UPDATE! 12-21-05 Dish Transmitting CBS-E HD in 1440x1080i
- Thread starter HokieEngineer
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stuart628 said:are you guys saying that espn2hd and voom are going to be mpeg4? Tell me that aint so...I would hate to think what I would do to get espn2hd
The way it currently looks, if they are mpeg4, you could either pay the ridiculous $369 price for a Dish 411 or switch to DirecTV and get a H20 mpeg4 receiver for free. Dish is really putting themselves between a rock and a hard place because of all the mixed messages they're sending their customers about the transition.
that would be a sad day as that would be a sales pitch directv would win for alot of people I am sure, but I guess lets not jump the gun I dont think Dish network would do something stupid like that, Would they?BFG said:
GeorgeLV said:
I 100% agree! hopefully things will get straightened around on the4th, or sooner!
If Dish puts channels in MPEG4 and forces people to pay this ridiculous extortion fee to get a new 411 it is the biggest mistake they will ever make. I would never pay $ 369 for a receiver when I could pay $ 199 for a receiver with a $ 200 rebate from DirecTV.GeorgeLV said:
Let's see, if I want two HD receivers I can pay $ 198 for the two from DirecTV (after the $ 200 rebate) or $ 738 from Dish. Not a very tough decision. Not only are they going to turn away existing customers, but they will never get any new HD customers. All new customers will go to DirecTV based on money alone.
I currently lease two 811 receivers. If Dish does not come up with a very, very affordable upgrade I am going to go to DirecTV and pay the $ 198 and be done with it. I know DirecTV is a little behind right now, but believe me they will catch up within the next year.
Now we will find out just how smart or dumb Charlie is. The masses will never pay his extortion price as a whole, just to get a few new channels.
Whether or not 1280x720p is better than 1280x1080i may depend upon the conversion process taken to get to 720p. It has been shown that many 720p HDTV sets use a "cheap" method to convert. They take half of the 1080i fields, then line-double them into 540p. Then they upconvert from 540p to 720p.
If this process is taken, then the resultant 1280x720p image would have half the detail of a 1280x1080i image.
Now one would think Dish would have far more sophisticated conversion hardware than what would be found in a $2500 TV. So hopefully they are applying a sophisticated algorithm to directly downconvert to 720p.
If this process is taken, then the resultant 1280x720p image would have half the detail of a 1280x1080i image.
Now one would think Dish would have far more sophisticated conversion hardware than what would be found in a $2500 TV. So hopefully they are applying a sophisticated algorithm to directly downconvert to 720p.
Gary Murrell said:
Interesting.
I made CBS's Senior VP East Coast Operations, CBS's Vice Presisdent of Engineering and Advanced Technology, CBS's Director of Engineering and Advanced Technology and the Head of Technical Operations at KCBS/KCAL aware of this at 4:30am EST Friday morning.
If it's a mistake and hasn't been fixed 20 hours later with these people on the case prior to the weekend - then it's not a mistake and was done on purpose.
Tom Bombadil said:
No. 1280x1080i is inherently better for a 1080i source. In bother cases the horizontal resolution is reduced to 1280 pixels. In addition, the conversion to 720p subjects the signal to additional processing steps (either a proper deinterlacing method or the cheap method of throwing away the other field. As the saying goes, you can choose your opinions, but you can’t choose your facts.
GeorgeLV said:
Agreed.
If 1080i is only giving you 29.97 fps and 720p is giving you 59.94, clearly all they can do is repeat each frame, make a field a frame or throw away the info as you . You have stated. You cannot create something from nothing. It's clearly a waste of bandwidth.
It's really down to do you want 1280x1080 or 1280x720 - in which case 1280x1080 would be better.
Gary Murrell said:F&*!'in DBStalk
http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?p=489429&posted=1#post489429
don't shoot the messenger pal, the fault lies with Dish if you would remove your head from their ASS!!!,
I am done with corporate DBSTalk
-Gary
At least you are not accused of conducting "intellectual masturbation" like I was on this site related to spotbeam capabilities of E-10 and associated movement of other Dish satellites to maximize bandwidth. That is why I am done posting findings from FCC activities to this site.
