Sure it has a lot of SD, however it does have a lot of the games folks want in HD and thats the important thing.
After all how much better would Poker be in HD?
After all how much better would Poker be in HD?
Scott's Crystal Ball Prdictions (A PLEA TO DISH NETWORK)
- Thread starter Scott Greczkowski
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We may be coming at this from the wrong angle
The collective consenus of people in this group carries some weight with Dish but probably not enough to affect major policy decisions.
The big concern of Dish right now is not pleasing us (it never is) but being able to attract that flock of millions, just around the corner, that will be moving into the HD arena over the next few years. There are billions of $$ at stake when that happens and we are just a small speck of early adopters compared to the flood that's coming.
No one knows when it will hit critical mass but when it does "E" wants to attract the bigger share of that market. The best way to do that is to create the appearence (real or illusion, it doesn't matter) that they are the most "qualified" to provide the HD television experience. So all their decisions right now are geared to that end and anything that threatens that credability will quickly get their attention.
Remember, the average tv viewer doesn't know "E" or "D" like we do nor much of anything about this business. They're going to go with whoever "appears" the most credible and THAT'S what we need to threaten if we want to get Dish's attention.
If we can make Dish believe that boards like ours is where many will turn to for information in the coming months / years, then we gain power. We can do that by continuing to grow and maintaining a solid and united front but we also need a media voice that gets our messages out. Remember it's the millions around the corner that will influence what happens now and tommorow.
The collective consenus of people in this group carries some weight with Dish but probably not enough to affect major policy decisions.
The big concern of Dish right now is not pleasing us (it never is) but being able to attract that flock of millions, just around the corner, that will be moving into the HD arena over the next few years. There are billions of $$ at stake when that happens and we are just a small speck of early adopters compared to the flood that's coming.
No one knows when it will hit critical mass but when it does "E" wants to attract the bigger share of that market. The best way to do that is to create the appearence (real or illusion, it doesn't matter) that they are the most "qualified" to provide the HD television experience. So all their decisions right now are geared to that end and anything that threatens that credability will quickly get their attention.
Remember, the average tv viewer doesn't know "E" or "D" like we do nor much of anything about this business. They're going to go with whoever "appears" the most credible and THAT'S what we need to threaten if we want to get Dish's attention.
If we can make Dish believe that boards like ours is where many will turn to for information in the coming months / years, then we gain power. We can do that by continuing to grow and maintaining a solid and united front but we also need a media voice that gets our messages out. Remember it's the millions around the corner that will influence what happens now and tommorow.
Scott Greczkowski said:
It's got to be more exciting than the State of the Union in HD, but I've seen that advertised all over the place.
I can understand rationing 622 units as initially there simply won't be enough to go around, hence the $200 instant rebate after April 1st to encourage people not to order Feb. 1st.
However, I cannot understand why Dish will not deliver all that new content that's actually in MPEG2 to the current HD subs with MPEG2 receivers. Changing the headers so that only MPEG4 units can get the new channels is just going to really annoy a whole bunch of existing loyal customers.
Until MPEG4 has been thoroughly tuned and tweaked and is fully ready for prime time, Dish should deliver the new HD content in MPEG2 to folks. Also, the switch to MPEG4 should not be done until the vast majority of existing HD subs have had a chance to upgrade their receivers (probably about a six month window).
One doesn't need to be a MBA to figure this out.
Maybe that's the problem -- perhaps Dish has too many MBAs?
However, I cannot understand why Dish will not deliver all that new content that's actually in MPEG2 to the current HD subs with MPEG2 receivers. Changing the headers so that only MPEG4 units can get the new channels is just going to really annoy a whole bunch of existing loyal customers.
Until MPEG4 has been thoroughly tuned and tweaked and is fully ready for prime time, Dish should deliver the new HD content in MPEG2 to folks. Also, the switch to MPEG4 should not be done until the vast majority of existing HD subs have had a chance to upgrade their receivers (probably about a six month window).
One doesn't need to be a MBA to figure this out.
Maybe that's the problem -- perhaps Dish has too many MBAs?
