Zero Quality Signal--Have tried everything I can

[TryingMyBest]

No Luck with motor and True South satellite

Hi all. Again, thank you to everybody for graciously sharing their time and knowledge. I took 2 days to study all the prior posts, and re-read the great treatise published by AcWxRadar. Here is what happened:

I mounted the motor, making sure everything was aligned and plumb. I then sought out SatMex5, my True South satellite. I had a friend on walkie talkie monitor the signal, and I had an analog satellite meter with me. OK, so I set the proper dish elevation using my newly acquired inclinometer (thank you Freezy !) , using information I obtained on Dishpointer.com, and adjusting as per the web site for measured elevation. I used landmarks on Dishpointer to aim, and I also marked off 97 West as a reference point (since I had acquired that without the motor). I triple checked all the caveats about the motor pole being centered, the mast being perfectly plumb (it is), etc. The satellite finder hummed, then rose to a loud pitch, and I adjusted accordingly. No signal quality was ever found on SatMex 5 (I used the transponders recommended on "The List", and also did blind scans). Well OK I thought, where am I? I must be close. So I looked at the about 10 satellites East and West of where I thought I was (168 magnetic), and , nothing ! I could not believe it. This went on for about half a day.

So here is what I did: I took the whole assembly, all poles lined up (as if aiming for True South), centered (manually) at zero, and pointed it to 97 West, which I knew I could find. And, voila, no problem at all--98 signal quality on some transponders. I was also able to move the dish, at the same elevation, and get 99 West (CBS and Fox feeds). So that is where I am now.
Questions are:
(1) What happens now? Is what I have done of any use at all?

(2) Can somebody please explain the "motor" settings on the menu?
I am now using the SonicView 360 Elite, and here is an overview
"MOTOR" has 3 options;
[A] Disable
"Motor"
---> "Step size" (Continuous, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5)
---> "Move" (Stop, Drive East, drive West)

[C] USALS
---> Step size
---> Move

I had to disable the motor settings, because when I had channels on 97 West, and merely wanted to check the channels on 99 West, the motor moved a huge distance, and I don't know why. All I did was click on a channel from 99 West, and it moved. Why would it do that?

(3) Should I be using "set as reference" on 97 West, by clicking the red button?

(4) While watching Youtube, there was a good video of a guy setting up a remote satellite, and he mounted 2 LNB's to the same regular looking dish, to acquire 110 West and 119 West. This did not make sense to me, as I thought the dish had to be pointed right at a specific satellite, and those seem rather far apart. How is the possible on a regular , rather small dish (discarded Direct TV dish)?

(4B) More relevant, can I get away with doing this? I am pointed to 97 West as of now, as if it were my true south (which it isn't). Can I somehow mount a second LNB and get the nearby satellite, 99 West? If so, please explain how to do this.

That is it for the technical side. A few asides are below. Thank you all again, immensely.

Aside 1: I do seriously think a few of you should get together and publish some of this. It need not go through a fancy editor. For example, at one time, I had an interest in learning to make bread, and there was a fellow on Amazon that had a pamphlet he self-published for $3. I only mention this because this information is so valuable, and honestly, I do feel somewhat guilty consuming so much of people's time, and wish I could give back in some way.

Aside 2: Anybody want to know what is on a CBS Newsfeed on a Saturday afternoon? Randall Pinkston, staring down at a cue card, looks up and says: Tease 1 (pause) "Tiger Woods takes the lead at the Masters"
5 second pause, looks at cue card: "Tease 2: Tiger Woods shares the lead in the Masters".
Pause again, looks down: "Tease 3: Tiger Woods struggles to catch the leaders at the Masters"....and then, 5 second pause.."Tease 4: Tiger Woods has a TERRIBLE day at the Masters !!!"
This my friends is better than any comedy you will see on pay TV. What, you expect an important newsman to actually wait around and see what really happened before reporting it? On a Saturday?!?!

 

[TryingMyBest]

Forgot to mention--I did skew the LNB

when pointing to 97 West with the motor. Everything else, though, is perfectly aligned, as if I were pointing to the True South satellite.

Multi LNB: here is the video I saw
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJKBSY0AQEY&feature=related]YouTube - Adding 110 LNB to existing 30" dish[/ame]

 

[AcWxRadar]

Hi all.

So here is what I did: I took the whole assembly, all poles lined up (as if aiming for True South), centered (manually) at zero, and pointed it to 97 West, which I knew I could find. And, voila, no problem at all--98 signal quality on some transponders. I was also able to move the dish, at the same elevation, and get 99 West (CBS and Fox feeds). So that is where I am now.

