129 trouble calls

[dnsguy]

Van, dnsguy means that if you get your house reroofed and the next time it rains, and it leaks, don't call the roofer and complain. Just move in the basement, but don't bother the roofer with your freakin complaint calls about leaks. IT"S KILLING HIM!

DNSGUY MEANS THAT IF YOU GET YOUR HOUSE RE-ROOFED WITH A DEFECTIVE PRODUCT SUE THE MANUFACTURER NOT THE CREW WHO DID THE WORK

 

[MikeD-C05]

IT would have made more sense to use the new 118 sat for the national hd channels. Then they could stop the duplication for the national channels on 61.5 and the 129 sat. Then they could have used the side sats for internationals and hd locals. I know that the international channels make Dish some money but come on why have them on 3 satellites. The main stream U.S. customer needs a single dish solution( THAT WORKS FOR ALL) for all their hd , national cable channels and for their locals. It seems like a waste of space to put more internationals up when they have the problems they are having with hd reception on the west coast and southern Tx and Florida. I wonder if they even ever think ahead when they come up with this sh*t.

 

[brg606]

great idea charlie, place all your premium programming on the worst satellite in the sky (129).

 

[Van]

DNSGUY MEANS THAT IF YOU GET YOUR HOUSE RE-ROOFED WITH A DEFECTIVE PRODUCT SUE THE MANUFACTURER NOT THE CREW WHO DID THE WORK

ITs rarely an issue of defective product so much as it is the guys who put it up, I have a background in roofing and the materials and its incredibly rare to find defective roofing materials as compared to a roofing crew that runs through the job.

 

[Van]

Well I dont know how long you've been with dish but stack rankings is yet another poorly implimented plan that dish came up with and it will take them loosing alot of new highers and veteran techs to realize that you can not send a technician out with 80 points or higher and get quality work out of that technician. The trouble call rate within 12 days has skyrockected in just about every single dns and depot across the country as well as has the turn over rate for new and long term employee's.

 

[webbydude]

great idea charlie, place all your premium programming on the worst satellite in the sky (129).

I whole-heartedly agree. Not to mention it sounds like most of the local hi-def channels will not be mirrored on the 61.5. Totally screwed up policy

 

[Erosman]

129 problems continuous since upgrade

My experience has been almost daily frustration over my DISH equipment's failure to provide strong enough signals for 3 of the newer HD channels: ESPN2, RAVE, and the kung fu/Asian movie channel. This is even more irritating during the World Cup and I am unable to get the high definition feed of ESPN2. Virtually every day there seems to be about a 20% chance that every time I try to tune them in I will get banner information but no picture or sound for those three channels.

I have made customer service calls and gone through the signal check and reset game almost a dozen times since getting my first 211 this February. I've also done the signal check, diagnostics, and hard/manual reset of the receiver on my own at least 3 dozen times. I'm on my second 211 now as they sent me a new one when the first permanently froze up during a reset a couple of months ago.

Neither telephone customer service nor an in-person service call during which a supervisor came along and did most of the work were any help at all in being able to see these channels that I am paying for. I was told my DISH 1000 is as "peaked as it can be" and the only possible solution is to buy and install a second dish dedicated to getting the HD channels from the 61.9(?) satellite - but then I would not get my HD locals. I don't know if the suggested solution is appropriate for someone else, but it wouldn't work for me living in an association community.

Right now I can not see the US World Cup match in HD on ESPN2. Last night I missed an old Jackie Chan movie on the Kung-fu channel. The other day I couldn't watch Jules Holland or Soundstage on RAVE. Yet, I still have to pay DISH over $70.00 per month for my HD silver package with 2 receivers (a 301 and a 211).

I feel like a combination guinea pig and sucker for what I seem to be stuck with; including the 18 month lease on the 211. If it wasn't for the positives from some of the other channels - most notably HD filmfestival and Monstervision, I'd see if I could get out from the lease. (I love the James Bond festival, classic movies in HD, as well as the older creature features and the classic Hammer and AIP flicks.)

According to the tech supervisor that came out on the service call, the only choices I have are to live with the missing channels and wait for the HD channels to be moved to different satellite who knows how many months or years from now or pay for a second dish to get the HD channels from the 61.9 satellite - a burdensome and difficult situation for me. BTW, my location is the NW suburbs of Minneapolis, MN.

