First Look: Dish 942 HD/SD Receiver (Updated 1/24/05)

[Scott Greczkowski]

"DishComm" technology is a technology which allows receivers with DishComm technology to talk to other receivers with DishComm technology. It works by sendings signals over the powerlines.

Its main use will be for the convience of putting your satellite receiver anywhere without having to have all your receivers plugged into a phone line. This way you order a PPV movie on your DishComm receiver in the bedroom which is not hooked up to a phone line, your DishComm receiver in the living room which IS hooked up to a phone line will report your order.

Other uses of DishComm is a BOOM BOX like device which can let you listen to Sirius Radio (Via Dish Network) anywhere in your house.

I have seen DishComm in action and it is a neat technology.

"Stereo Agile Modulated" means that it is an agile modulator which encodes the audio in what was called MTS Stereo format, this way you could hear channel in Stereo on your TV via a coax connection.

Hope this helps.

 

[WeeJavaDude]

Scott,

I guess we can assume 942 still only has the 1 OTA and 2 Dish Tuners?

 

[nuts4scuba]

I was hoping with the delay that they would have been able to put 2 ota tuners in it. Guess I was wrong.

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

Scott,

I guess we can assume 942 still only has the 1 OTA and 2 Dish Tuners?

This is correct.

 

[BFG]

I think they will have 2 OTA tuners, which is an internal spillter like the HDTivo, otherwise why would they call it 942?

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

I have talked to the engineers who are working on the 942's about this a few times and have been told again and again it will only have 1 OTA tuner.

 

[MikeD-C05]

I noticed it used namebased recording . So can we expect this software to come to us by the first quarter of 2005 as well? I would hope so. They need to get it started up on existing customers so we can see if it works. They did promise the 522 would be first and the 942 is based on this platform as well. So maybe by this time next year all of the dvrs will have namebased recording.

 

[GaryPen]

"DishComm" technology is a technology which allows receivers with DishComm technology to talk to other receivers with DishComm technology. It works by sendings signals over the powerlines.

Its main use will be for the convience of putting your satellite receiver anywhere without having to have all your receivers plugged into a phone line. This way you order a PPV movie on your DishComm receiver in the bedroom which is not hooked up to a phone line, your DishComm receiver in the living room which IS hooked up to a phone line will report your order.

Other uses of DishComm is a BOOM BOX like device which can let you listen to Sirius Radio (Via Dish Network) anywhere in your house.

I have seen DishComm in action and it is a neat technology.

It seems like is Dish taking a cool concept like Tivo's HMO (home media option) and others brands' ethernet-based media sharing features, and creating their own proprietary method that is both not as good and completely incompatible.

Why can't they ever just implement industry standards and/or trends into their equipment, instead of isolating their stuff to inevitable early obsolescence?

 

[BFG]

you mean like the DishPod?

 

[GaryPen]

And instead of an apple logo, it'll be a pomegranate.

 

[WeeJavaDude]

It seems like is Dish taking a cool concept like Tivo's HMO (home media option) and others brands' ethernet-based media sharing features, and creating their own proprietary method that is both not as good and completely incompatible.

Why can't they ever just implement industry standards and/or trends into their equipment, instead of isolating their stuff to inevitable early obsolescence?

As to Home Media option, this idea dates well before TIVO and a number of companies are implementing technology to address this need. Microsoft wants or wanted to be a dominent player in the arena. He who controls content delivery controls the home. I can assure you that TIVO did not invent this concept.

I have not seen TIVO's feature in action. I would be curious if you have to use special software on the PC to share files or is is no PC software required? Just create a windows share and your a good to go. As to DVR to DVR content sharing, my guess this is proprietary to each company. eek: here goes another TIVO vs. Dish DVR fight). Ugh... Strike my last comment. I doubt that TIVOs home media option is a standards based technology. Is it? Gary, I am sure you are aware that running on Ethernet does not make a technology standards based. I would be curious of Dish's technology is TCP/IP packet based or did they roll their own transport layer. I am rather surprised at the AC solution myself, My guess is they thought it was easier to control and not hack.

As to an AC solution, When I heard about this a while back I thought it was a bad choice. This was tried as a home networking solution and never took off.
I have always thought that running Data on your power lines was a bad idea, but that is me. As to an ethernet solution, 98% of the homes do not have ethernet runs in their house so that is also not the most ideal solution for this technology and deployment. There are ways to get around this through wirless hubs, but that adds an additional consumer cost. I would have much rather see a wireless solution or better yet use the AC as a default but provide a USB soution that plugs into a USB/Ethernet adapter or a USB to wireless adapter. This way you cover the three mediums and could provide additional cross technology sharing (PC based jpg files for one).

Why can't they ever just implement industry standards and/or trends into their equipment, instead of isolating their stuff to inevitable early obsolescence?

Good guestion. I have some ideas why mainly in terms of IP protection, but since I am not in the meetings It would only be a guess. Does the Direct HD PVR or the Direct TIVO have eithernet support without a hack?

 

[Nolzman]

Well... I tell ya. I am just about ready to switch to Direct. I have been a relatively happy Dish customer for several years. I have also been patient in waiting for viable HD PVR (921 does not count because of the all the problems and cost). I even decided to wait to see what the 942 offers, even if it is next year. But there is one feature that will a back breaker for me.

