An Apology to the FTA Community

[Scott Greczkowski]

I dont think its the end of the world (fta) just yet!Its not like rick just started what hes doing!his site has been around for a while.

When your favorite feed that you have been watching forever all a sudden get scrambled because it was posted at Rick then you might think its the end of the world.

The problem is the spiders... bots... search engines etc which are not satellite users, not free to air fans, not even human indexing this information instantly because all this information is out in the open where these non humans can grab them. Then after it grabs them, it indexes them and then if companies have Alerts setup for specific terms they are notified instantly... If some bozo bean counter at one of these networks gets one of these alerts about their programs they say "Oh my god we are not making money from these people watching these feeds, we need to stop them. And them boom those feeds mentioned and captured by these non human bots are scrambled, no longer available to the ENTIRE Free to Air Community.

This is EXACTLY what happened to these CBS feeds and now they are gone. Not gone because some guy who love satellite feeds as much as we do posted all of these feeds at Rick, gone because Rick won't password protect his feeds forums so the bots can't get in.

Some people have messaged me and said he could use a robots.txt file while not requiring a login for the humans, and while at one time while that might be true the fact is most bots now ignore the robots.txt file... believe me I know.

Rick is a 56 year old guy who unfortunately acts like he is 14. His attitude is now that he is not going to change a thing even though we may lose feeds just because SatelliteGuys told him he should protect the feeds. This is not a SatelliteGuys thing, I am not doing this for SatelliteGuys I am doing this as a fan of Free To Air and I am TIRED of hearing that we lost another feed because of Ricks. And to give Rick the benefit of the doubt I am SURE some of these feed losses are not caused by Ricks, but if you talk to people in the industry as I do and ask them why a feed got scrambled and their answer is always Ricks. By Rick protecting the feeds from bots the next time something is scrambled we can all say it wasn't Ricks because he took steps to protect these feeds FOR ALL OF US.

Yes there are other feed sites out there, but again a feed goes dark the blame goes to Rick... that's not fair to Rick to be honest with you. But as long as the feeds are not protected people will continue to blame him. Rick has built a great site so when people think of feed info they think of Ricks. In fact I bet if people asked to name feed sites, most people would be able to only name Ricks. Some might know one or two more small feeds sites (including SatelliteGuys) with feeds but nothing that compares to Ricks.

Reading Ricks post again its almost like he enjoys being blamed. I don't get it. Everyone in this forum including the drive by Rick supporters that have shown up here the past few days all love Free To Air, shouldn't we ALL should be working together to try protecting what we love so much. To those who are against me or my stand then I suggest you unplug your FTA receivers and throw them in the garbage because soon they are not going to be useful anymore as everything we love to watch will be gone... oh yes there will still be RTV and news feeds but everything else with scrambled and not available to us.

We need to protect the feeds, and when Rick finally does the right thing we need to stop blaming him for feeds getting scrambled because we will all know he did the right thing because he protected the feeds from the bots.

 

[Lak7]

I'm still waiting for an explanation of why having a login would harm or "detour" the hobby

The fear of lost sales, and changing your position that you spent endless hours defending.
Change is OK, change is Good, but don't Short Change!

Stop the Bots!
​

 

[mister018]

WUT ?

Ice, Scott... I've seen several replies to this thread about how to get into the WUT section...what exactly are the requirements?
Saw several responses say 500+ post???, if that's the case what kind of post? new threads, help for others/newbies, what?? a bunch of "me too" responses.
Let me tell you about myself:
47 yrs old, been doing FTA since the late 80's(C-Band) then into Ku.
here is a list of the things I have now or had in the past...Chapparal Monteray, Drake(can't remember the MN), 4DTV 920&922, Fortec Star 796NA, Integra 912, Pansat 9200, openbox9, 10' mesh, 36"(motorized) & 40" prime*, prime* elipticial...
I don't post much in any forum, as I'm not gonna waste time answering a ? that already has multible replies with the answer, just to get my post count up.
Answer me this, how does that prove that I'm trustworthy??
I would like to become a WUT member/contribuitor( have applied several times) but got no response...if having a 500+ post count is the requirment, you'll probly never see me there...and as I'll never post a "Find/Feed" in the open, I can see where this would drive folks like me or newbies to Rick's site.
thanks, Roger

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

Ice, Scott... I've seen several replies to this thread about how to get into the WUT section...what exactly are the requirements?

I have explained this and my view on this earlier in the thread.

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

The fear of lost sales, and changing your position that you spent endless hours defending.
Change is OK, change is Good, but don't Short Change!
​

I have a feeling if he did require a login the use of his site would go up... and probably also his sales.

