I have actually thought of that idea actually.
Its a great idea, you are a genius for thinking of it. Cant wait to see it in action!
Policing of The Pit
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Its a great idea, you are a genius for thinking of it. Cant wait to see it in action!
Whats funny is, everyone of us posting here usally are debating each other because we disagree on so many other topics. But on the current subject at hand it seems dam near 100% unanimous among us See were not all animals
See were not all animals 
So, let me get this straight,
What pit members want the mods to do in any thread that goes off topic on another forum and delves into politics, religion or other subjects that are considered off topic in the original is 1) delete the offending posts or 2) close the thread? No recourse for that off topic conversation should be allowed. PIT MEMBERS WANT MODS TO STIFLE CONVERSATION ON CONTROVERSIAL TOPICS? Is that right?
HOWEVER,
If a thread gets out of line in the Pit going way off the reservation in the rules stated, no action should be taken (or action should be taken imediately every time); mods should not be allowed to delete posts of close threads because it would stifle conversation and they have no idea what the "dynamics" of the place is (or do it every time to keep consistency in rules enforcement with no discretion).
Gotcha!
I visit the Pit every day. There are about 10 people who actively post daily and about half have reported posts in the Pit in the last two weeks.
I find it very funny that those that complain about mod interference the most are also the ones most familiar with the "report post" feature. Yesterday I came home at 10pm to find no less than two dozen "reported posts" e-mails waiting for me. ...most dealt with the PIT!
You can't have it both ways!
See ya
Tony
What pit members want the mods to do in any thread that goes off topic on another forum and delves into politics, religion or other subjects that are considered off topic in the original is 1) delete the offending posts or 2) close the thread? No recourse for that off topic conversation should be allowed. PIT MEMBERS WANT MODS TO STIFLE CONVERSATION ON CONTROVERSIAL TOPICS? Is that right?
HOWEVER,
If a thread gets out of line in the Pit going way off the reservation in the rules stated, no action should be taken (or action should be taken imediately every time); mods should not be allowed to delete posts of close threads because it would stifle conversation and they have no idea what the "dynamics" of the place is (or do it every time to keep consistency in rules enforcement with no discretion).
Gotcha!
I visit the Pit every day. There are about 10 people who actively post daily and about half have reported posts in the Pit in the last two weeks.
I find it very funny that those that complain about mod interference the most are also the ones most familiar with the "report post" feature.
Yesterday I came home at 10pm to find no less than two dozen "reported posts" e-mails waiting for me. ...most dealt with the PIT!You can't have it both ways!
See ya
Tony
No just close the O/T thread or remove the posts and advise the posters that if they wish to discuss politics, religion etc. they have the option of joining and starting a thread in the PIT. No one is suggesting "stifling" anything. Scott mentioned seeing a board with a Dead Posts forum at one time, maybe something like that would be appropriate instead of deleting posts. There has to be a better alternative than simply dumping the thread or posts in The Pit. A regular forum member who just wants to argue about FOX news may well be unprepared for the extreme subjects or views they encounter in The Pit even absent any "name calling". Maybe just having an alternative would cut down the PIT complaints and make the mods job easier.
NightRyder
I find this funny-sad.
The original purpose of the pit was exactly to provide a blowing off place to move topics that devolved into flame wars, rather than closing them, deleting them or banning them.
It was never meant to be an independent political forum that it has evolved into. I have no problems with those discussions going on there, but it kind of freaks me out when the princes of the pit treat their domain as something sacred and try to exclude the riff-raf.
There are about a zillion political boards out there. You can find people to agree or argue with you, no matter if you want to talk about politics, religion or the joys of baby-eating. This is a board about television, and mostly satellite television.
The pit is here at Scott's indulgence and it seems to be a constant headache for moderators and members alike. I have personally argued for its continued existance as a necessary place to blow off steam. However, I find it extremely difficult to defend given the current behaviour of its most prolific members.
In other words, settle down yammerers, as you are dangerously close to losing the pit altogether.
The original purpose of the pit was exactly to provide a blowing off place to move topics that devolved into flame wars, rather than closing them, deleting them or banning them.
It was never meant to be an independent political forum that it has evolved into. I have no problems with those discussions going on there, but it kind of freaks me out when the princes of the pit treat their domain as something sacred and try to exclude the riff-raf.
There are about a zillion political boards out there. You can find people to agree or argue with you, no matter if you want to talk about politics, religion or the joys of baby-eating. This is a board about television, and mostly satellite television.
