What's interesting to me is that both runs from the dish failed within a couple of weeks of each other.

Curious to see what these runs look like (presuming we pull them up) when the new (BG) coax goes in. Wonder if the installer complicated things with a splice somewhere along the way.

possible....

 

[dishcomm]

The only case I know of was ,RG6 buried in the ground for 2 years before it failed. Depending how it was buried ,would determin that. Wire in pvc pipe would hve much greater life span,then a wire just dropped in a trench.Anyone that would just throw a wire in the dirt and cover it with more dirt is a slob. I don't care if its underground cable or not.

hey ..you buy the conduit and open the trench we have no problems..If you want conduit from a tech, you'd better not hold your breath....

 

[dishcomm]

And don't think this doesn't reflect on D* and E* . Its still shotty work whether its free or not.. I refused to let D* or E* bury any wire in my yard without being in some type of Pipe.So I guess if I wanted it done right ,I had to do it myself. So both companys left me the wire and they just mounted the Dishes ONLY! So who really should have gotten paid ? You take the good with the bad my friend ,There's a ton of cases where you get paid a ton for nothing and get paid nothing for a ton. Tell me when does the customer get paid? No matter what the excuses are its still sloppy workmanship.

There are rules,pal...We are required to do a standard basic install. it's spelled out in the service agreeemnt. If you want something not covered in that agreement you must pay for it or you don't get it..period..Conduit isn't in the agreement. neither is dealing with a sh!tty attitude.
"Tell me when does the customer get paid?"....ok it works like this..you ask for a service.. money changes hands ..from the customer to the vendor..Not the other way around...
The guy gets paid because he did what was required. He would have buried the cable per specs if you'd let him. but since you had to be a buttinsky, you got what you asked for.. Good day ,sir.

 

[Hemi 6.1]

There are rules,pal...We are required to do a standard basic install. it's spelled out in the service agreeemnt. If you want something not covered in that agreement you must pay for it or you don't get it..period..Conduit isn't in the agreement. neither is dealing with a sh!tty attitude.
"Tell me when does the customer get paid?"....ok it works like this..you ask for a service.. money changes hands ..from the customer to the vendor..Not the other way around...
The guy gets paid because he did what was required. He would have buried the cable per specs if you'd let him. but since you had to be a buttinsky, you got what you asked for.. Good day ,sir.

And your point ? I didn't get mad at the tech. I just told them both,If the wire isn't going into PVC I'll do it myself. Because its sloppy. You follow what ever rules you want,or have too. I called Directv right after and, yes bitched about wire just laying in Dirt. I know of places that have codes about this. My town being one of them. NO WIRES IN GROUND WITHOUT BEING IN AN ENCLOSED PIPE. FREE FROM WATER AND DEBRIES. So follow the rules pal. Just because D* and E* can get away with it don't make it right.I've been building houses for 12 years. I follow rules as well.

 

[AllieVi]

Plastic conduit is so cheap that it hardly makes sense not to use it. If a problem ever arises with the cable or a newer cable standard develops, simply pull the old out and the new in. Critters (gophers, etc.) are much less likely to be a problem when conduit is used. The conduit can also be used to add new lines that you didn’t anticipate needing.

Digging a trench is the hard and messy part. It’s something you should only do once.

 

[Hemi 6.1]

Plastic conduit is so cheap that it hardly makes sense not to use it. If a problem ever arises with the cable or a newer cable standard develops, simply pull the old out and the new in. Critters (gophers, etc.) are much less likely to be a problem if when conduit is used. The conduit can also be used to add new lines that you didn’t anticipate needing.

Digging a trench is the hard and messy part. It’s something you should only do once.

Exactly Dig ONCE! once the pipe is in ,No need to dig the ground again. "Well" piping is cheap as hell too.

 

[Hemi 6.1]

. If you want something not covered in that agreement you must pay for it or you don't get it..period..Conduit isn't in the agreement. neither is dealing with a sh!tty attitude..

18-24 month commitment is payment enough! I don't know about your town ,But Dishnetwork gets paid by the hour here.

 

[Stargazer]

If they do not supply the installer with the pipe to use on the installs and do not tell them to use it then it is not going to be used unless you just happen to have some handy and still some installers may buck on putting it in if they think it will take more time while others will do it to make you happy. I know if it is to be run underneath a driveway then I require people put it in a plastic pipe telling them it will not get crushed this way. I've had to do that a few times. Both installs required a long wire run. I knew the people personally so I helped them with it wanting to make sure the job was done right particularly in those instances as I did not want them to have to replace the wire often due to the weight of the vehicles that can crush the wire into.

 

[Johnevans1985]

A Basic installation by a DNS technician (not a contactor) is done according to FCC, NEC and DNS standards. If conduit was required it would be part of the basic install. And as far as the 18-24 month commitments being payment enough... I don't think so. Asuming that the install is done properly and you do not ever need a Trouble Call. Consider this: Cost of Cables, Connectors (DNS fittings are 0.59/each), grond blocks, 10 gauge ground wire, the dish itself, the LNBF (the eye of the dish) and the cost of the RCVR. I do realize that sometime you are paying for the rcvr. (really part of it). On top of all of that you need to also consider that Dish is paying the tech and the equipment on the truck and Gas. Which is not cheap. Life isn't free, normally Dish doesn't end up making a dime off of your account untill the end of that comitment. Also, have you ever looked into the cost of launching a satelite into orbit? =)

 

[Liquidforce88]

And your point ? I didn't get mad at the tech. I just told them both,If the wire isn't going into PVC I'll do it myself. Because its sloppy. You follow what ever rules you want,or have too. I called Directv right after and, yes bitched about wire just laying in Dirt. I know of places that have codes about this. My town being one of them. NO WIRES IN GROUND WITHOUT BEING IN AN ENCLOSED PIPE. FREE FROM WATER AND DEBRIES. So follow the rules pal. Just because D* and E* can get away with it don't make it right.I've been building houses for 12 years. I follow rules as well.

Blah Blah Blah Blah mr.Knowitall contractor. Yep you sound like all the other ones I have done work for. You think you know every thing because you are a contractor.

Then to top it off you tell the tech not to bury it, then turn around and call the provider and bitch about it laying in the dirt.

Lemme ask you this, your customer says they want all their studs screwed together not nailed because nails are sloppy. You going to do that for free, mr.knowitall?