If the 942 does not have 2 OTA tuners, then I am off to Direct and good ridance. How can they make such a boneheaded design decision. Most of the best HD material is on the networks (off the air). There will many times when a scheduling conflict will cause the user to have to decide which show to record.

I really like Dish, but I do not understand this decision. Why should your latest and greatest product be less than the competitions that has been out for awhile.

Dish needs to let the public know more information about the 942, like when it might be out and the pricing. Will it be lease only? Will it be available to existing customers? How much will the lease be? Without this kind of information, it is hard to make an informed decision.

I am waiting to around the holidays (bonus checks), and if no additional information is released, I am off to Direct.

Anybody else in the same boat?

 

[GaryPen]

You certainly make a lot of sense, Nolzman.

 

[mulificent]

Definitely ready to jump to direct

Nolzman - can't agree more - I don't frankly know why I'm feeling dish loyalty - but I bought an HDTV compatible big screen a couple of years ago, and held off till the recorders were out - but now that direct has what looks like a very solid HD recorder, and Dish seems to have nothing competative for the next 6 months or so, it seems like time to switch.

Also found that direct will let me have multiple recorders in the house, something Dish has said no to - and that would be a plus in my house.

As well, whenever I've looked into the 921 even peripherally, the service from Dish on this has been so inaccurate - they keep telling me I can't replace one of my receivers (I'm on Digital home plan) till my first 12 months are up - even though I'm going on my 3rd year! That kind of response has really frustrated me...

Anyway, pardon my venting - this is a great resource, thanks!

 

[mattyro]

Dish wont allow multiple recorders ??? Whats that all about?? I have never heard of a company not wanting to sell you something.

 

[GaryPen]

As to Home Media option, this idea dates well before TIVO and a number of companies are implementing technology to address this need. Microsoft wants or wanted to be a dominent player in the arena. He who controls content delivery controls the home. I can assure you that TIVO did not invent this concept.

Never said they did.

Gary, I am sure you are aware that running on Ethernet does not make a technology standards based. I would be curious of Dish's technology is TCP/IP packet based or did they roll their own transport layer.

Ethernet is the physical standard. And yes, it communicates via TCP/IP, IIRC.

As to an ethernet solution, 98% of the homes do not have ethernet runs in their house so that is also not the most ideal solution for this technology and deployment. There are ways to get around this through wirless hubs, but that adds an additional consumer cost.

ANY networkin solution adds cost. 802.11b/g wireless and wired ethernet are the best, and at this point the STANDARD solutions for this use.

I don't know why you so often feel the need to argue with me, when in actuality, you agree with my position. In this case, you are agreeing that there is an industry home media communication standard, and that Dish is not utiliizing it. It really doesn't matter what their rationale is. They made the wrong decision.

 

[Foxbat]

Considering how many "my receiver pops up a message saying I should connect a phone line" or "Do I need a phone line connected" posts there are one message board like this, Dish recognizes that their customers don't have phone jacks every six feet in every room, let alone Ethernet. Ethernet over power lines (HomePlug) is "simple" enough, and it's one less cable to plug in. Also, Dish probably considers it more "controllable" than WiFi since it shouldn't get too far outside the residence.

HomePlug 1.0 does 14 Mbps, fast enough for SD video, but not quite enough for full HD. That's being addressed by HomePlug AV (see the press release on HomePlug.org's web site) which is expected to reach speed of 100 Mbps. The timing on this (2005 Q1) and Dish's pushing the 942 back to Q1 of next year... Hmmm, coincidence?

 

[GaryPen]

Cough...wireless...cough.

 

[DishSatUser]

Ethernet is a physical standard, but sometimes this term is loosely used for all RJ-45 connectors to unshielded twisted pair cable.

We use our existing "ethernet" connections at work for some Audio Visual use that has the Video and Audio signals modulated through some "Extron" equipment. It only uses the phsyical wiring topology, but is not TCP/IP or any type of computer communication. Just a raw analog signal that works well over UTP and then is converted back on the other end of the connection with another Extron.

What's important to note is that many are working with and experimenting with TCP/IP over power lines. Similar to the oposite end called Power-over-Ethernet (PoE), where you can send power over the existing Ethernet connection along with the data. Either a NIC (Network Interface Card) that supports PoE or a dongle that seperates out the power from the data is used on the client end. The PoE advantate are ways of providing power for IP Phones (Voice over IP or VoIP), Wireless Access Points and other devices that need low power and may not be convienant for an external power cord or adapter. The differences in frequency between 60Hz power and the actual TCP/IP data traffic are so different there is no interference generated in a PoE environment.

Doing the same thing over powerlines could certainly be performed, it's just not as clean as a hub/spoke configuration (or star topology) that Ethenet uses in a computer network (local area network or LAN). You also have a number of "noisy" devices, like Fernace blower motors, Microwave transformers (cheap ones) and other devices that can create spurrace interferance unlike PoE. But those engineers will likely develop methods of dealing with these.

So in the long run, don't knock a Power and Data combination service.

 

[GaryPen]

So in the long run, don't knock a Power and Data combination service.

IF it can be made compatible with existing ethernet and wireless home networking through some type of adapter, it would be great. But, if it remains a proprietary Dish technology, then it's the opposite of great.