Chairman of NBC no fan of auto hop
- Thread starter CK SatGuy
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Someone somewhere has to pay to make the TV show. Either you do by watching advertisements (or at least they hope you do), or you pay a fee like HBO to get it without commercials. If autohop took over everything, we would have to go to the pure pay like HBO model. I do not think people would be happy with $16/channel.
Many would prefer that. It's much more likely that carriage fees increase for DISH is all though... which will then be passed down to the consumer.
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I subscribe to HBO, I rarely watch movies from HBO. But, I consider their series worth the subscription price. This would probably force a la carte since no one would go for a 10x increase in price.
They won't have to, they could get cable, DirecTV, etc.
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The point you missed is if autohop took over and no one watched commercials.... The current TV business model would finally collapse. If people are skipping commercials everywhere because everyone else brings out their own version of autohop to compete with Dish, commercials will no longer pay for TV show production costs.
I didn't miss the point, a la carte isn't happening anytime soon. Other providers will enjoy the benefit of DISH trying to usher that era in if that's their intent. Meanwhile they could face possible rate increases that only they would have to pay for devaluing the advertisements shown on the content they seek to carry.
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What I don't understand is that most of the tv channels that are out there are owned (including some of the premium channels) are owned by the "big six" media conglomerates:
Disney
News Corp
Time Warner
Viacom
CBS Corp
Comcast/NBC Universal
These companies not only own TV channels but as well as movie studios, amusement parks, publishers, etc... These companies always seem to make some kind of a profit each year so I don't why they can't use some of that money to cover the costs of some of their TV shows. Yes it'll lower their profits and it might displease the shareholders at first but in the end, we consumers just hate commercials (except the Super Bowl ones) and if the studios were to make more TV shows with limited to no advertising, then more likely the consumer will watch the show live and with the higher ratings, they'll still make money off of it somehow.
Disney
News Corp
Time Warner
Viacom
CBS Corp
Comcast/NBC Universal
These companies not only own TV channels but as well as movie studios, amusement parks, publishers, etc... These companies always seem to make some kind of a profit each year so I don't why they can't use some of that money to cover the costs of some of their TV shows. Yes it'll lower their profits and it might displease the shareholders at first but in the end, we consumers just hate commercials (except the Super Bowl ones) and if the studios were to make more TV shows with limited to no advertising, then more likely the consumer will watch the show live and with the higher ratings, they'll still make money off of it somehow.
TV broadcasting executives have spent the better part of a week threatening legal action over Dish Network's new Auto Hop feature that allows users to completely skip commercials. But while that has been happening, a federal judge in New York has been considering a case that the TV industry has already taken to court.
TV Broadcasters Lose Round One in Legal War With Barry Diller's Aereo - Hollywood Reporter
TV Broadcasters Lose Round One in Legal War With Barry Diller's Aereo - Hollywood Reporter
From an article in today's newspaper, Moonves rec'd a 20% increase in pay from last year, bringing him to $69 million a year. Makes it hard to listen to complaints about how much things cost or how a network can afford or pay for shows.
Well, personally, I'd be a fan of the autohop if they'd give me a free hopper with no additional contractual commitment or DVR fee. As is, I'm not a fan, because I don't have it, and it can only cause trouble for Dish customers who don't have it, because it's liable to cause a lot of programming disputes that might get channels pulled. I mean, I don't want to lose NBC just because Dish and NBC are in some sort of a dispute over a device I can't afford.
That's the thing, the vast majority of Dish's customers don't have a hopper. So, if they lose channels, they won't see it as Dish defending their right to not have to watch commercials, since they'd have to watch commercials regardless, they'll just see it as Dish losing another channel they enjoy and have to pay for whether they actually get it or not (Not like the package prices are going to go down).
Might be a smart move for Dish, if they are really going to push this to the point where they lose channels, to create some customer "buy in" by giving away hoppers (Well, really giving away free rentals- because I'm sure they'd want the thing back if you cancelled service). If I had the blessed thing and lost a channel because some network didn't like it, I might be more patient and think Dish was fighting the good fight. If Dish says instead, "You can't have one unless you pay like $500 for the hopper and HD equipment, plus an extra $6-$7 a month for DVR", which is I think essentially what they are doing now (Some customers can get it as cheap as $100, but others it costs as much as $900 I'm reading, and then if you don't have HD, you have to pay for that equipment, too, I'd imagine, unless you have great credit), I'm going to be really ticked if I lose channels over something I don't have and can't reasonably find a way to get. Heck, even the 2 year commitment thing is an issue for me these days- I don't want to commit long-term to a company that's always losing channels, because if they lose one that's really important to me, it creates a problem I can't fix.
HanoverPretzel said:
Honestly, you complain and complain and what you want is to be treated special. You'd like a free upgrade with no commitment and no monthly DVR fee. That's completely unrealistic and not even close to how things work.
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Cable is often trying to get people to commit now, but 10 years ago there was no commitment involved for cable. Also, when I had cable and upgraded by SD equipment to HD, all I had to do was drop my old box by the office and pick up a new box. It did cost a few extra bucks a month. But never had to pay to "buy" equipment that in reality I was only renting. When I quit, I just dropped off my equipment for free.