Larry, Moe and Curly could give Shemp the bump to make room for Scott.......... I like it!uhlesses said:
kcribb1 spewed forth this from his keyboard:
It's too bad that you aren't cognizant of the fact that MPEG4 isn't one particular codec, nor is it strictly a low bandwidth solution. The MPEG-4 portion that is relevant for this is MPEG-4 H.264/AVC
Verily I quote from the ever handy wikipedia, with emphasis mine:
The intent of H.264/AVC project has been to create a standard that would be capable of providing good video quality at bit rates that are substantially lower (e.g., half or less) than what previous standards would need (e.g., relative to MPEG-2, H.263, or MPEG-4 Part 2), and to do so without so much of an increase in complexity as to make the design impractical (excessively expensive) to implement. An additional goal was to do this in a flexible way that would allow the standard to be applied to a very wide variety of applications (e.g., for both low and high bit rates, and low and high resolution video) and to work well on a very wide variety of networks and systems (e.g., for broadcast, DVD storage, RTP/IP packet networks, and ITU-T multimedia telephony systems).
The JVT recently completed the development of some extensions to the original standard that are known as the Fidelity Range Extensions (FRExt). These extensions support higher-fidelity video coding by supporting increased sample accuracy (including 10-bit and 12-bit coding) and higher-resolution color information (including sampling structures known as YUV 4:2:2 and YUV 4:4:4). Several other features are also included in the Fidelity Range Extensions project (such as adaptive switching between 4×4 and 8×8 integer transforms, encoder-specified perceptual-based quantization weighting matrices, efficient inter-picture lossless coding, support of additional color spaces, and a residual color transform). The design work on the Fidelity Range Extensions was completed in July of 2004, and the drafting was finished in September of 2004.
So AVC is designed for both low and high bit rates, low and high definition video.
Please cease your uninformed blathering and come back when you actually know what you're talking about.
It's too bad that you aren't cognizant of the fact that MPEG4 isn't one particular codec, nor is it strictly a low bandwidth solution. The MPEG-4 portion that is relevant for this is MPEG-4 H.264/AVC
Verily I quote from the ever handy wikipedia, with emphasis mine:
The intent of H.264/AVC project has been to create a standard that would be capable of providing good video quality at bit rates that are substantially lower (e.g., half or less) than what previous standards would need (e.g., relative to MPEG-2, H.263, or MPEG-4 Part 2), and to do so without so much of an increase in complexity as to make the design impractical (excessively expensive) to implement. An additional goal was to do this in a flexible way that would allow the standard to be applied to a very wide variety of applications (e.g., for both low and high bit rates, and low and high resolution video) and to work well on a very wide variety of networks and systems (e.g., for broadcast, DVD storage, RTP/IP packet networks, and ITU-T multimedia telephony systems).
The JVT recently completed the development of some extensions to the original standard that are known as the Fidelity Range Extensions (FRExt). These extensions support higher-fidelity video coding by supporting increased sample accuracy (including 10-bit and 12-bit coding) and higher-resolution color information (including sampling structures known as YUV 4:2:2 and YUV 4:4:4). Several other features are also included in the Fidelity Range Extensions project (such as adaptive switching between 4×4 and 8×8 integer transforms, encoder-specified perceptual-based quantization weighting matrices, efficient inter-picture lossless coding, support of additional color spaces, and a residual color transform). The design work on the Fidelity Range Extensions was completed in July of 2004, and the drafting was finished in September of 2004.
So AVC is designed for both low and high bit rates, low and high definition video.
Please cease your uninformed blathering and come back when you actually know what you're talking about.
If Dish does not like the rumors, Dish is always welcome to refute the rumors and I am certain that Scott would gladly print their comments in this forum.
jerryez said:
The door is always open to Dish, and I have in the past and will continue to pass information that comes from Dish to you guys.
John Kotches said:
Whilst i cant even start to discuss the technical merit of the post. I do whole heartedly agree with the last sentence.
"If you have the 811 or 942, you will not miss out on much come 2/1. Chill out!! "
Come 2/1, I will be missing out on 3 channels that are likely to be amongst the top 10 channels that I watch.
And I don't mind paying the $99 swap fee to move from a 942 to a 622 at all.
And I don't mind paying the $99 swap fee to move from a 942 to a 622 at all.
Tom Bombadil said:
Which channels though? I already get ESPN2, and if ESPN-HD is any indicator than the Deuce-HD will show a lot of stuff with the wonderful logo bars on the sides anyway.
The only thing I'm curious about is Universal. I've heard a lot of good things about it, but not enough to spend the money to upgrade equipment, plus shell out the extra money per month for the HD Gold package to keep my AT180 channels.
I'm curious as to what channels you're excited to get?
I will be missing two of my most favorite channels: WorldSport and WorldCinema. 