Questions are:
(1) What happens now? Is what I have done of any use at all?

I will address this last, in a second reply. Please allow me to catch the easier items here first.

(2) Can somebody please explain the "motor" settings on the menu?
I am now using the SonicView 360 Elite, and here is an overview
"MOTOR" has 3 options;

[A] Disable <- MOTOR DRIVE IS DISABLED (akin to using the setup as a fixed point dish) If you select a satellite in your list to have the motor setting "DISABLE" then whereever your dish happens to be pointing when you select this satellite, it will simply remain there. If the last satellite you were viewing was 63.0°W and you switched to 89.0°W (and for which you have selected a motor settting of DISABLE) then the dish will remain pointing at the 63.0°W position. Not a beneficial attribute for a motorized system.

"Motor" <- DiSEqC 1.2 MOTOR CONTROL is ENABLED

---> "Step size" (Continuous, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5) <- This selects the manual control movement (move east or move west) step size. CONTINUOUS = motor keeps moving west if you press MOVE WEST until you press STOP. 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5 means the motor will move west a distance of 0.2 degree, 0.5 degree, 1.0 degree, 2.0 degrees or 4.0 degrees and stop when that amount of motion has been reached. The actual numbers of degrees that I stated here are solely for examples. I just made them up to simply give you an idea that a step size of 1 is much smaller than a step size of 5.

---> "Move" (Stop, Drive East, drive West) <- Manual commands you can use to move the dish using the remote in the setup menu to locate a satellite position. Usually, press the < and > buttons on the REMOTE to correspond to MOVE EAST or MOVE WEST and press the OK button to STOP. The scheme of which buttons on the remote do what may vary, so refer to the manual for your specific receiver or just use a trial and error experimentation to figure it out.

[C] USALS <- Enables USALS motor control for the specific satellite that you have selected to set up.

---> Step size <-
---> Move <------ Both of these options (STEP SIZE and MOVE) I am uncertain of. You normally wouldn't use these commands with USALS and wouldn't see them in the menu (maybe they are present in your menus, but actually disabled).

I had to disable the motor settings, because when I had channels on 97 West, and merely wanted to check the channels on 99 West, the motor moved a huge distance, and I don't know why. All I did was click on a channel from 99 West, and it moved. Why would it do that?

It is supposed to move a little. 97 and 99 are two degrees apart, so the motor should move the dish 2 degrees. If it moves an EXTREME amount, then this might be the problem that I forewarned you about regarding my experience with the SONICVIEW 360.

(3) Should I be using "set as reference" on 97 West, by clicking the red button?

NO. Since 97.0°W is NOT your true south satellite, you do not want to use it as your reference. You want to do that with 116.8°W SatMex 5.

(4) While watching Youtube, there was a good video of a guy setting up a remote satellite, and he mounted 2 LNB's to the same regular looking dish, to acquire 110 West and 119 West. This did not make sense to me, as I thought the dish had to be pointed right at a specific satellite, and those seem rather far apart. How is the possible on a regular , rather small dish (discarded Direct TV dish)?

In this case, we are talking about two totally different satellite transmission types. Linear (97W, 99W, 101W etc) and CIRCULAR (110W and 119W). 110W and 119W can be picked up on the same dish, even though they are spaced 9 degrees apart due to the transmission type and higher power level. With linear satellites like 97 and 99, they broadcast with lower power and the polarization scheme requires the LNBFs to have a more "definitive" focal point. The LNBFs must be set much closer together to get two adjacent linear satellites (which can be a minimum of 2 degrees apart) on the same dish unless you incorporate some elaborate mounting strategies for mounting the LNBFs. I don't know if what I am saying here is painting a proper picture, but maybe someone will help me explain it better.

(4B) More relevant, can I get away with doing this? I am pointed to 97 West as of now, as if it were my true south (which it isn't). Can I somehow mount a second LNB and get the nearby satellite, 99 West? If so, please explain how to do this.

First of all, since you are setting up a motorized system, you would have no need to do this. Secondly, I think that it would be cumbersome, awkward and possibly not very practical or possible depending upon the physical dimensions of your LNBFs. You would have to place them side by side and there may not be room enough to get their focal points that close to eachother. With the circular sats 110 and 119 you have 9 degrees to play with instead of 2 degrees, so you see the difference there. Third, it will become confusing when using a motorized dish. It is possible, but it is more of a project for a FIXED point dish, not a motorized one. Others do this to be able to capture C-Band and Ku-Band signals on the same dish or two adjacent satellites in the Ku-band, but it requires some planning and strategies.

Thank you all again, immensely.

