Star Trek Discovery

[Bodo Fenrirsson]

It's a mirror universe, alternate timeline, so they can do anything they damn well please. (And they have) It's not in that timeline at all.

The only problem with that is that we're talking about the same Defiant that was in TOS & Enterprise, unless it splintered into multiple universes/dimensions.

 

[dare2be]

Some elements from one timeline could exist in another timeline. Not everything has to change.

I'm waiting for the reboot fad to die off and Star Trek gets back to canon.

 

[primestar31]

This is NOT an alternate timeline! The show runners have stated multiple times that it takes place in the PRIME universe, 10 or so years before Kirk and company.

 

[Ronnie-]

the Defiant is from the future, and they had the specifications of the ship, even though it hasn't been built yet.

I may be remembering it wrong, but did not Burnam and Ash get the specifications from the data module they retrieved? If so, that module came from the mirror universe, which is where the defiant was, and plenty of info on it was available.

 

[Bodo Fenrirsson]

I may be remembering it wrong, but did not Burnam and Ash get the specifications from the data module they retrieved? If so, that module came from the mirror universe, which is where the defiant was, and plenty of info on it was available.

But the info that they got was from a rebel ship & incomplete, which is why they had to go to a Terran ship.

 

[dfergie]

Busy episode...

 

[Ronnie-]

Busy episode...

Very, but perhaps the best in so far. To me anyway.

 

[dfergie]

I caught up on the latest 2 episodes yesterday, keeps getting better imho.

 

[Ronnie-]

I feel sorry for those that wrote this off, the show is great.

I won't say it's classic trek, but I might say it's evolved, and even better trek.


Tonight's confirmed a theory I had for a while.

 

[Derwin0]

I feel sorry for those that wrote this off, the show is great.

I won't say it's classic trek, but I might say it's evolved, and even better trek.

From everything I've seen of it. It's a good scifi show, just not Star Trek. They'd been better off just calling it Discovery and drop the star trek ties. Would allow them some more freedom without trekkies crying.

 

[dare2be]

...and the Orville should just be renamed Star Trek: Orville.

 

[pnwdiver]

I have really enjoyed Discovery, however for me it is missing something important... the desire to watch the episode multiple times. I have watched all other trek series and
movies many times, but Discovery doesn’t leave me with the desire to watch the episodes again and again. Trek has survived in syndication... not sure that discovery will get treated well in syndication.

 

[waylew]

I feel sorry for those that wrote this off

Pay wall,the first ep gave me no reason to want more and certainly not to have to pay for it.
If in the future it shows up somewhere where it can just be watched I may do so.

 

[DialgaChampion]

From everything I've seen of it. It's a good scifi show, just not Star Trek. They'd been better off just calling it Discovery and drop the star trek ties. Would allow them some more freedom without trekkies crying.

They originally tried the same thing in 2001 with Enterprise, dropping off the Star Trek name since it was a bit of a departure from the previous 4 live-action series with orchestrated opening themes, and the look and feel of the show. Then of course, starting with Season 3, Paramount demanded that they actually add the name Star Trek to the title, in part due to the falling ratings. But for comparison purposes, many have argued that Discovery makes Enterprise look 10 times better and more authentic. Like you said, Discovery is a decent science fiction show, but it should not have the name Star Trek associated with it. And we all know that the only reason it does, is for brand recognition and public awareness, in an attempt to boost viewership.

I have really enjoyed Discovery, however for me it is missing something important... the desire to watch the episode multiple times. I have watched all other trek series and movies many times, but Discovery doesn’t leave me with the desire to watch the episodes again and again. Trek has survived in syndication... not sure that discovery will get treated well in syndication.

This problem isn't just related to Discovery though. It's an issue with many post-2000 science fiction shows, and I would argue that the common trend behind this is the dystopian factor. When I look at all of the sci-fi television series that have come out since the millennium passed, 90% of them are shows that I would watch once, just out of curiosity, but then I would never watch them again, because they don't have that re-run factor or desire. Battlestar Galactica (2003 reboot), Caprica, Stargate Universe, Defiance, Ascension, Childhood's End, The Expanse, Falling Skies, 12 Monkeys, Colony, Humans, Westworld (HBO)... they're all sci-fi, you can argue whether some of them are better than others, but in the end, ultimately these are one-and-done series. Even the more lighthearted attempts in shows like Killjoys and Dark Matter -- they just don't captivate you in the way that you would want to keep watching them over and over again. Ten or 20 years from now, how many people are going to remember any of these shows, let alone want to re-watch them? Not that many.

