61.5 Signal Issues / Split ARC

[Bearsat]

Hello all,

Long, ... long time occasional lurker. Been with Dish forever, it seems. Self install.

I'm having issues with signal strength on the Dish 500 pointed at only 61.5, which has a Y yoke.
I want to try an " I yoke and new LNB" on the 61.5."
At some point in the past the "Diagnostics" showed lnb drift on 61.5 of 4-8 ? ? ?

New I yoke will help figure out where dish/sat is pointed. IMO. Therefore directing me to the limbs/trees that may need to be trimmed/removed. Can't figure it out now with the Y yoke. IMO.
Will use smart phone app too then. Haven't yet.

My signal strength on 61.5 is half the 110/119.
Even light rain/snow cuts off 61.5.

I called Dish. They won't send parts.
I really just want an I yoke and a new LNB.

My system;
Programming; AT 250
VIP 722, single mode. Bdrm TV
VIP 612, Lvrm TV
Location; 22315
"System Info" displays; " DPP Twin, Twin(1), Twin(2), Dual(3)"
"119, 110, 61.5" are the Satellites.
Spit Arc; 110 & 119 on a Dish 500 / Dish 500 with a Y yoke for 61.5.

Each sat box fed with one coax from the 110/119 dish, then "separated" @ the receiver to both tuners.
The 61.5 dish output is feed into the input on the 110/119 lnb.
Dishes; Dish 500 pointed @ 110 & 119, Dish 500 pointed @ 61.5(with a Y yoke unfortunately).
No switches. The 61.5 coax goes to the input on the 110/119.

100/119 is rock solid during rain/snow, as has been since forever. Signal strength 60 - 70+ ~ w/o clouds.
Rarely drops signal. Only during serious storm clouds. Unlike 61.5.

I have huge trees all around, and that is why I am on a split arc.
I know I am missing lots of HD.

129 sight line- No way.

I am fighting trees from all sides. Except 110/119. Trees really fill in at 129 though unfortunately.

I wish Dish Network offered a tree removal compensation / offset fund.

So, after some research, I feel I need/want , outside of a Tree Service Company obviously, a DPP Twin and an I yoke. Is that the correct terminology?

I called DIsh and they won't mail the parts. They say schedule a tech visit.
Or go to my local Dish Retailer and they will give me the parts for free.

For some reason I find it unlikely the local retailer will supply my parts list.
Especially considering my past experience with said local retailers.

The two or three times a tech has came out in the past, I had to redo "stuff". Not sure what's up with 22315 tech visits, but they have another priority than dish tuning and customer service IMO.

IIRC I've had two or three tech visits since 2000 ~, and, as stated, each and every time, they mess something up.
So I would prefer to just acquire said parts and do the install myself if possible.
I'm OK ordering these parts myself if needed, and paying, if that's what it takes. It just seems strange that Dish won't give me these parts after paying them $12-17K over the years.

So I thought I would ask the community, do I just fork over the $$$ for the parts, or what?
Trust me, it may be worth hundreds to avoid said local DN Techs.

Can't find a DPP Twin lnb fwiw. ? ? ?
Found an I yoke for $10 plus S $ H.
Thoughts? Links? ? for parts.

I want an I yoke and an lnb.

Should I PM DIRT

Excuse my ignorance, but,
Does PMing DIRT mean "Start a Conversation?"
Don't want to put all my info into a post/thread if not private.

BTW, Thank You, to all the wonderful members here, creating such a wonderful resource available to all concerned and interested.

Thanks for listening to my long post.

Bearsat

 

[RONZ]

You can purchase the parts at Solid Signal.com The only question I have is since you are getting 61.5 is it possible to get 72 degrees and pick up the HD signals

 

[dare2be]

Yes, PM DIRT means Start a Conversation.

Sorry I couldn't be much else help.

 

[boba]

72.7 is the Eastern Arc satellite that has HD broadcasting, HD used to be on 61.5 but DISH moved it to 72.7.
Do to the broadcasting type MPEG4 the Eastern Arc satellites show a lower signal level but are just as strong a broadcast.

 

[whatchel1]

Just dump the 110/119 and get the EA set up for 61.5 and 72.7. If you can do the 61.5 yourself. You could probably put them in yourself.