The pit is here at Scott's indulgence and it seems to be a constant headache for moderators and members alike. I have personally argued for its continued existance as a necessary place to blow off steam. However, I find it extremely difficult to defend given the current behaviour of its most prolific members.
In other words, settle down yammerers, as you are dangerously close to losing the pit altogether.
So, let me get this straight,
What pit members want the mods to do in any thread that goes off topic on another forum and delves into politics, religion or other subjects that are considered off topic in the original is 1) delete the offending posts or 2) close the thread? No recourse for that off topic conversation should be allowed. PIT MEMBERS WANT MODS TO STIFLE CONVERSATION ON CONTROVERSIAL TOPICS? Is that right?
HOWEVER,
If a thread gets out of line in the Pit going way off the reservation in the rules stated, no action should be taken (or action should be taken imediately every time); mods should not be allowed to delete posts of close threads because it would stifle conversation and they have no idea what the "dynamics" of the place is (or do it every time to keep consistency in rules enforcement with no discretion).
Gotcha!
I visit the Pit every day. There are about 10 people who actively post daily and about half have reported posts in the Pit in the last two weeks.
I find it very funny that those that complain about mod interference the most are also the ones most familiar with the "report post" feature.
You can't have it both ways!
See ya
Tony
I would sure like to know who those 5 out of 10 are.
This whole discussion continues to baffle me.
The purpose of the pit: a forum to discuss politics and religion, which is forbidden elsewhere on the site.
Explicit in signing up to access the pit, the rules:
WHICH I AM COPYING HERE.
This is the fundamental issue -- pretty much all of the regular pit dwellers violate rule # 1 on a daily basis. Even though, it is usually done in good fun -- "you right wing nut job," "you pinko commie," the reality is that the pit has evolved into a place where personal attacks are viewed by the participants as holy and sacrosanct. Language that is not permitted elsewhere is viewed by the participants as acceptable. AND although I don't have a problem with a joking post that calls someone a commie, it is increasingly difficult to make judgments about what is an attack and what is not.
The pit is not supposed to be the chit chat club, nor is it the pub. Its purpose is to discuss controversial issues of the day dealing with politics and religion. If I go into the Dish Network forums and start discussions on my favorite sports team, or on the latest greatest DirecTV receiver, what would happen to it? It would get moved to the proper forum.
If I post in that same message about how the Boston Red Sox are the biggest pile of fecal matter to wear a baseball uniform, what would happen to it? It would get deleted; and I would get a warning or an infraction.
Those in the pit seem to want it both ways. They want to have the ability to talk about anything they want in their own little private forum; and they want to be able to disregard all of the rules of etiquette that apply elsewhere on the site.
And they want to be able to police themselves, even though moderating is done on this and any site, at the sole discretion of the site staff.
The problem would all go away if the pit participants would stop name calling and the like.
Alas, this is not the first time we have had the conversation about it. And probably not the last.
The purpose of the pit: a forum to discuss politics and religion, which is forbidden elsewhere on the site.
Explicit in signing up to access the pit, the rules:
WHICH I AM COPYING HERE.
This is the fundamental issue -- pretty much all of the regular pit dwellers violate rule # 1 on a daily basis. Even though, it is usually done in good fun -- "you right wing nut job," "you pinko commie," the reality is that the pit has evolved into a place where personal attacks are viewed by the participants as holy and sacrosanct. Language that is not permitted elsewhere is viewed by the participants as acceptable. AND although I don't have a problem with a joking post that calls someone a commie, it is increasingly difficult to make judgments about what is an attack and what is not.
The pit is not supposed to be the chit chat club, nor is it the pub. Its purpose is to discuss controversial issues of the day dealing with politics and religion. If I go into the Dish Network forums and start discussions on my favorite sports team, or on the latest greatest DirecTV receiver, what would happen to it? It would get moved to the proper forum.
If I post in that same message about how the Boston Red Sox are the biggest pile of fecal matter to wear a baseball uniform, what would happen to it? It would get deleted; and I would get a warning or an infraction.
Those in the pit seem to want it both ways. They want to have the ability to talk about anything they want in their own little private forum; and they want to be able to disregard all of the rules of etiquette that apply elsewhere on the site.
And they want to be able to police themselves, even though moderating is done on this and any site, at the sole discretion of the site staff.
The problem would all go away if the pit participants would stop name calling and the like.