You are most welcome! Hope the above information will help you understand some more of this stuff.

RADAR

 

[AcWxRadar]

Hi all. Again, thank you to everybody for graciously sharing their time and knowledge. I took 2 days to study all the prior posts, and re-read the great treatise published by AcWxRadar. Here is what happened:

I mounted the motor, making sure everything was aligned and plumb. I then sought out SatMex5, my True South satellite. I had a friend on walkie talkie monitor the signal, and I had an analog satellite meter with me. OK, so I set the proper dish elevation using my newly acquired inclinometer (thank you Freezy !) , using information I obtained on Dishpointer.com, and adjusting as per the web site for measured elevation. I used landmarks on Dishpointer to aim, and I also marked off 97 West as a reference point (since I had acquired that without the motor). I triple checked all the caveats about the motor pole being centered, the mast being perfectly plumb (it is), etc. The satellite finder hummed, then rose to a loud pitch, and I adjusted accordingly. No signal quality was ever found on SatMex 5 (I used the transponders recommended on "The List", and also did blind scans). Well OK I thought, where am I? I must be close. So I looked at the about 10 satellites East and West of where I thought I was (168 magnetic), and , nothing ! I could not believe it. This went on for about half a day.

So here is what I did: I took the whole assembly, all poles lined up (as if aiming for True South), centered (manually) at zero, and pointed it to 97 West, which I knew I could find. And, voila, no problem at all--98 signal quality on some transponders. I was also able to move the dish, at the same elevation, and get 99 West (CBS and Fox feeds). So that is where I am now.

TryingMyBest,

I had assumed that you were going to try the suggestion to remove your motor and install your dish on the mast as a fixed point dish and then search for 116.8°W (SatMex 5) so that you could determine your optimum dish elevation angle and your optimum azimuth angle for your nearest true south satellite. Then, transpose that information to your motorized system.

I highly recommend this procedure for you as it will make your task much more simple.

Use the TPs for 116.8°W that I posted and install your dish on your mast without the motor. Point as near true south as you can and rotate the dish back and forth east and west with the dish elevation angle set to what I also posted in an earlier reply. Then readjust the dish elevation angle within a +/- 5 (or up to a +/- 8) degree window from that recommended dish elevation and repeat panning the dish back and forth (east and west) while monitoring the signal from one of those TPs that I recommended on 116.8.

Hopefully, you will find a signal on the firststage of this "panning" excerise, but if not, you will have to be patient and try various dish elevation settings until you lock onto something. Then verify that it is the signal from 116.8°W that you were looking for and not some adjacent satellite.

Review my previous replies and others for all other suggestions.

What happens now? Is what I have done of any use at all?

Well, yes. What you have done to achieve signal reception from 97.0° (and 99.0°W) tells you and us that you have your LNBF type, frequency and other similar settings correctly programmed for linear satellites and that your receiver and LNBF and cables are functioning properly. So, basically, everything is working and you are setting up your menu parameters correctly (at least for 97W).

What you don't have going for you at this time is a proper alignment of your motorized system. You really need to focus on and seek out SatMex 5 @ 116.8°W. This is going to be your greatest advantage to find this sat! Trust me on this, you are very fortunate to have your actual site longitude line up so closely to a usable satellite. I know there aren't many channels there like on 97.0°W, but the fact that it is so close to your longitude makes you lucky.

RADAR

 

[stanleyjohn]

I am following this thread closely!receiver should be here soon and hopefully all this great help all are giving Tryingmybest will make my job of getting my set up going a fairly easy one.PS Tryingmybest you couldnt be in better hands!Great site with good people willing to help.

 

[AcWxRadar]

TryingMyBest,

Here is another item that we had better discuss before you get too far involved in searching out SatMex 5 at 116.8°W.

Are there any trees or tall buildings or other obstructions that could possibly block your LOS (direct Line Of Sight) for this bird? No one has discussed this issue with you yet, as far as I recall.

Check this possibility. If you have now purchased an inclinometer, use it.

Go out to your dish and stand very close to it with your head about the same level as the dish. Raise your arm like a nazi salute (please excuse the reference) so that your hand and fingers and arm are straight in line and hold the inclinometer on the bicep of your arm.

Face in the general direction of true south (116.8°W) and raise and lower your arm while keeping your eyes focused upon your fingertips. Aim your fingertips at the top of any tree line or building or other obstruction and (with the inclinometer held on your bicep) read the angle.

If the angle is less than 25 degrees, you will have no worries. If it is greater than 50 degrees, there is probably a definite LOS problem. If it is somewhere between 25 and 50 degrees, we should take a closer look at this.