 

[RONZ]

Just dump the 110/119 and get the EA set up for 61.5 and 72.7. If you can do the 61.5 yourself. You could probably put them in yourself.

Agree 100% just make sure you have a peaking meter since there is a delay on the box meter

 

[Bearsat]

Thanks for the feedback.

72 blocked by tree to the right. 61 has a small gap to capture, but tree to left may be encroaching. That's why I feel an I yoke will help determine the exact direction of 61.5 sat unlike the Y yoke currently installed and assist in tree/limb removal procedures.

If I had a clear shot to 72 I would be connected.

Thanks again.

 

[dishcomm]

Hello all,

Long, ... long time occasional lurker. Been with Dish forever, it seems. Self install.

I'm having issues with signal strength on the Dish 500 pointed at only 61.5, which has a Y yoke.
I want to try an " I yoke and new LNB" on the 61.5."
At some point in the past the "Diagnostics" showed lnb drift on 61.5 of 4-8 ? ? ?

New I yoke will help figure out where dish/sat is pointed. IMO. Therefore directing me to the limbs/trees that may need to be trimmed/removed. Can't figure it out now with the Y yoke. IMO.
Will use smart phone app too then. Haven't yet.

My signal strength on 61.5 is half the 110/119.
Even light rain/snow cuts off 61.5.

I called Dish. They won't send parts.
I really just want an I yoke and a new LNB.

My system;
Programming; AT 250
VIP 722, single mode. Bdrm TV
VIP 612, Lvrm TV
Location; 22315
"System Info" displays; " DPP Twin, Twin(1), Twin(2), Dual(3)"
"119, 110, 61.5" are the Satellites.
Spit Arc; 110 & 119 on a Dish 500 / Dish 500 with a Y yoke for 61.5.

Each sat box fed with one coax from the 110/119 dish, then "separated" @ the receiver to both tuners.
The 61.5 dish output is feed into the input on the 110/119 lnb.
Dishes; Dish 500 pointed @ 110 & 119, Dish 500 pointed @ 61.5(with a Y yoke unfortunately).
No switches. The 61.5 coax goes to the input on the 110/119.

100/119 is rock solid during rain/snow, as has been since forever. Signal strength 60 - 70+ ~ w/o clouds.
Rarely drops signal. Only during serious storm clouds. Unlike 61.5.

I have huge trees all around, and that is why I am on a split arc.
I know I am missing lots of HD.

129 sight line- No way.

I am fighting trees from all sides. Except 110/119. Trees really fill in at 129 though unfortunately.

I wish Dish Network offered a tree removal compensation / offset fund.

So, after some research, I feel I need/want , outside of a Tree Service Company obviously, a DPP Twin and an I yoke. Is that the correct terminology?

I called DIsh and they won't mail the parts. They say schedule a tech visit.
Or go to my local Dish Retailer and they will give me the parts for free.

For some reason I find it unlikely the local retailer will supply my parts list.
Especially considering my past experience with said local retailers.

The two or three times a tech has came out in the past, I had to redo "stuff". Not sure what's up with 22315 tech visits, but they have another priority than dish tuning and customer service IMO.

IIRC I've had two or three tech visits since 2000 ~, and, as stated, each and every time, they mess something up.
So I would prefer to just acquire said parts and do the install myself if possible.
I'm OK ordering these parts myself if needed, and paying, if that's what it takes. It just seems strange that Dish won't give me these parts after paying them $12-17K over the years.

So I thought I would ask the community, do I just fork over the $$$ for the parts, or what?
Trust me, it may be worth hundreds to avoid said local DN Techs.

Can't find a DPP Twin lnb fwiw. ? ? ?
Found an I yoke for $10 plus S $ H.
Thoughts? Links? ? for parts.

I want an I yoke and an lnb.

Should I PM DIRT

Excuse my ignorance, but,
Does PMing DIRT mean "Start a Conversation?"
Don't want to put all my info into a post/thread if not private.

BTW, Thank You, to all the wonderful members here, creating such a wonderful resource available to all concerned and interested.

Thanks for listening to my long post.