Dish I signed up, and it required a two year commitment. They said free HD for life, but when I called, it turned out to get that I'd have had to pay big money to get HD equipment (So I wound up with SD with the same monthly fee as people with HD who got free equipment- I guess I subsidize them). They said free install, they charged me $99. They said first year price was "x", but then within a month or two, it wound up being $5 more a month, even though I was under contract and despite their advertising (They had to settle a class action law suit over that, I hear). If I leave Dish after my contract, it'll cost me $15 to ship their equipment back (A quitting fee, hooray).
So, now Dish offers this hopper thing, but wants big money for it (Again something you supposedly "buy", but actually have to pay a monthly for and return when you cancel service- sounds more like a lease to me, except you pay big upfront), again price based on credit, but it's worse this time because not only are many of us not able to get it, we will lose channels because this device is going to generate feuds with the networks. So we'll actively get less for our money because of this device, even though we don't have it.
Honestly, all these television providers suck. I wish there was a good one, but there isn't. But if you like TV, you've got to pick one. Not saying Dish is even necessarily the worst. It might actually be the best, but it doesn't have much competition!
Anyway, my point in this thread is just that we customers who don't have the hopper and can't afford to get it will still have to deal with the consequences when and if networks refuse to re-sign with Dish due to the auto-hop thing. Doesn't seem fair. There's no way what's happening can benefit people like me, but it can hurt us.
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There is a system created with you in mind: OTA!
No monthly bill, no one taking things away from you, glorious HD.... you could even get a TiVo but that might mean spending a few bucks a month. Face it, if you want all the modern TV amenities then you have to bring something to the table. Don't have a good history of fiscal responsibility? That makes you a poor risk to have a bunch of someones expensive equipment subsidized for a few years before they even start to make a profit from you. Why should they take that chance? Oh wait, you could just a pay your own way like in days of yore, but that costs more as it well should. Its a lease and just for the record, last year dish squeaked by with 7% profit margin. That happens to be the lowest in the pay TV world. If you can't make it with dish, the only place to go is free.
No monthly bill, no one taking things away from you, glorious HD.... you could even get a TiVo but that might mean spending a few bucks a month. Face it, if you want all the modern TV amenities then you have to bring something to the table. Don't have a good history of fiscal responsibility? That makes you a poor risk to have a bunch of someones expensive equipment subsidized for a few years before they even start to make a profit from you. Why should they take that chance? Oh wait, you could just a pay your own way like in days of yore, but that costs more as it well should. Its a lease and just for the record, last year dish squeaked by with 7% profit margin. That happens to be the lowest in the pay TV world. If you can't make it with dish, the only place to go is free.
Cable gives you those boxes because they are 15 -20 years old and not very cutting edge like the Hopper or the HR Series from Directv. Heck those Motorola and SA boxes don't even stand up to the old 501/508's from Dish. Also $100 upgrade doesn't even come close to the actual cost of the hoppers. That wouldn't barely cover the hard drive cost, if that.
Best deal is go buy a 211k and plug your own external usb harddrive into it and pay the one time $40 dvr activation fee. Then you have HD, DVR, no dvr fee, no contract.
Best deal is go buy a 211k and plug your own external usb harddrive into it and pay the one time $40 dvr activation fee. Then you have HD, DVR, no dvr fee, no contract.
Okay, so why not make one of those older HD boxes available instead of renting me an SD receiver, which is even *older* technology?
People shouldn't have to pay the cost of the hopper upfront, because it's a *rental* unit. If you have to send it back when you discontinue service, you don't own it. Should just be a small monthly fee or including in the cost of programming. And that $100 upfront is only for preferred customers, if they decide they don't like something about you, I've seen people in these threads quote hopper/joey costs as high as $900.
How much would a 211k cost me? What can it do for me if I stop subscribing to Dish service? Hard to see on a limited income plunking down big money for old technology that only works while I'm paying a monthly fee to a specific company (Wouldn't even work with Direct or cable). Rental is the only appropriate model for something like that IMO.
Once again (and not to beat on just you, as you know you and I disagree on this) - basic entertainment is not SUBSCRIPTION tv service. I gave up pay tv for about 10 years after college and that is the main reason that I became a big NFL and PGA fan is because they were free OTA for the most part. If it was just me, I probably wouldn't have it now other than during football season.
Most sports used to not be on cable, but network tv, but then they figured out some people would give their first born to watch every game on pay tv and that is where it ends up now with outrageous billion dollar tv contracts and multi millionaire players that are broke with 5 years of retiring.
Cable doesn't have contracts because they are for the most part local and can send someone to your door, if you don't return their antiquated equipment, DISH/Directv on the other hand are nationwide and can't afford to give away new equipment to every joe sixpack that lives in the middle of timbuktu and then send someone out to retrieve equipment when they cancel or don't pay for service.
Dish and Directv's problem is they gave into the give me - give me more crowd, so they could quickly expand their subscriber base. They would have been better off if they stuck with the buy your own equipment model and no contracts.