I am merely suggesting these angle limits as arbitrary (minimum and maximum) references for starting point limits for your TRUE SOUTH satellite. We would have to do some calculations to be certain and satellites much further to your east or west are going to be much lower in the sky so the angles will change for them.

RADAR

 

[avg1joe]

Do you have a clear line of sight or are there trees in the way?

Page 2. Still waiting for an answer.

 

[TryingMyBest]

Answers to your questions

Hello AcWxRadar, and thank you for your time and help. I will answer your questions first:
(1) Yes, I did indeed have the motor OFF while first attempting to get SatMex5. The motor was already off since I first found 97 West. I left out the small details in the original post, sorry.
What happened though, was the same as what happened with the motor on: I carefully pointed and aimed the dish, and the sat finder came to life, as it did for all the other satellites I previously found. Now here is where I get frustrated: If the satfinder is humming, shouldn't I be able to figure out what satellite I am pointed at? I tried every transponder for 10 satellites plus and minus from where I thought I was pointed (SatMex5), including blind scans, and got nothing on anything. What is the explanation for that?

(2) Line of sight: The rooftop is on a gently sloping downward hill, so there is nothing in front of the dish. Moreover, the dish is on a pole, and would only hit an object/tree if had no elevation at all. I did not get up to the roof today to try your method, but will confirm in a few days when I am able to get back up. I will say that I did a careful site survey before putting the pole in. Given the downslope in the hill and the roof plus pole height, I can say with fairly certain confidence there is no obstacle. I will also say with absolute certainty that given the terrain, if I can get 97 West, there is nothing blocking me from SatMex 5.

(3) SatMex 5--several people posted that I should go to "The List", and find a strong transponder, which I did . Phottoman suggested it, and then told me to do a blind scan, which I did repeatedly. I did compare the TP's Radar suggested
(12024, 12059, 12175) but didn't see them listed as strong transponders. And honestly, I thought that doing a blind scan would pick up everything anyway? Is my logic incorrect regarding a blind scan?

While on that topic, can you please explain what are the numbers and letters following each transponder? (like SR 3000)?

(4) OK, lets fast forward. Lets say I do somehow find SatMex 5. Then what? What do I have to tell the receiver, and how do I do that?

I don't want to totally impugn the Sonicview for that huge move when going from 97 to 99 W--I may have set something improperly, or it may have thought it was at SatMex5, who knows?

I have to confess that just as I start to feel "OK , I can do this", I become even more confused by terms I did not know. For example, I did not know about different satellite types and strengths, as Radar mentioned in replying to the LNB question. I had started reading a few web sites on multiple LNB's and none mentioned different satellite types. What is a circular sat, and how does one know what type of sat it is? Is that what "R/V" means?

Honestly, I am a self starter and understand I need to do my own work, but I am taken aback by how little organized information there is on this topic. Every time I post, I think to myself that I am surely asking a question that is so basic that it has been asked a thousand times before. I am grateful for everybody's time and help, and just wish I could learn more on my own.

 

[Ironsides]

TMB

TMB, this maybe something to consider, often times I forget to check my settings in my Receiver. I will go in to the setting pick blind scan and opps no transponders found. Even though My meter shows I have a strong signal.

Your receiver comes with a list of satellites, while it may not be a complete list is does have several in most cases you can use. Later you can manually add new satellites.

Going back to the settings, your LNB settings must be put in the receiver for each satellite. Often I forget to make sure I have correctly setup the lnb for the satellite I am looking for.

In my receiver, I have a list of satellites, then I have settings for that satellite. I have to tell it to turn on LNB power, I have to tell it what type of lnb and then tell it the LOF of the lnb or frequency as some receivers list that. I have to tell it if I am using any diseqc switches...That is for EACH satellite.

You couldn't imagine how many times I have forgot to set that and came up with nothing on Blind Scan. One thing I often do now when I have a new receiver is go through my satellite list and pick out every satellite that will work with my lnb type and go ahead and set all the settings it requires.

You asked about Circular, that just means HOW the Satellite Sends the signal down to your dish. Another words What pattern or Beam it uses. Circular sends a signal that looks like a screw or similar if you imagine that. The lnbf sees it by picking the LEFT or RIGHT side of the signal sort of without getting really technical. L/R polarity

Linear just means the satellite sends down a vertical or horizontal pattern..the lnbf sees it as a Vertical or Horizontal pattern.... H/V polarity

That's a real basic example for you to imagine...

You're making progress so just take your time. You are learning some I can see that by the questions your asking. Don't give up!