All taped soccer games, as well as La Liga Report programs which I watch every week will be gone from RushHD and moved to WorldSport.
I am ready to start paying extra for the new HD channels, but Dish is not willing to take my money, I guess...
Doesn't make any sense!
All taped soccer games, as well as La Liga Report programs which I watch every week will be gone from RushHD and moved to WorldSport.
I am ready to start paying extra for the new HD channels, but Dish is not willing to take my money, I guess...
Doesn't make any sense!
I'm in the New York area, so I have even more incentive. My broadcast networks in HD. They'll be in Mpeg2, but labeled with mpeg4 headers to keep me from seeing them.....
Grrr....
Grrr....
calikarim said:
Are you an MBA or something? I'm not personally, but from you MBA perspective, it appears that you are looking through the telescope in the reverse way!
By your own admission, you spent $700 on a 6000, and then you spent $699 for a 942. You're not done yet though. You said you are going to shell out another $200 to upgrade to a 622! You said you are going to continue with Dish, and even get a dish 1000 upgrade! From an MBA perspective, that is pretty good! In fact, Dish Network has grown its customer base by 20% in the last couple of years. Again, that is very good from an MBA perspective! If dish did something that lost you as a customer, then that would be bad from an MBA perspective. They haven't upset you enough to do it though.
You have to take into consideration that Charlie Ergen, the CEO for Echostar, was a professional poker player. He is good at it too! Do you not remember a couple of years ago when we all lost Viacomm? Nobody had CBS for a few days when E* pulled the plug during negociations! That is the poker player's bluff! Dish wouldn't survive in the long term w/o Viacomm, we all know that, but the bluff helped. Now, watch the Charlie Chat, he has a very innocent looking face doesn't he? I'm surprised he can go through the whole hour with a straight face! He may come off as incompetent, but the stock price says he knows what he is doing!
For you, take Scott's signature into account. It says that informed customers make better choices! Well, Scott, I think your signature should read something more like, "Informed customers *can* make better choices!", or "Some informed customers make better choices".
I will give you the benefit of the doubt that you haven't kept up with things since CES, as you have been given enough information to make a better choice! We have been given a window of opportunity of about a month. We were told about the coming demise of the 942, starting tomorrow! What is the informed choice *before* it is too late? SELL THAT PUPPY! Get rid of the 942 before it is too late, and then use your proceeds to buy a 622! You can be informed, and you can make a better choice. It is too late now.
calikarim said:
Don't blame us for that! Many of us were voom subscribers. There are only 36k SatelliteGuys, and even if we all went out and subscribed at the last minute, it wouldn't have made a difference!
I got some bad news, which I hope is wrong...
The email comes from Marc Lumpkin at Dish Network who states the following...
"All new HD services will be in MPEG4 "
Let's hope Marc is wrong on this one, but it does not look good.
More as we know it.
The email comes from Marc Lumpkin at Dish Network who states the following...
"All new HD services will be in MPEG4 "
Let's hope Marc is wrong on this one, but it does not look good.
More as we know it.
That really Blow's.. I will be missing out on Universal hd, espn2hd, the 5 voom additions in hd, plus my LIL in hd untill dish can get me 962 to swaped out my 942 that is OWNED. Thats a total of 11 hd channel's (almost double the amount I get now) oh yea i forgot to mention that if I want the rebate I will have to wait untill APRIL... BTW I think anyone in the same situation as me should email dish. WAY TO MAKE THEM UNAVABILE TO COUSTMERS DISH! the sad part is dish knows that there are not many mpg4 recivers out there.
Well, 622 and 211/411 firmware is spooling tomorrow to all receivers:HokieEngineer said:Ah ha! So that explains why it is spooling for 942/622/625/522.
However there hasn't been a general release firmware for the 622s yet. Well, they have 2 days...
01/31/2006: 1101 Software Version L3.50 for ViP622
Effective Wednesday, February 1st , Engineering plans to spool the FULL PHASE of software version L3.50 for the ViP622 receiver. This is primarily a non-forced maintenance release available at ALL satellite locations.
At this time L3.50 will be the valid software version for the ViP622.
01/31/2006: 1101 Software Version L2.62 for ViP211/DP411
Effective Wednesday, February 1st , Engineering plans to spool the FULL PHASE of software version L2.62 for the ViP211/DP411 receiver. This is primarily a non-forced maintenance release available at ALL satellite locations.
At this time L2.62 will be the valid software version for the ViP211/DP411.
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