E* and V* approached the FCC about the sale

[rocatman]

Of course Rainbow-1 cannot do it alone, this causes a problem at Dish. Some of the larger DMAs (Like NY and LA) would have too many channels for a spot unless they get to do 3 channels/TP. Also adjacent spots (especially in the NE) would be TP starved if they are all used up on NY/LA. Of course if a bunch of space frees up on 61.5 by them moving all the internationals to 121 and all the SD LILs off to E10, then perhaps they could use E3 CONUS for the major stations and put the rest on the spots (like they do now for NY/LA, have the majors on CONUS and the rest on spots).

Don't forget about the added capability from MPEG-4 which I believe would allow up to about 9 HD channels per TP. I also believe that the new SHREVA rules will drive the need to have HD major network locals for a large city from each time zone on CONUS TPs i.e., N.Y., Chicago, Denver and L.A.

By the way, I am working on a rough estimate of the power capabilities of Rainbow-1 based on ancillary data. This should give a ballpark estimate of how many TPs could be used at once. I will post it in a new thread in the Dish Forum since I believe it is more appropriate there.

 

[Claude Greiner]

I wonder if the satellite can be configured for use at 119 or 110?

 

[bryan27]

News: Something filed with the FCC
The deal is now before the FCC.

JL

Uh, yes. The deal has been before the FCC for almost a month now they just aren't moving on it. Which is typical. I'm involved with several proceedings that actually have been docketed and have been sitting over at the FCC for a year now.

Gutter, I checked after the close of business at the FCC today and no docket has yet been assigned. The only thing we have seen from the FCC is Echostar withdrawing it's application to transfer control of the 11 Rainbow licenses and the FCC denying the application as requested.

Go to the link, story is from Today, and those other meetings where covered pretty well in those other threads about the FCC and nothing to do with this, if I remember right.

Uh, yes the story was posted on SkyReport today, but just because something was reported today doesn't mean it actually occured today or yesterday. I read the article and there was no date given of when the meeting took place.


Where are you guys finding 130 spots? Rainbow 1 has 22 spot beams and some spares.

 

[gutter]

Gutter, I checked after the close of business at the FCC today and no docket has yet been assigned. The only thing we have seen from the FCC is Echostar withdrawing it's application to transfer control of the 11 Rainbow licenses and the FCC denying the application as requested.

Thanks Bryan. So nothing really is no and just a rehash of old news as I thought.

 

[bryan27]

Thanks Bryan. So nothing really is no and just a rehash of old news as I thought.

Yep, and the application that is now on line is the application that was originally filed. There is no information in the application that we don't already know and the exhibits included in the application are nothing more than an ownership report of who owns what and how much of Echostar.

In other words nothing new, we all knew the application file number last week. One thing I do find amaizing with the International Bureau is how slow they are to post applications. Over at the Media Bureau I'll file an application and it will be posted and accepted for filing the very next day.

It is of note that the joint application has not been Accepted For Filing. Which means it's at the FCC, but they haven't even looked at it yet to determine if it can be filed or would be an automatic dismissal.

 

[bryan27]

If anyone is interested here is a link to the withdrawn application. It appears that the same application was filed twice (which does happen every once in a while with the eletronic filing system).

This Link

 

[rocatman]

Where are you guys finding 130 spots? Rainbow 1 has 22 spot beams and some spares.

I believe what is meant is that there are 130 transponders (TPs) on Rainbow-1 (R-1) that can be used in the 22 spotbeams. Each of R-1's spotbeams can use 4 - 8 different TP frequencies. Here's a link to a post from Justalurker over on DBSTalk that has the ITU filing for Rainbow-1:

http://www.dbstalk.com./showpost.php?p=353046&postcount=82

 

[James Long]

Again, this is still old news as V & E both went before the FCC to discuss it about 10 days ago as was reported hear.

Justakurker...have you seen a docket number assigned? If not, then it has not been filed.

Did anyone bother to follow The Link I posted earlier? Evidently not as many questions are answered by what HAS BEEN FILED with the FCC.

In fact, what has been accepted for filing was filed on January 28th - the same day E* withdrew their initial application for transfer. You may not like the news because it confirms that E* really is buying the assets. But no link had been posted nor details from that filing -- so it is news.

Uh, yes. The deal has been before the FCC for almost a month now they just aren't moving on it.

Odd, because some have been saying that it hasn't been in front of the FCC. Thanks for agreeing that the FCC has had the filing.

The only thing we have seen from the FCC is Echostar withdrawing it's application to transfer control of the 11 Rainbow licenses and the FCC denying the application as requested.

The link I gave shows more than that! Including the redacted satellite sales agreement (attachment appendex F - 10meg download).

Where are you guys finding 130 spots? Rainbow 1 has 22 spot beams and some spares.

In the sales agreement where it describes the satellite in spot beam mode. R1 has 22 spots, but there are a grand total of 130 transponders spread across those 22 spots. Each of the spots are fed by 4-8 transponders - and what frequencies is assigned to what spots is a matter of record in ITU filings (including the uplink spots).

If anyone is interested here is a link to the withdrawn application. It appears that the same application was filed twice (which does happen every once in a while with the eletronic filing system).

Ah, you have been over to the right places on the FCC.

The new application was also filed twice because it deals with two different licenses. 1) the satellite and 2) the uplink center. The first application was also doubled - one for each license.