 

[McGuyver]

TMB, My true south is 117.8W and I use 116.8W also (only 1° degree apart) and I had similar problems finding it when setting up motors but I eventually did. Satmex 5 doesn't have much FTA signals good for aiming but HughesNet has good signals you can use for aiming purposes only, try using this: 11739 V 29981 auto, this one currently shows 84% Quality signal on my Coolsat as I type this. It should be a consistant TP because it's a High Speed Internet feed.

 

[Phottoman]

McGuyver left out one small thing.

You won't be about to download anything from the transponder he mentioned, but you **should be able** to see the transponder, you should get both S and Q readings from that transponder. Once you do, lock everything down so nothing moves, but not so tight that you dent your pole or motor mount.

Then do your blind scan.

Blind scanning that satellite will lock it into your system's memory so that if you are using USALS, the motor will know where it is, and should be able to find other satellites from there.

You're doing great, don't give up. Believe it or not, we ALL went through this same thing the first time we set up a motor driven dish.

Phottoman

 

[McGuyver]

I knew we could rely on you Phottoman! Thanks Bro

 

[avg1joe]

Is the sonicview new, used or refurbished? What firmware (software) are you running on it? Has it ever had hackware on it? Are you receiving any errors on screen? Dish Network is disabling sonicview boxes that have ever had hack firmware on them even if the boxes are currently reformed. This might have something to do with your trouble.

 

[AcWxRadar]

TMB, My true south is 117.8W and I use 116.8W also (only 1° degree apart) and I had similar problems finding it when setting up motors but I eventually did. Satmex 5 doesn't have much FTA signals good for aiming but HughesNet has good signals you can use for aiming purposes only, try using this: 11739 V 29981 auto, this one currently shows 84% Quality signal on my Coolsat as I type this. It should be a consistant TP because it's a High Speed Internet feed.

McGuyver left out one small thing.

You won't be about to download anything from the transponder he mentioned, but you **should be able** to see the transponder, you should get both S and Q readings from that transponder. Once you do, lock everything down so nothing moves, but not so tight that you dent your pole or motor mount.

Then do your blind scan.

Blind scanning that satellite will lock it into your system's memory so that if you are using USALS, the motor will know where it is, and should be able to find other satellites from there.

You're doing great, don't give up. Believe it or not, we ALL went through this same thing the first time we set up a motor driven dish.

Phottoman

This is an excellent idea and a very helpful practice... Using the DATA feed (high speed internet) signals to help you aim your dish and motor. These signals are consistent (almost always present) and strong.

There is one possible problem with it, however. Some of these signals have a specific BEAM or footprint pattern. Meaning that if there are several transponders on one satellite devoted to HughesNet, they may not all be detectable from one location. Each transponder might be beamed at a different area of the country. i.e. southwest, northwest, south central, north central, southeast, northeast, etc. for examples. I know that it is this way for WildBlue satellite internet. Therefore, you need to be aware that not every DATA transponder listed on Lyngsat is going to work for you at your specific location.

The one available on SatMex 5 (the one McGuyver mentioned) is much stronger then any of the other transponder signals that I can detect from my location (Omaha, NE).

11739 Vertical 29981 SR HughesNet = 69% quality (AZBox receiver reading)

12059 Vertical 3078 SR Televida Abudante = 40% quality (AZBox)

12175 Horizontal 12175 SR BYU TV / Latin America = 34% quality (AZBox)

12024 Horizontal 3000 SR ESNE TV = 29% quality (AZBox)

I mentioned the transponders that I did, whether or not they are included in "The List" because they are the ones that I can CONFIRM from my specific location to be active (and not a feed channel which may be sporadically broadcasting).

When you scan a DATA transponder (like 11739) you won't log in any channels as Phottoman stated. But, the advantage is in the stronger signal power, which makes detecting these TPs easier than most others. Hence, as you are panning your dish around searching for a signal, your receiver might pick up and lock onto these signals easier and quicker.

RADAR

 

[AcWxRadar]

Hello AcWxRadar, and thank you for your time and help.

While on that topic, can you please explain what are the numbers and letters following each transponder? (like SR 3000)?

You are welcome TMB!

SR is Symbol Rate. It is, in basic layman's terms, the speed at which the audio and video data packets are transmitted. Akin to the BAUD rate for computers, but more involved than that. It is a measure of how fast the data is transmitted, a little like comparing DSL to dial up internet speeds.

It is sufficient to understand that they are sending (transmitting) data packets or chunks of information at a certain speed. i.e. So many "symbols" per second (usually expressed like 3000 Ks/s = 3000 KiloSymbols per second or 3.000 Ms/s).

