Post-Install Trouble

[jdmcs]

I've had service for a week now, and have noticed a problem that has just started today.

When the installers put the dish up, they peaked the 105 satellite at right around seventy -- let's call it the high 60's just to be safe. Unfortunately I don't remember which transponder was used to peak the dish at 105.

Today I have had the problem of losing the 105 signal. Right now, one receiver (a 301) is getting 39-40 on 105 transponder 10 and is receiving my local NBC station just fine. (Its on a 13" TV, so I might not notice some pixelation.)

However, my 721 is not locked to the 105 satellite.

I have tried to look at the dish and don't see anything on the dish. However, being night time and 30 degrees outside, I won't rule out a light coating of frost on the dish. I looked up at the sky and didn't see any clouds. There are no trees in the way, and nothing has been erected within the dish line of sight in the past week.

Is the 105 satellite really this sensitive to frost, or is it more likely that the dish has moved? Is this covered under Dish's install warranty?

My locals were working correctly yesterday. I was able to watch The Apprentice without incident. Whatever the problem it seems to have started today...

 

[wobbie]

Can you take the 301 to where the 721 is and test it for the 105?? I'm thinking you have a bad multiswitch.

 

[jdmcs]

It could be a bad multiswitch, but here's why I don't think that is true (at the moment, at least):

1. Don't all receivers have some signal threshold? Isn't 40 around that threshold? I have three receivers and two TV's, so I don't know what the third receiver is doing at the moment. The 301 that is connected to a TV and that is locked to 105 is locked to 105 on transponder 10 with a signal level of 39. The 721 keeps going between no signal and a signal of 39, but not locked.

[Note: My local channels appear to all be on transponder 10 on 105. Just checked that on LyngSat.]

2. When the installers "peaked" the dish, I should add that I had two guys here during the install. One called out the signal level out an open window while the other rotated the dish. The inside guy said "lock" when the signal was at about 75, but I think in the process of locking the dish the signal got locked in the high 60's. And over the past week, I have noticed that the 105 signal has kept dropping on all receivers slightly each day. Almost like the dish is turning ever so slightly.

2a. The dish is mounted into wood and they DID NOT put any sealant anywhere. There is nothing to keep water from seeping in around the screws.

2b. It has snowed twice since the dish was installed.

3. The 721 is wired as follows: The RG-6 from the DPP44 switch is connected to an under-window cable, followed by a short jumper to the power inserter, followed by a 50' cable to a DPP Separator, followed now by 3' jumpers from the separator to the inputs.

The 301 receivers only have an under-window cable between them and the switch.

I guess what I am saying is that the 721 has extra signal loss that the 301 does not. I guess I am also trying to say that while I can put the 301 in place of the 721, won't I have to remove the separator from the cable chain?

 

[boba]

What are the signal strengths on 110 & 119 if they have dropped by 30 points also your dish has probably moved. If they are at the original strength then you may be looking at a switch or LNB problem. No matter where the problem is call DISH and complain you have a 180 day liability from the installing dealer.

 

[jdmcs]

It was the dish alignment. I went outside and with Point Dish on 105 TP 10, I simply pulled the dish towards me and got a better signal. I then unlocked the dish and improved 105 TP 10 from not locked to locked on 105 with a 65 signal strength. (BTW, I am not an installer.)

I also seemed to improve the other satellite signal strengths, too (a sample on 110 had a 104 strength, and 119 has a 70 signal strength). So something must have caused the dish to move.

And all this just in the nick of time for a 11:30 timer to kick off on my 721.

 

[wobbie]

I'd still call dishnand let them know what happened and have them send someone that knopws what they are doing out to reallign the dish. One guy yelling out a window for signal strength????? That's almost too funny. If they had to do that to line a dish, I wonder what else they did or did not do. When you say under window wire are you talking a flat wire thru the window so you can close the window, or does it go thru a wall?? If I may ask, what was the name of the outfit that did the install??

 

[Stargazer]

They should have at least had some walkie talkies and a signal meter to find out if the signal was coming in or not. You signal on 119 is acceptable but should be stronger than what you are getting. Signal on 110 is pretty good. If I were you I would call them back out seeing how the dish mount is getting loose so easily. Sounds like the wood that the bolts are going into may not be suitable enough for the bolts or the bolts are not suitable enough to mount the SuperDish. This may be better off put on a pole.