Alas, this is not the first time we have had the conversation about it. And probably not the last.
You never call your friend a name?
The problem with moving threads is your not moving a thread like you said that was started and talking about sports in Directv forum.. usually the thread is a few pages, or many posts deep before it gets off topic then the section that is bad is moved to the pit, and when it does rarely do the people who were involved in the conversation join the pit to discuss it. And when they do they are not used to the pit and get offended very easy. Heck I dont know how many times its happened that a user not normal to the pit has threatened me, simply because I posted a statement in disagreement with his own statement.
"rules of etiquette" Are different in the pit and the rest of the site. Which is why there is a warning to enter the pit.
The problem with moving threads is your not moving a thread like you said that was started and talking about sports in Directv forum.. usually the thread is a few pages, or many posts deep before it gets off topic then the section that is bad is moved to the pit, and when it does rarely do the people who were involved in the conversation join the pit to discuss it. And when they do they are not used to the pit and get offended very easy. Heck I dont know how many times its happened that a user not normal to the pit has threatened me, simply because I posted a statement in disagreement with his own statement.
"rules of etiquette" Are different in the pit and the rest of the site. Which is why there is a warning to enter the pit.
But the rules of etiquette aren't supposed to be different, just the nature of the discussion, which we know gets heated. Alas, it regularly gets heated through name-calling.
We had the conversation earlier about good natured humor; I understand the joking around, but its hard to draw a line. And rule #1 is broken regularly. Can't you admit that?
As far as moving posts to the pit, I think we as a staff collectively realized that was a mistake. And as far as I am concerned, if there is a political or religious thread outside of the pit, it should be closed, with the last post inviting those who want to continue the discussion to take it to the pit. As a general rule, we should NOT move threads to the pit. 110% behind that.
I don't want to see the pit closed, but I hate that we have to have these decorum threads every two or three months.
As far as getting a thread back on topic in the general forums, there are different approaches to that, but usually just a post saying, ok... lets get back on topic works, and if it doesn't we can move or delete posts as needed.
I know we pride ourselves on worrying about every thread being 100% on topic. Its part of being satelliteguys.
I know we pride ourselves on worrying about every thread being 100% on topic. Its part of being satelliteguys.
Rocky, thanks for posting the rules here. I had forgotten that they changed back when Scott welcomed the booted DBSTalk folks. I take back my comments on the pit being a dumping ground. I agree that it is now a formally approved political forum.
Steven, it bothers me that you keep calling for the mods to out the whistle blowers. Not that they are going to do it, but would anything productive be accomplished other than setting off a witch hunt? Bad post reporting needs to be confidential (and no, it wasn't me)
Steven, it bothers me that you keep calling for the mods to out the whistle blowers. Not that they are going to do it, but would anything productive be accomplished other than setting off a witch hunt? Bad post reporting needs to be confidential (and no, it wasn't me)
Now I am going off topic. I absolutely love your new avatar Jay. And agree 110%.
I am in so much Colorado withdrawal, it is not funny.
I can agree rule #1 is broken in nature by all of us in the pit But only very few of us break it out of context. As you said, good natured humor. The Majority of rule 1 violations are just that, and both parties are in on it. Every now and again one slips by, and we usually all collectively take on the person we feel is violating the rules. We love to debate each other, but as this thread and others are an example we do come together when something is wrong in our eyes.
And I admire your position and the staffs position on the second part of your post. I think its a great idea.
I dont recall one of this decorum threads in the last 2-3 months. The last thread I recall on this subject is the one that is sticked inside the pit and that was quite some time ago that happened.
No my only problem is the fact they say the same ones bitching here are the ones reporting the posts. I think that shows alot about someones character. Id really like to know if I am debating people who lack such character they would do such a thing. The people/persons in question are not coming forward because they know they would lose ALL respect by everyone who posts in the PIT including those who normally agree with them on every issue that is debated.
Its the coward way to do things,
I was thinking of that thread... as well as other threads on this stuff from the Advisory Council that were in the past few months, when we had a pit-like name-calling episode in the Pub.
Lets just find a way to keep the name-calling in a way that does not involve swear words, and it will get easier to deal with all around. And when people start calling each other sh&@ heads, USE THE REPORTED POST function, and we will delete or edit the post - and NOT close the thread. How is that?
I think we can all agree with that Rocky, it seems fair enough. I will not speak for everyone in the pit, but They are all mostly reasonable people and could agree with that I am sure.
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NightRyder
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