The APID and VPID and PCID or PCRID are identifiers. APID has to deal with the audio portion of the transmitted signal, VPID with the video and PCID/PCR ID is like a "clocking" signal to sync up the VPID and APID information. The VPID and the PCID/PCRID are often the same.

You really don't need to get too technically involved in the exact theory of all these parameters, at least not for your purposes at this time.

You'll get acquainted better with these parametes as you progress in FTA exposure. Ah, look at that... you just experienced some more exposure!

RADAR

 

[AcWxRadar]

Hello AcWxRadar, and thank you for your time and help. I will answer your questions first:

(1) Yes, I did indeed have the motor OFF while first attempting to get SatMex5. The motor was already off since I first found 97 West. I left out the small details in the original post, sorry.

What happened though, was the same as what happened with the motor on: I carefully pointed and aimed the dish, and the sat finder came to life, as it did for all the other satellites I previously found. Now here is where I get frustrated: If the satfinder is humming, shouldn't I be able to figure out what satellite I am pointed at? [Yes, but there is more to it.] I tried every transponder for 10 satellites plus and minus from where I thought I was pointed (SatMex5), including blind scans, and got nothing on anything. What is the explanation for that?

There are several items that I would like to cover with you regarding this question. Some of my ideas will not make you happy at this time. So, prepare yourself.

Using a signal finder meter (one of those little analog meters that has a needle and tone and maybe an LED that flashes at you when you hit a signal) are fine and dandy, but they are essentially nothing more than what we used to refer to as "idiot lights" on the dash of your car. They say "check engine"... Ok, check engine for WHAT? These external signal meters provide the same scope of information. They inform you that something exists, but don't give you any good clues as to what it is. You could be aimed at a satellite that has nothing but encrypted signals on it or signals which are incompatible with your receiver. Sure, you are aimed at a satellite, but your receiver cannot process the signal, so nothing shows up. The external meter simply detects an electrical current from the LNBF. Like a metal detector... It beeps at you, but you may dig in the sand and find a pop-top from a beverage can or an old key. But, no lost Rolex.

Also, from my own experience with the SonicView 360 receiver, I would not rely too much upon it for motor control and sat finding with a motor. I had such a horrid time with mine. My dish and motor were already aligned and I could track the entire Clarke Belt just fine with my Coolsat 5000 (and other receivers). However, the SV 360 couldn't even handle driving an already aligned dish to the proper position.

If the motor and dish were aligned at a specific sat and I disabled (bypassed the motor) the SV 360 was still lacking in scanning capabilities. It could scan the encrypted DN and Bell stuff great! But when it came to FTA linear signals, it did not pick up everything that I knew to be there.

I developed an opinion of the SV 360 that was not a good one. I did not purchase this box, it was sent to me as a beta test project (please evaluate this receiver) and I had nothing good to say about it at all. In fact, I think I learned some new curse words in the testing process.

I really do not like to try to disuade you on your SV 360, but I absolutely do not want your first impression of a FTA receiver and setup to be a poor one. I just have a suspicion that the SV 360 may not be the best receiver to start out with.

I am going to recommend something to you at this point. I want you to go to E-Bay and look for a Coolsat 5000 or a Coolsat 6000 receiver and buy one and play with it. Get one for under $50 and just repeat everything that you have been doing with that receiver and see if you find a difference.

(2) Line of sight: The rooftop is on a gently sloping downward hill, so there is nothing in front of the dish. Moreover, the dish is on a pole, and would only hit an object/tree if had no elevation at all. I did not get up to the roof today to try your method, but will confirm in a few days when I am able to get back up. I will say that I did a careful site survey before putting the pole in. Given the downslope in the hill and the roof plus pole height, I can say with fairly certain confidence there is no obstacle. I will also say with absolute certainty that given the terrain, if I can get 97 West, there is nothing blocking me from SatMex 5.

This is excellent for you, then. I just wanted to be certain of this and I couldn't recall if it had been addressed.

(3) SatMex 5--several people posted that I should go to "The List", and find a strong transponder, which I did . Phottoman suggested it, and then told me to do a blind scan, which I did repeatedly. I did compare the TP's Radar suggested
(12024, 12059, 12175) but didn't see them listed as strong transponders. And honestly, I thought that doing a blind scan would pick up everything anyway? Is my logic incorrect regarding a blind scan?

Back to the issue of the SV 360. I am not sure how well the BS feature works on the SV. If anyone else has more experience with this receiver (that is positive) please jump in and provide some tips.

Honestly, I am a self starter and understand I need to do my own work, but I am taken aback by how little organized information there is on this topic. Every time I post, I think to myself that I am surely asking a question that is so basic that it has been asked a thousand times before. I am grateful for everybody's time and help, and just wish I could learn more on my own.