Even the new upcoming sci-fi series like Lost in Space (Netflix), Nightflyers, Brave New World... all of them once again have that realistic dark dystopian feel. The only one that might break this trend is Hyperion, but seeing how it was greenlit by Comcast/NBC/Syfy, anyone want to bet they'll ruin it like every other science fiction show this network greenlights?

When you create dark, drama-intensive, overly-complicated and realistic science fiction, it doesn't make me want to watch it multiple times. I don't get invested in the characters, I don't enjoy the storylines, and frankly it makes me care less about what happens or doesn't happen in terms of the actual plot itself.

Also, this isn't simply an argument of "older is better". If you take a look at the production and concepts involved in the good sci-fi shows, the ones that do have re-run factor (even the post-2000 ones like Stargate SG1, Stargate Atlantis, Doctor Who) -- they were fun, lighthearted but still had serious drama moments, and most importantly, they were simple to understand and follow. You knew who the good guys were. You knew who the bad guys were. Sets were brightly-lit, characters and storylines were well-developed and thought-out. There was little-to-no profanity. They had good catchy opening theme songs. And in many cases, the way the stories were written and directed, in a 1-hour episode, you could easily get to the final 5 minutes and still not know if the story would wrap up or if you'd see a "To Be Continued..." at the bottom of the screen.

Contrast that with all of modern sci-fi these days and you'll see where things have changed. Modern sci-fi has producers and networks favoring overly-realistic and complex storylines, where you don't know who you can trust, because the good guys aren't necessarily good, and you might sympathize with the bad guys because their reasons for being evil are legitimate and valid. Sets and tones of the shows are dark, main characters can be killed off without a moment's notice for "shock" value, profanity discourages family audiences, no memorable theme songs in favor of extra commercial time. And usually individual stories wrap up with 10-15 minutes to spare during the hour, so after the episode's climax, the speed drops to a standstill and you already know how the plot ends.

It doesn't take a genius to figure out why re-run factor is low with modern sci-fi, but apparently it does in Hollywood and L.A.

 

[Derwin0]

I have really enjoyed Discovery, however for me it is missing something important... the desire to watch the episode multiple times.

I blame that on the serialized nature of the series. It lacks in stand alone episodes, like the other Star Treks.

With the exception of later parts of DS9 (basically the Dominion War), and the last 2 seasons of Enterprise, you can turn the tv on to any episode of almost any Star Trek series and not be lost. Plus new viewers could easily jump in without having to binge watch all the prior episodes.

 

[TheKrell]

Ten or 20 years from now, how many people are going to remember any of these shows, let alone want to re-watch them?

Point --> Dialga. I'm wondering about Humans, though. Since such lifelike self-aware androids almost certainly will not exist in 20 years, probably not Humans either. But when such androids do exist, I think a lot of folks might want to revisit that show.

 

[dfergie]

Caught up, just keeps getting better IMHO...

 

[Ronnie-]

Caught up, just keeps getting better IMHO...

Tonights got them back, and kind of changed the storyline.

 

[Bodo Fenrirsson]

I blame that on the serialized nature of the series. It lacks in stand alone episodes, like the other Star Treks.

With the exception of later parts of DS9 (basically the Dominion War), and the last 2 seasons of Enterprise, you can turn the tv on to any episode of almost any Star Trek series and not be lost. Plus new viewers could easily jump in without having to binge watch all the prior episodes.

When Enterprise did the Mirror universe episodes, it was easy to jump into them without knowing what was going on in the other episodes.

 

[Derwin0]

When Enterprise did the Mirror universe episodes, it was easy to jump into them without knowing what was going on in the other episodes.

Yes and No. Season 4 consisted of a bunch of mini arcs consisting of 2 & 3 parters. So jumping into one of those in part 2 or 3 left you blind. The Mirror one was a 2-parter.

Not that I'm complaining, because season 4 was the best one, especially after the monstrosity of season 3. I felt the show finally hit it's stride in that final season, at least until that finale ruined everything.