Once you take the time to register for a site most people will finally join in the conversation... now all the thoughts they had in their heads as lurkers they can finally share with others. How do I know this to be true? I have met, talked or emailed many of you over the past 12 years I have been doing this and many of the people I have been in contact with have said "Scott I was a Lurker for a long time, and then I finally registered. I then lurked some more and then saw something which I had to reply to and then after that first post something happened to me and I had to post again and now I am addicted and can't stop posting."

I can't tell you how many times I heard that over the years.

I feel the same thing would happen over there. The info is too good there. People will register to get the info and then after they register one day they are going to post and change from a lurker into an active member and maybe even addicted. Thats not a bad thing!

Now I don't know about the software Rick's site runs on but as an idea maybe Rick can password protect things and create a username and password that anyone can use to log in but make that account so it can't post so that people logging into that account cant spam the board or cause trouble.

Just another idea... but again it stops the bots, and that's the goal here.

 

[Mr Tony]

Ice, Scott... I've seen several replies to this thread about how to get into the WUT section...what exactly are the requirements?
Saw several responses say 500+ post???, if that's the case what kind of post? new threads, help for others/newbies, what?? a bunch of "me too" responses.

Roger
There really isnt a "post" requirement per se. Never has been. Let me explain the best I can
When the FTA area started (about a year or so after sateliiteguys was founded...we use to have the "general satellite" spot) we set up the WUT area and pretty much we let dang near everyone in except for a few exceptions (hackers, 0 posters or said they dont have FTA). Then we started having issues with folks taking the info and posting it elsewhere (yahoo groups, other sites) so we started removing people and for a little bit we actually started from scratch. We had a good setup then a bunch of people would request access, get denied, request again, get denied, then complain to Scott about not being let in when they had again no posts, brand new, a hacker, etc. So we actually removed the WUT option for new folks and it became kinda like "invitation only" where we observed folks posting and then let them in.
Scott tried the idea of making it a free for all (letting all registered members see it) which was as awkward as a hooker on the front row of Sunday sermon so that got shot down and we were back to the first way

I dont know who said there was a 500 post count requirement because thats wrong. Usually a long standing member who doesnt have a lot of posts and they ask to be let in I may PM them about it to see. There may be cases like you described (have been in FTA for years but dont post lot). Unfortunately its a double edge sword for me when I look at them. I've let folks in with a few posts only to find out they would take the info here then post elsewhere which bothers me because we only have 2 rules in there
1. what is posted here stays here (unless you are the OP)
2. have fun

Alot of times I look at things like post count, how active they are on the board, length of time here and if they really have a FTA system

 

[mister018]

<I got to be honest. I have wanted to open it up and infact tried to before, but a few of our members got upset about it fearing that posts would leak out, so we moved it back the way it was again.

But honestly as I see it, requesting access to get in and being approved really does no good.I know some of you guys will get made at me for saying that but we have seen that when we have given people access they have just reposted the info elsewhere anyways. To me the walled garden that we have really does not work in those cases.

I personally would like to see it opened up to people logged in, or perhaps (and I don't even know if this is possible to do) but only show it to members who are logged in and who have x number of posts. I also wouldn't mind just sending people to Rick's looking for feeds if he fixed the issue. (These are my thoughts only, I have not talked to Iceberg about this.. I am just giving you my honest feelings on the matter.)

I would love to hear your thoughts on this, but ask if you want to discuss this to start another thread as its a completely different ball of wax.

And there you have it.That I dont know, Iceberg is the one who control of the WUT forum and admissions.

I do know that some members wanted people to be a member for so long and have so many posts before getting it to discurage leeching as before people were just logging in seeing what was there and then reposting it to the unsecure site.

They didn't want their feed posts be used to shut down what they were watching and didn't want them posted at other sites because of this.

I also know that many of the good feed finders out there no longer posts to any forum out of fear if they post it here it will get reposted to the other unsecure site by someone.>

Scott, are these the replies you are sighting?...
Roger

 

[Mr Tony]

Another thing that is interesting

We have a thread here and 140 some odd posts and we're still having a good debate
Over there there has been 2 closed threads and a "announcement" about feedman calling out Rick that he closed too.

If he is so 1st amendment why does he close threads quicker than a hiccup?
Here is something disturbing (and to think about)...this is from his site

A Comment has been made about Unfavorable Posts being deleted in this forum.

I have no Problem with posts being made about issues with a receiver. I have gone out of my way to point out any and all Pros and Cons of any receivers that I sell. I want folks to know the Ups and Downs of the various units that I and others sell.