Bearsat

The 'yoke' as you refer to it, is immaterial as the part is designed so that the signal bounces off the reflector to the LNB regardless of type of yoke..
Having an "I" will not assist your search for line of sight.
here's a tip.....Stand ( yes I realize the antenna is on your roof) directly behind the antenna. Line your eye up with the mast. Now if you don't have an inclinometer, you can download and install a dish pointing app on your phone. Most are free.
From the words you use, it's going to be a bit pricey to have the offending trees cut or trimmed.
You have to decide the financials

 

[Bearsat]

.....Having an "I" will not assist your search for line of sight.

From the words you use, it's going to be a bit pricey to have the offending trees cut or trimmed.

I do truly appreciate your input and knowledge, but....

I understand the bounce effect on the dish. That's the whole point of my post ironically.

I feel it will assist with the line of sight, having an I yoke. Currently it's a Y yoke. I'm not sure if the sat/signal is 5 degrees left, or 5 degrees right. . Having an "I" yoke will allow a layman to stand behind the sat dish a see exactly where the bird is pointed (left/right). The current Y yoke makes it challenging to the layman where the sat is and which trees/limbs, etc are affecting the signal.

Is that so difficult to understand?

I only have a 15 degree opening in the sky, between the trees for 61.5. 61.5 is now failing often. Something is happening. Either the trees are restricting the signal or the LNB is failing.

Huge tree line to the right, blocking 72 sat, has been there from the beginning of life. lol.

I have no window for 72.5. That is the limit to the right, hitting the massive tree line.

Once the I yoke is installed it should be obvious which limbs/trees/ etc are the problem.
Because once that I yoke is installed I will be able to see the sat path and tree path blatantly standing behind said dish.

Is that too difficult to understand?

Can someone confirm that if I have a Dish with an I yoke, then the sat dish is lined up with said arm/yoke/sat/?
Am I missing something? ? ?

With the current Y yoke the sat could be 5 degrees left or right.
I don't know which. I don't want to know which.
This dish 500 can be pointed directly at 61.5, so that is my goal.
Is that so hard to grasp?

I ordered an I yoke and a new lnb. So , ....
Will install, align, and report back.

I will achieve my goal next week. So I will learn if it's the trees/ limbs etc.

And yes, tree removal is $2- 3.5K depending, to capture 72.5. Ouch

Thanks for listening.

 

[boba]

What are you expecting to get off 61.5 that you aren't already getting off 110 & 119?

 

[harshness]

Having an "I" yoke will allow a layman to stand behind the sat dish a see exactly where the bird is pointed (left/right). The current Y yoke makes it challenging to the layman where the sat is and which trees/limbs, etc are affecting the signal.

There are tools to do this that are much more reliable and accurate than eyeballing what you think might be the sight line of the dish. Even if you do manage to center the LNB on the arm, the sight line is still well off the center axis of the reflector. A compass and a Harbor Freight inclinometer are pretty easy to use. The device app with a well-calibrated device is another option but the calibration process often isn't trivial. A sight-through inclinometer is much more accurate but more money.

Getting creative with the dish siting is probably a better option. Trees and bushes grow and it won't be any fun if you have to cut an eyehole out every few months.

A pair of 24" or 30" single or dual* LNB dishes looking through a single sight hole at the EA slots would probably serve you better than an arc dish and a wing dish.

* - a dual LNB is a single horn with two outputs.

 

[Bearsat]

What are you expecting to get off 61.5 that you aren't already getting off 110 & 119?

My locals in HD.

 

[Bearsat]

There are tools .....

Thanks for this helpful info.

 

[Bearsat]

dishcomm; After rereading my post #9, I apologize for the snarky tone and comments.
That wasn't my intention.
I guess I missed my meds that day. lol.
Again, Sorry for the tone.

Bearsat

 

[pattykay]

I would just suggest that if you peak the dish while the signal is still being blocked, you might not be pointed directly at the satellite, but rather at where the strongest unblocked signal is coming through at the time you are aiming the dish. It might be better to go ahead and trim any limbs that you think might be in the way, and then peak the dish.

 

[dishcomm]

I do truly appreciate your input and knowledge, but....

I understand the bounce effect on the dish. That's the whole point of my post ironically.