It has not been placed in a public notice yet (even the Media Bureau does this - accepting, granting or denying things and giving "public notice" days later).
Status: Filed - payment received

JL

 

[riffjim4069]

Exhibit F was interesting reading, but it provided no new information. First, on page three I noticed they screwed up the date of the Rainbow DBS spin off (May 2003 vice May 2004) - attention to detail! Also, all the pertinent agreements and details were not attached to this application:

"On January 20, 2005 and January 27, 2005 respectively, the Applicants entered into a Satellite Sale Agreement and a Letter Agreement whereby Echostar would purchase certain assets from Rainbow DBS for $200 million in cash consideration subject to several conditions, including the Commission's approval of the transition. Copies of the agreements (redacted in part to protect certain non-public trade secrets and other sensitive information) are appended to this application."

It's too bad we can't see the missing parts!

 

[Sean Mota]

Enjoy!

Excerpt:

That's a lot of drop/non-payment!

JL

Deliquency, it is called in my book. People who take advantage of the system and everyone pays the broken glasses.

 

[bryan27]

In fact, what has been accepted for filing was filed on January 28th - the same day E* withdrew their initial application for transfer.

I believe where it it said "Accepted for filing" it has a 'Status' that said 'None' which means it has been received, but not yet accepted.

Odd, because some have been saying that it hasn't been in front of the FCC. Thanks for agreeing that the FCC has had the filing.

See we can agree sometimes I think people don't realize this is the bureaucratic Government we're dealing with and things don't go logically.

The link I gave shows more than that! Including the redacted satellite sales agreement (attachment appendex F - 10meg download).

Okay, for some reason when I tried to open Apendex F the document was blank. I'll have to try again this evening

In the sales agreement where it describes the satellite in spot beam mode. R1 has 22 spots, but there are a grand total of 130 transponders spread across those 22 spots. Each of the spots are fed by 4-8 transponders - and what frequencies is assigned to what spots is a matter of record in ITU filings (including the uplink spots).

Thanks for clearing that up for me. I took the message as R1 having 130 spots.

The new application was also filed twice because it deals with two different licenses. 1) the satellite and 2) the uplink center. The first application was also doubled - one for each license.

I understand that, but what I am saying that the same application was filed twice. So the duplicate was withdrawn by Echostar. I've had the same problem over at the CDBS (where broadcasting files). We have had duplicates of the same application and one needed withdrawn befoe the FCC could move on the filing.

It has not been placed in a public notice yet (even the Media Bureau does this - accepting, granting or denying things and giving "public notice" days later).

Yep, everything shows up on the net first and a few days later we will see it officially in the public notice days or weeks later.

 

[riffjim4069]

FYI for those who cannot find Exhibit F...

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

Some interesting reading in those documents.

I would love a SatelliteGuys member to keep us informed of the FCC stuff regarding this transaction.

 

[Bruce]

Some interesting reading in those documents.

I would love a SatelliteGuys member to keep us informed of the FCC stuff regarding this transaction.

Yeah right, have you ever been to the FCc's website

 

[riffjim4069]

Anyone care to fill in the blanks...

List of Exhibit F items redacted in whole or in part:

1.39 Taxes (missing in part)
1.40 ? (missing in whole)
1.43 Regulatory Restrictions and Conditions to Operating (missing in part)
2.4.2 Buyer Deliveries (missing in part)
2.5 Taxes (missing in whole)
4.1.11 Performance Specifications (Satellite operating contract missing in part)
4.3.6 Black Hawk Facility (missing in part)
4.3.7 ? (missing in whole)
4.3.11 ? (missing in whole)
6.1 Disclaimer of Warranty (missing in whole)

 

[bryan27]

I think all of us with FCC experience are trying to get information to everyone ASAP, but we do have jobs we need to attend to

Riffjim, it is typical that very sensitive materials are deleted from public viewing.

 

[who_the]

<soapbox>

Most government-filed documents released to the public are notoriously over-redacted. Information related to Public companies should be just that -- public.

</soapbox>

 

[riffjim4069]

I think all of us with FCC experience are trying to get information to everyone ASAP, but we do have jobs we need to attend to

Riffjim, it is typical that very sensitive materials are deleted from public viewing.

I would rather be discussing how to use the new HD DVR or talking about all the new SD/HD channels we just received...

 

[James Long]

I believe where it it said "Accepted for filing" it has a 'Status' that said 'None' which means it has been received, but not yet accepted.

Try Status: Filed - payment received on the link I gave. Not Status 'None'.

Okay, for some reason when I tried to open Apendex F the document was blank. I'll have to try again this evening

It is HUGE and the server is dead slow. I didn't time it, but it seems like it took 10 minutes to look like it was downloaded. The PDF is a scan of the document instead of the better 'print to PDF' style document.

Yep, everything shows up on the net first and a few days later we will see it officially in the public notice days or weeks later.

I wonder IF there will be a docket for this issue. Not everything decided at the FCC is done in docketed proceedings.

Some interesting reading in those documents.

I would love a SatelliteGuys member to keep us informed of the FCC stuff regarding this transaction.

Glad to be of service and glad to have help / be of help too.

I would rather be discussing how to use the new HD DVR or talking about all the new SD/HD channels we just received...

When that happens I'm sure there will be a thread or two ...

JL

 

[bryan27]

Try Status: Filed - payment received on the link I gave. Not Status 'None'.

Filed and Payment Received is NOT the same as ACCEPTED FOR FILING. The application has been filed and payment was sent. Look at the upper left. It Says "Accepted For Filing PN Date: None" The application has NOT been Accepted For Filing.