My Moderators have been given the right to Edit or Delete posts as they see fit to maintain high standards in this forum and I back them up 100%

What standards? Edit/delete posts that might make him or a product he sells look bad? Damn he reminds me of a mod that was here and is now gone because of the same thing...edit/delete posts he didnt like.
Frankly I think the thread about loggin in was really good then it got shut down. And I guess its suppose to make it better with the "its a great day to be alive" crap posted in there?

 

[mister018]

Thanks Ice, you got your reply in while I was typing mine...I've told you about myself...that's all I can do...if, one day I get access, then so be it...until then I'm a patient man...
Roger

 

[Mr Tony]

I also had some issues finding where they were hiding (the apps for it)...with the new software upgrade they got moved
I'll be going through them tonight

 

[trommy]

Scott,

You asked Rick why he doesn't want to do what is best for the FTA hobby. Have you considered that he honestly believes that he already is?

I have many friends in the FTA hobby. We don't all agree about feed posting, it's just that simple. I don't have a problem with it, some of my friends do. But we are still friends. I won't go into the same old justification for my point of view. I just think what I think.

What I take extreme exception to, is that some in the course of this thread have called Rick some pretty bad names. No matter what anyone thinks of Rick's business decisions... he is not a sleezeball or a liar. If Rick says something, it is either true, or at least what he believes to be true. Rick simply doesn't say things that he knows isn't true for any reason... money or otherwise.

Rick is a stand up guy who believes in what he's doing. Many disagree with what he's doing. But there are two sides with different views. Just because he takes an opposing view doesn't make him a money mongering lying sleezeball. If people want to say that he's hurting the hobby... fine. I don't agree, but fine. Everyone is entitled to thier own opinion... right? But saying that he's hurting the hobby is different than mean spirited name calling.

I'm sure I'll be thrown into the "head in the sand" or "Kool-Aid drinking" category by many here. But sometimes that's the price for speaking up.

Cheers

I posted at Ricks and simply dragged the first post in this thread,by the thread starter,to that post.I in no way used any derogatory words or profanity as his IMMEDIATE reply implied and I was cut off from the site.The post was removed without explaination.He says anyone with a problem with his site can contact him ;bull,I couldn't even pm him.I did leave messages in the chat room but he lacks the'will' to respond.His actions are dictatorial to say the very least.That is underhanded and COUARDLY!!I have no respect for a specimen like that.I have never,ever,lied about anyone in my life,which is why I was so offended.I am new to both sites(I was not able to log in here until this summer).I am sorry for all these 'swear' words.(?)(Ricks definition,not mine.) As I told him in the chat room,I think he is a phony Christian milking the flock!!! trommy

 

[Lak7]

His claim of being "blackmailed" I find funny, implies he has something to hide.

Rick, what if you are wrong - seems kinda silly now that women couldn't vote.

Stop the Bots!

 

[truckracer]

I run a business...know "business" like I do-I know if someone is selling something like entertainment and feedhunters get it free-then that steps on toes and changes will be made. Loose lips do sink ships. Not everytime but sometimes...which one will be the next time?

 

[Blindowl1234]

Trommy, I don't want to get off the main discussion but Rick could be milking the flock. It's been done before. As a former pastor myself I could quote him chapter and verse all day to point out his errors....I'm not going to waste my time. I appreciate that fact that we openly talk about the pros and cons of posting feeds here. I'm just not real sure what Rick is so afraid of...maybe he doesn't like to be told he's wrong, or admit he's wrong either. At this point I really don't see him changing his point of view. He's got too many over there that support him 100%. Let's see the blind leading the blind and they both fall in the ditch....
Blind

 

[tofer]

Ricks Blind may or may not support him 100% of the time, but rick is not passing some unexplainable judgement of worthiness on people before they can be in the wut . I guess I really dont have a problem with the log in, but a secret society controlled by a few with in a broader community does kind of sound like some church organizations. May be that ricks flock just doesnt like to be judged, or at least be guilty before proven innocent. Rick seems to see fta as a right not a privilege.

 

[Lak7]

Rick seems to see fta as a right not a privilege.

I see that as a problem, some channels are a right, some are a privilege.
Need to do what's best for the Hobby / Business.

Stop the Bots!

 

[Lak7]

but rick is not passing some unexplainable judgement of worthiness on people before they can be in the wut

Correct, because he does not have a WUT area, but he does pass judgment - people are banned.

 

[tofer]

yeah, cant deny that

 

[tofer]

ricks entire site is a wut section

 

[toucan-man]

We could create nose art like on WWII bombers. Every channel that gets scrambled gets its logo painted on your dish, like so many enemies shot down. Collect them all ! (speaking ironically of course)