Something to take into consideration here is that ever since they started testing the LA HD locals on 129 (maybe 3-4 weeks ago?) all 4 networks have been 720p. Why nbc and cbs have been converted, i dont know. Then they launched the NY HD locals on 61.5 TP 17+18, and the same thing, all 4 in 720p. Same lineup, ABC, NBC, CBS on one TP, Fox on its own TP.
Then, for for some crazy reason, they took down the functioning 1080i CBS-E HD from 61.5 TP 2, put espn2hd in its place, and then made available the "testing" NY CBS from TP 17.
Either #1, they didnt realize the test CBS was in 720p, or #2, thier game plan is to put the locals in 720p. I am REALLY hoping for #1 here.
Thank you HDTVfanatic for alerting CBS to this. Hopefully it is just a misconfiguration and all will be well soon enough. I doubt CBS would want their network converted to 720p. I doubt we get to the bottom of this until Monday though. It seems the engineers take the weekends off at Dish
Edit: Just another tidbit of info, 2-3Mbit/s on TP 17 is just NULL packets (filler if the other streams dont add up to the total TP bandwidth).
Then, for for some crazy reason, they took down the functioning 1080i CBS-E HD from 61.5 TP 2, put espn2hd in its place, and then made available the "testing" NY CBS from TP 17.
Either #1, they didnt realize the test CBS was in 720p, or #2, thier game plan is to put the locals in 720p. I am REALLY hoping for #1 here.
Thank you HDTVfanatic for alerting CBS to this. Hopefully it is just a misconfiguration and all will be well soon enough. I doubt CBS would want their network converted to 720p. I doubt we get to the bottom of this until Monday though. It seems the engineers take the weekends off at Dish
Edit: Just another tidbit of info, 2-3Mbit/s on TP 17 is just NULL packets (filler if the other streams dont add up to the total TP bandwidth).
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Even before I went to look, I KNEW it was JL you were talking about. He's the reason I don't spend any time there any more either.Gary Murrell said:F&*!'in DBStalk
http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?p=489429&posted=1#post489429
don't shoot the messenger pal, the fault lies with Dish if you would remove your head from their ASS!!!,
I am done with corporate DBSTalk
-Gary
HDTVFanAtic said:
Whoopi Friggin Do!!
like Dish Network is going to fix a problem like this in less than 24 hours, though in the end I am willing to bet one of my nards that this is a mistake
I am still waiting to here back from contact with Dish, I am anxious to see what they say as I have opened a pretty healthy chat with them since all this HD stir up a few weeks back
I gotcha Simon, I have never seen a more "bunched up" group of "Corporate Ass kissing pseudo intellectuals" in my life, Wait!! hey Fanatic that board has got your name written all over it
-Gary
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Gary Murrell said:Whoopi Friggin Do!!
like Dish Network is going to fix a problem like this in less than 24 hours, though in the end I am willing to bet one of my nards that this is a mistake
I am still waiting to here back from contact with Dish, I am anxious to see what they say as I have opened a pretty healthy chat with them since all this HD stir up a few weeks back
I gotcha Simon, I have never seen a more "bunched up" group of "Corporate Ass kissing pseudo intellectuals" in my life, Wait!! hey Fanatic that board has got your name written all over it
-Gary
You'll have a lot more ammo by letting CBS in this fight. Letting CBS mount some pressure on DISH is better than just some of us complaining. Let your battles be won by 2 generals, not one.
Of course CBS needs to be brought in, my comments were directed towards thinking Dish would have this corrected in 20 hours
-Gary
-Gary
I see, well seeing how long V* fiasco has taken and is still taking, this may be resolved in a similar time frame.
I dont think it was a mistake that it was put in 720p. I expect all HD locals to be in 720p because of space constraints and do NOT expect them to change that even with your complaints. They have to compete with DirecTv on getting these cities launched. The national HD channels has a chance at having a better resolution.
Funny, all we've seen posted for months is that these guys have got to get in gear. Well, we know what they're capable of and they're just putting it on display for us yet again. I don't know why anyone is surprised...