Any positive or helpful solutions via response to this post or via personal message will be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

 

[Van]

Only thing you can do is

(A) live with it

(B) wait for the channels to be moved

(C) get a diferent provider and cut your losses while you can

 

[delos]

Has anyone in the PNW tried this?

I don't know if this will help anyone out there but I tried something that works for my situation.

First of all I have a dish 1000 but it is only used for the 129 sat and I have it peaked for the 129 sat. Second of all I have it on a pole and it is run into the dish 500 on a pole that is peaked for the 110/119 sats. I get in the 100s on the dish 500 on both sats , except some spotbeams of course.

I put a inline signal amplifier ( rca at Radio shack and Monster.com has them too) that is supposed to increase your signal strength by up to 13dB to 18 dB , on to my dish 1000 only. I am in a trailer and the lines from the dishes are about 50' - 60' from the receiver in the main room. So this situation works for me. The shorter the run the less chance that this will help.

.

I have the same equipment on the roof but the 500 is pointed at 61.5 and is now disconnected. I like this idea, anyone else done it this way? I wonder if the amp is necessary?

 

[webbydude]

I have to wonder about the usage of the amp as well. If the incoming signal is weak and fluctuating, how would the amp help? Isn't it a case of "garbage in, garbage out"?

 

[Van]

The amp wont make any diference unless the dish is past a 300 ft range and in the posters instance 50 - 60 ft it will do little for him. Idealy the best solution from what I am hearing here and other locations is a larger dish such as a 1 meter dish or to point a 20 incher at 61.5 and just forgoe the hd lil off dish and use an antenna to get the locals in hd.

 

[MikeD-C05]

I Kind of thought that, but the instructions said that for long runs that are up to 80 ' or longer that it would make a difference. I tried it and when I first got it installed I noticed that the dish readings were up in the high 80s and the low 90s so I thought this was due to the signal amplifier I attached. It might not do anything I will take it off tomorrow and see if my signal strengths go below the posted low signals I posted earlier in this thread. IF it doesn't change then I know that the signal amp doesn't work. I might have tested the signal strengths when the satellite was at it highest in signal readings , when I first attached the inline signal amp. When I tested it later the signals had dropped back to the 75 - 80 range. IT goes up and down depending on the time of day due to the satellite having to readjust and fire the thrusters to keep it over the same geosynchronized spot. I will post tommorrow if I have time and let ya'll know if it makes any difference.

 

[MikeD-C05]

Well I took the amp off and I get the following readings on my transponders.

First with the amp at 7:10am central time
1 82
2 79
3 78
4 77
5 81
6 77
7 78
8 75
9 90
10 75
11 77
12 90
13 92
14 80
16 91
17 81
18 80
19 78
20 81
22 77
23 81
26 79
27 80
30 80
31 86

After the amp was removed at 07:30 am central time

1 81
2 78
3 78
4 75
5 80
6 75
7 78
8 75
9 89
10 74
11 76
12 90
13 91
14 80
16 89
17 78
18 78
19 77
20 83
22 75
23 81
26 76
27 79
30 79
31 84

So the signal did go down on the transponders but I can't determine if this is because of the amp being removed or because it is part of the natural spiking and dropping of the satellite strengths due to the wobbly orbit of the 129 sat.

So in the end I can't really recommend or tell you not to add an amp to your sat line . It was just an experiment to see if I could get stronger sat strengths. I am going to hope that the dish 1000.02 solves the problem. It is supposed to be large by up to 3 inches and the mast of the arm is further away . Maybe this will give us all stronger strengths on all 3 sats and we can go back to a single dish solution for all three sats.

 

[Van]

Im wondering if the actual concave of the D1000 has a design flaw that contributes to the poor signal quality as well.

 

[bhelms]

Adding a quality amp should increase signal strength in any situation. Whether that makes any difference to the receiver depends on a number of factors. Remember that the RF signals themselves are "analog" in the sense that they are continously varying in strength due to several contributors, and add to that the natural "noise" in the spectrum. As webbydude noted, garbage in, garbage out. However, a quality amp can help overcome some of those issues. Digital receivers need some minimum strength, relatively free of inteference, to lock the signals reliably. Adding an amp that increases the signal strength SHOULD help that situation. The amp needs to be a quality unit that does not add much noise or distortion itself (ideally both would be zero) or it may contribute to the problem rather than help it. How good are these low-cost commercially-available units? I'm not convinced that the signal meters in the receivers give a reliable indication of relative strength. A spectrum analyzer would be the best way to quantify what's happening, and the analyzer could also give a good indication of how much an amp is improving or hurting the signal.