You are doing very well, even though your results thus far are not positive. As Phottoman said, everyone of us were in your position at one time. That is why we like to help you and others in the same situation. Everyone here wants you to succeed. Then, you can take the information and pass it along to others just the same.

TMB,

I have run out of time for today, sorry. Keep trying, please. You just have to clear a couple of hurdles and it will start falling into place for you.

RADAR

 

[Conky]

If you're using a small signal finder out at the dish, make sure the gain knob isnt turned all the the way up. It should only make a sound when you're on a satellite . pressure on the dish should stop the squealing like in this video [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rC5wu49VLRg]YouTube - Perfect satellite dish alignment with a meter[/ame] It will also give a loud signal when you're on a Dish Network (ie circular) satellite

Something that helped me once I was able to find 1 satellite (which was also 97w)was using some basic math.

I measured the outside diameter of my pipe(in mm to make things easier and more precise) then multiplied by pi(3.14)then divided by 360 to give me a mm/degree number. I made a thin marker line on the pipe where 97w was. Then when I wanted to find a satellite, I would take the degree differece between them (eg 116.8-97=19.8)and multiply that by my mm/degree number to give me x number of millimeters to measure from the sharpie mark I'd made . Then I'd make a new mark at the distance calculated using a cheap dollar store measuring tape wrapped around the pole. Usually got me in the ballpark azimuth wise

 

[TryingMyBest]

Update and thank you--One last important question

Firstly, thank you all again for your time and shared knowledge, all immensely useful. The weather here has turned rather nasty, with thunderstorms
last night through the day today. I lost my signal on 97 West, which was at Quality of 99. It has been overcast all day, and more of the same is predicted
for this week (at least cloudwise). Given all that, I might not be able to get much done this week (my signal is still down).

I want to address what individuals wrote, but first, I want to ask my most important question, in very basic terms.
Let's fast forward into the future, and assume I locate SatMex5. What specifically do I do then--do I need to push some button on the remote to "set" this to something? OR, if I find SatMex5, with my motor pointed at zero, am I done? Will USALS automatically
know and take me to every other satellite? (Related: how do I get the motor EXACTLY on zero?)

Please give a concrete example. For example: You're on SatMex5, and you want to go to 99 West, you do this and this......

Related to this, can somebody please explain in simple terms what is happening once I get the motor, at zero degrees, pointed at my True South satellite? What does the system "think" and do?

If I can understand that, I think I will be good to go.

Now to some specifics:
(1) Are we in agreement that I should go for McGuyver's excellent idea of 11739 V 29981 auto (on SatMex5)?
Should I also use Phottoman's TP's?
11739 Vertical 29981 SR HughesNet = 69% quality (AZBox receiver reading)
12059 Vertical 3078 SR Televida Abudante = 40% quality (AZBox)
12175 Horizontal 12175 SR BYU TV / Latin America = 34% quality (AZBox)
12024 Horizontal 3000 SR ESNE TV = 29% quality (AZBox)

Thank you both for that information.

(2) To Phottoman: What exactly does a blind scan do? I thought (assumed) it just scanned every TP, listed or not. You state
"Blind scanning that satellite will lock it into your system's memory so that if you are using USALS, the motor will know where it is, and should be able to find other satellites from there."
Can you elaborate on that? Specifically, lets say I do a blind scan on a satellite when I am NOT focused/pointed on that satellite. Have I now confused the system by giving it an incorrect position?

(3) To Radar--thank you so much for all the time and effort you have put into this.
I have been using the analog sat finder exactly the way Conky's video shows. Are you advising I should not bother using it anymore? How else would I know when I am ballpark--just watch the screen?

Regarding posts on the Sonicview, somebody asked if they are new. Yes, the Premier was purchased from GoSatellite, and the Elite from Amazon. None are what are called clones.
Both manufactured July 2009
"Boot loader" 01.00
Main software 02. 07

Radar, thank you for the warning on SonicView. I don't want to give up on it yet, simply because given that I did not know what I am doing, who knows what buttons I hit. I may be to blame. But if I get everything perfect and still have a problem, I will know the reason and get the Coolsat.
That is why my primary question is so important--so that I can understand what is supposed to happen, and what I need to do , once I locate SatMex5

(3B) You mentioned linear vs circular satellites being a factor in whether a 2nd lnb can be added to one dish. How does one know what type of satellite
it is? I don't see any hint in Lyngsat.

(3C) Regarding your advice on line of sight, I can tell you the angle is much less than 25 degrees, so that should not be an issue. Great idea, thank you
for sharing that !