This is covered under warranty for 180 days. If you call Dish Network the retailer will get charged for the service call. You may want to remind them of that.

 

[webbydude]

Here's another point that needs to be made about the install. I'm assuming this was a Superdish. With that said, it's almost universal install policy to have that dish mounted on a pole in your yard. If it was roof-mounted, did the installers use the strut kit? That will generally give you increased support and prevent this shift in either AZ or EL that you experienced.

One final thing, you mentioned use of the window passthru's. These will generally cause more signal degradation than your typical RG6 lines simply being drilled thru the outside wall and coming into the home. No matter what, I would call Dish Network and have someone repeak the dish under the aspices of a install warranty "troublecall"

 

[Stargazer]

If there was a window passthru that uses a flat wire then that is most likely not DishPro compatable. Contact the retailer, get it repeaked, make them take out that window passthru (flast wire) which should only be used in legacy applications and put it through the floor or side of the house if that is possible or ok with you.

 

[jdmcs]

One guy yelling out a window for signal strength????? That's almost too funny.

Yes, it was funny. Just I didn't laugh while they were here.

If they had to do that to line a dish, I wonder what else they did or did not do.

They did not:
1. Secure the mast with six lag screws -- they only used four. (This was a wall mount job.)
2. Seal the holes.
3. Ground the dish.
4. Listen to me when I said not to put anything through the exterior wall, apartment rules. (One of the guys was going staple gun happy.)
5. Spend more than two minutes showing me how to use the receiver.
6. Clean everything up -- I found a couple of staples on the floor while barefoot, and luckily none of them went through my foot.

When you say under window wire are you talking a flat wire thru the window so you can close the window, or does it go thru a wall??

I meant the flat RG-6 cables like the following: http://www.starlink-dss.com/FlatCable.htm. Just I got mine from eBay.

If I may ask, what was the name of the outfit that did the install??

Antenna Star Satellites -- The service agreement form says "Philadelphia Office", but that certainly can't be right. The confirmation call came from a Norfolk phone number. I went directly through Dish, so I can't tell you exactly where this company is located.

They should have at least had some walkie talkies and a signal meter to find out if the signal was coming in or not.

They did have a signal meter... I'm not sure why he didn't use it to peak 105.

You signal on 119 is acceptable but should be stronger than what you are getting. Signal on 110 is pretty good.

I think that low signal was the fringes of a spot beam that I am not in. The other transponders on 119 are closer to 80.

My 110 signal is awesome. I found one transponder (12, I think) that I get a 111 signal strength!

If I were you I would call them back out seeing how the dish mount is getting loose so easily. Sounds like the wood that the bolts are going into may not be suitable enough for the bolts or the bolts are not suitable enough to mount the SuperDish.

I think its a combination of not enough screws used and no sealant on the screws that were used. We had two snow storms in the first week we had service, and the screws were penetrating painted untreated lumber.

This may be better off put on a pole.

I would if I could... I'm on a third-floor balcony. I don't think a bucket of cement would be sturdy enough for the SuperDish.

 

[jdmcs]

Here's another point that needs to be made about the install. I'm assuming this was a Superdish. With that said, it's almost universal install policy to have that dish mounted on a pole in your yard. If it was roof-mounted, did the installers use the strut kit?

I presumed 105 would give away that it was a SuperDish, but I should have been more clear. The dish is wall mounted with the standard mount, no strut kit. I'm in an apartment, penetrating mounts are not allowed. Three floors up, ground pole mount is out.

[M]ake them take out that window passthru (flast wire) which should only be used in legacy applications and put it through the floor or side of the house if that is possible or ok with you.

I couldn't care less how the coax makes it inside the apartment, as long as it works. However, my landlord has other concerns. It is their building and they don't allow penetrating the building. I don't think complaining to the FCC will help in this case, this could be considered a safety issue. Flat cables will have to stay.

But if they could go, then I bet my signal strengths would improve even more... but would not make any difference if the dish moves again.

TV show I'll avoid: "As The Dish Turns"... try to tell that to my dish.