In MikeD-C05's case I believe the amp is indeed increasing the signal strength, but as he noted the results are probably confounded by the time lag between the readings when natural variation in the signal may be adding or subtracting more than what the amp can contrubute. YMMV...

 

[RandallA]

Amps do help only if the distance exceeds 150-200 ft. If you place an amp at 100 ft or less, the amp will over drive the switch or receiver.

For example, let's say you have a DP Twin and a DP34 switch. The DP Twin puts out an average of -36 dBm. When you place an in-line amp (20 dBm gain) between the LNB and the switch at 100 ft (avg. loss of 10 dBm) that will increase the signal level to -26 dBm (-36+20-10). The minimun safe input for a DP34 switch is -31 dBM. So in this case you will over drive the switch.

In the same example, if you place the amp at 150 ft. the input level at the DP34 switch will be -31 dBm. (assuming 15 dBm loss for the cable). So an amp will over drive a switch or receiver at distances less than 150 ft. Ideally, you want to use them at distances over 200 ft. to avoid over driving the receiver or switch.

BTW, I'm using in-line amplifiers at 100 ft. but I also have 6 dBM attenuators just before the DP34 switch and after the in-line amp. My receivers are located between 75-100 ft so I'm within the 200 ft. but just wanted to make sure that I wouldn't have a problem with voltage or signal loss. I also know that I don't need them but just wanted to experiment.

Here is an excellent document on how all this work:

http://www.sonoradesign.com/tipsAndTricksPages/DiskPro/DiskPro_01.html

I'm also attaching my old configuration, the only thing that's changed are the receivers.

 

[farmsatguy]

The real b*tch of the problem for some of us installers goes beyond customers wanting HD programming. I've been a subcontractor for about 7 years for Dish in the Richmond VA DMA. Unfortunately, here our locals were moved from one lower powered sat (105) to one that has more problems than not (129), which has a life expectancy of less than 40 months now. Most markets are now enjoying the 110's power for their SD locals, but we're not one of them. So, we are just being beat down with bullsh*t chargebacks on so many jobs (because the D1000 is our standard install now just to get the 7 local channels) knowing their is nothing we can do about it...I've taken the position of telling customers, as delicately as I can, that they can expect these problems until Dish finally fixes yet another MAJOR problem. From the best tech to the worst, we are all being affected by this here. And advanced tech support is too scared to tell the customers that, yes, we know this a problem, but instead generate a TC just to rip us off from the money we make. For me, as a customer and an installer, it hurts any way I go. Great, yet another series of Dish's to play with - I have no interest in these unless they a) really work and b) Dish let's us upgrade existing customers experiencing problems for at no charge to the customer. As I said, it is a major problem here because we NEED the D1000 just to get locals, forget about HD problems. Hell, I have a Super Dish skewed at 90 and hitting 129 only just to give it the additional surface area needed to get a reliable signal. People, please continue to complain as musch as it takes to get the problem not only addressed, but fixed...but please don't throw us (installers) who really do care about the work we do under the bus in the process - we want it fixed as much (maybe even more) as anyone out there.

 

[RandallA]

"People, please continue to complain as musch as it takes to get the problem not only addressed, but fixed...but please don't throw us (installers) who really do care about the work we do under the bus in the process - we want it fixed as much (maybe even more) as anyone out there."

Believe me, most of the members here at Satelliteguys.us and the "other" forum know that the problem is with the satellite itself (E5). It's a piece of junk and E* needs to address the problem that is affecting customers and installers like you stated.

 

[ralfyguy]

Im wondering if the actual concave of the D1000 has a design flaw that contributes to the poor signal quality as well.

Well that would explain the lower readings on 110 compared to 119 also. I never heard of a D1000 setup where the 110 readings were as high as the 119 readings, ESPECIALLY when trying to get a half way acceptable 129 reading.

 

[dnsguy]

I have the same equipment on the roof but the 500 is pointed at 61.5 and is now disconnected. I like this idea, anyone else done it this way? I wonder if the amp is necessary?

We have tried peaking the 1000 on the 129 and it didn't make much of a diff. the dish is only wider it needs to be a bigger dish all around to really matter. We haven't tried line amps because dish doesn't supp;y them.

What we are doing now and it works is to put up 24 inch dish's but those are limited and are going to repeat trouble calls only for now.