(4) General: When adding a TP manually, how do I know the "FEC"? What is that?
The menu asks for "Frequency, symbol rate, Pol, and FEC"

(5) Out of curiosity, are some or most of you engineers? I am astounded at the depth of knowledge you all have.

(6) Conky--thank you for the pole measuring idea, and the post about hand made inclinometers.

(7) Ironsides--thank you for advising to check the settings on each satellite. I did do that meticulously, having neglected it the first time around.

So in summary, if I can get the basic idea of what happens or should happen after I find SatMex5, I should be good to go. As mentioned, the next few days look
to be bad weatherwise, so I may not get a chance to do this for a few days. I will of course post at that time, and feel that given the great advice on TP's
on SatMex5, I am determined to nail it.

Thank you again to everybody for your time and efforts in helping me. I am grateful beyond words. And thank you all for your kind words on encouragement.

 

[Tron]

A couple of quick answers...

You can tell a circular satellite by looking at the polarity listing. Instead of H/V (Horizontal or Vertical), it will be L/R (Left or Right). Basically, on a Circular satellite, Left polarity = Horizontal and Right polarity = Vertical. An easy way to remember this is "RV"... Right = Vertical.

FEC stands for Forward Error Correction. It is additional data sent down with the digital signal that is used for error correction. If part of the original data is missing due to poor signal, this error correction data can be used to "fill in the gaps" and still provide a good digital stream.

FEC is usually expressed in a ratio, for example, 3/4. This can be found on Lyngsat in the column labled "SR-FEC" (The first number is the symbol rate, or SR, followed by the FEC). Most receivers are able to find this information automatically (you don't have to input it). A FEC of 3/4 would mean that for every 4 bits of data sent, one is for error correction. 7/8 would mean that for every 8, one is for error correction. A transponder with a 7/8 FEC is often difficult to receive, since there is not as much error correction data.

 

[Phottoman]

(2) To Phottoman: What exactly does a blind scan do? I thought (assumed) it just scanned every TP, listed or not. You state
"Blind scanning that satellite will lock it into your system's memory so that if you are using USALS, the motor will know where it is, and should be able to find other satellites from there."
Can you elaborate on that? Specifically, lets say I do a blind scan on a satellite when I am NOT focused/pointed on that satellite. Have I now confused the system by giving it an incorrect position?



In NON techie terms, and I hope I am corrected by some of the others if I am wrong, but there are several types of scans that your receiver may be capable of, and I am not up on all the terms used by most receivers. I can only answer for the two receivers I own, a CNX DUO (painfully slow blind scan) and a Coolsat 5000.

On both of these receivers, when I want to scan, I can scan a preset number of transponders, or I can set the parameters of a single TP, or I can let the receiver scan Every-thing from one end of a bandwidth to another.

In the last of these formats, the blind scan, immagine if you will your cars AM/FM radio. I see now that some of the newer (perhaps five years old or older) radios will scan your radio band from one end to another. Most of these are limited to finding only as many different stations as you have preset buttons, if you have five buttons it will stop after finding five stations, six buttons, six stations. Have you seen these?

OK, imagine an unlimited set of buttons, and the radio scans from one end of the radio dial to the other popping up with every station available. That would be a blind scan.

On your receiver, these will show up as giving you the equivalent of whatever there is on that satellite.

Now remember, I am going with a non techie answer, so I am leaving out a lot.

On your receiver, once the receiver finishes the scan, look at the stations the receiver found, and compare them to what you are looking for, compare it to the known stations broadcasting from a sat. Is this the sat you wanted? If not, use the list and compare it to other sats close to where you think you are.

Don't just look at adjacent sats, look until you find a list of stations that compares to what you HAVE, not just what you are looking for.

Once the compared list tells you which sat you are on, change the sat receiver settings to THAT satellite and rescan, save, and your on your way to setting up your receiver.

If, for instance, you are looking for 117, and you scan in 97, even though you are 20 degrees away, Once you discover that you ARE indeed on 97, reset your receiver to search 97, then save that into your receiver. THEN reset your receiver to 117 and delete the wrong info (that you thought was 117) and rescan 117.

(I only offer this info as a jumping off point, other people here will take this info and elaborate, hopefully, and maybe explain it better than I did.)

I know this was short, and other can (and hopefully WILL) elaborate on my answer, but maybe it'll help clear up a couple of things.

Also, as far as people here being engineers, I won't admit to my education, but most of what I know came from trial and error (mostly error) until I joined this forum and started reading. THAT'S when I found out how much I DIDN'T know.

Photto