I feel it will assist with the line of sight, having an I yoke. Currently it's a Y yoke. I'm not sure if the sat/signal is 5 degrees left, or 5 degrees right. . Having an "I" yoke will allow a layman to stand behind the sat dish a see exactly where the bird is pointed (left/right). The current Y yoke makes it challenging to the layman where the sat is and which trees/limbs, etc are affecting the signal.

Is that so difficult to understand?

I only have a 15 degree opening in the sky, between the trees for 61.5. 61.5 is now failing often. Something is happening. Either the trees are restricting the signal or the LNB is failing.

Huge tree line to the right, blocking 72 sat, has been there from the beginning of life. lol.

I have no window for 72.5. That is the limit to the right, hitting the massive tree line.

Once the I yoke is installed it should be obvious which limbs/trees/ etc are the problem.
Because once that I yoke is installed I will be able to see the sat path and tree path blatantly standing behind said dish.

Is that too difficult to understand?

Can someone confirm that if I have a Dish with an I yoke, then the sat dish is lined up with said arm/yoke/sat/?
Am I missing something? ? ?

With the current Y yoke the sat could be 5 degrees left or right.
I don't know which. I don't want to know which.
This dish 500 can be pointed directly at 61.5, so that is my goal.
Is that so hard to grasp?

I ordered an I yoke and a new lnb. So , ....
Will install, align, and report back.

I will achieve my goal next week. So I will learn if it's the trees/ limbs etc.

And yes, tree removal is $2- 3.5K depending, to capture 72.5. Ouch

Thanks for listening.

Not to be obtuse....My 12 years of experience doing this work will tell you what you "feel" is irrelevant. Please. Use my method to find your line of sight. it WORKS!!!...Done it thousands of times.
The yoke does not come into play as you are finding line of sight from BEHIND the reflector.....
To troubleshoot. Try another LNB....My thinking based on your observations posted here, the trees are offending your signal.
Te yoke does not skew the alignment to the left or right. It is made to catch the reflected signal from the center of the reflector. The "Y" yoke is not "off" by 5 degrees...Again, to properly find line of sight you stand BEHIND the antenna....

 

[harshness]

Te yoke does not skew the alignment to the left or right. It is made to catch the reflected signal from the center of the reflector. The "Y" yoke is not "off" by 5 degrees.

It absolutely does offset the line of sight to have a "Y" yoke. Having an "I" yoke would allow you to use the direction the arm was pointing at (assuming that the dish were transparent). As it is (and again, if the dish were transparent), you could sight down the other feed horn and that would be about where the signal is coming from (horizontally). Since the dish isn't transparent, you have to use some other method of sighting. That other method necessarily involves a compass and an inclinometer in some combination.

The reflected signals do NOT emanate from the center of the dish. They bounce across the dish at angles. If the offset is 4 degrees to the left, the incoming signal with be 4 degrees to the right of center from an azimuth standpoint (more or less).

 

[pattykay]

One other thing I forgot to mention: the signal does not come straight in from where it looks like the dish is pointed. It comes in from an upward angle and bounces down to the LNB. So, you may need to look higher up in the sky than you would think, in order to find where the obstruction is.

 

[dishcomm]

It absolutely does offset the line of sight to have a "Y" yoke. Having an "I" yoke would allow you to use the direction the arm was pointing at (assuming that the dish were transparent). As it is (and again, if the dish were transparent), you could sight down the other feed horn and that would be about where the signal is coming from (horizontally). Since the dish isn't transparent, you have to use some other method of sighting. That other method necessarily involves a compass and an inclinometer in some combination.

The reflected signals do NOT emanate from the center of the dish. They bounce across the dish at angles. If the offset is 4 degrees to the left, the incoming signal with be 4 degrees to the right of center from an azimuth standpoint (more or less).

Oy vey.....I know that. I was attempting to make the explanation easier for a layman to understand.
How long have you been a connoisseur minutiae?
No tech worth their salt would attempt to ascertain line of sight using the position and alignment of the LNB.....
Here's your sign

 

[harshness]

Oy vey.....I know that. I was attempting to make the explanation easier for a layman to understand.

Dumbing down should never result in making a completely false statement.