Who is having problems with HDMI with 211/411/622

[Tom Bombadil]

I asked for a replacement and they said they could not do that becuase a replacement would probably do the same thing.

At least this is progress.

Not long ago they were refusing to acknowledge there was a problem. Now they are admitting that there is a significant problem. A problem so bad that they can't even stop it from occuring with a new receiver.

 

[bhelms]

I wish E* would issue a statement to all 211/411/622 owners about the situation (it might cause folks who haven't had a problem yet to be a bit more vigilant) so we all have the same story and some idea of their plan going forward. I think they can devise a workaround that will prevent at least some of the hardware related problems and that would help both them and the customers until they can stick their thumb in the leak and get caught-up with the replacements for those that already have the problem...

 

[Pinchhitter]

I have a 211 and the HDMI is fine for video, but the audio is gone. The audio only comes back if I unplug the HDMI from either the back of the 211 or from the back of the tv and then plug it back in. Then the audio is back, only until I change the channel, then it is gone again. So every time I change the channel I would have to re-plug in the HDMI cable...yeah right. I am using the RCA jacks for audio and HDMI for video.

 

[DSKinTX]

I received my replacement 411 today. HDMI is working fine; knock on wood. The old receivers rigged set-up worked until I unhooked it.

My replacement 411's HDMI went black today. POS. Nothing I did could revive it. Back to the phone with DISH.

 

[Clint3200]

I am now confused even more on the HDMI problem. Mine was out on the 2nd day of use, so I went to component. (I tried all the hard and soft reboots, etc.-No luck)

After several days I checked the HDMI for the heck of it and it was working again. It worked a couple of days then----poof, gone again.

Very frustrating. I cannot imagine what the deal is.

Clint

 

[delanewf]

Lost my HDMI signal. Was working fine for the first 2 months now it is gone. Will it come back? Anyone with this problem find a way to get the picture back or it is to component cables for me? I have a projector and had to get a 35 foot hdmi cable. Not cheap. Now I have to get another set of 35 foot component cables. Dish better get on the ball fast.

 

[David_Levin]

My 622 HDMI went out after almost 4 months of use. After reading some comments at the "other" forum, I decided to pop the lid and take a look at the connector.

Sure enough, a pin had lifted from the PCB (don't think any software update is going to fix that). This is in sync with the tech forum (if you port was working then stopped, the connector has failed).

So, why are these pins coming lose after 4 months in the field?

One could say connector movement, but they do have the port screwed into the back of the chassis. There is only one screw, so I suppose that a twisting motion could pivot on the screw and stress the port solder joints.

Here's another thought....

During manufacturing the PCB is (presumably) assembled outside the chassis. They then drop it into the chassis and install the screw through the chassis into the port. If there is any gap between the chassis and the port it will get pulled back flush with the case. This could be applying stress to the connector.

Remember, this is not a big thru-hole with nice long leads to absorb motion. This is a fine pitch surface mount connector.

Also, as the box heats/cools the PCB will move relative to the chassis (different thermal coefficients), this will also stress the solder joints.

Dish blames the connector itself. I would only partially agree with that. It's Dish that chose this connector for this application (it might be fine in a device). They need to use a different HDMI port. This could force a rev of the PCB and the Chassis.

Well, I touched up the solder joint, though I'm not sure how long it will hold. If all the pins are under stress, it's very possible that another will fail (they may all need to be reflowed after installation in the chassis). But hey, my HDMI is functional again !!!

NOTE: I'm not condoning anyone try a self repair. This is fine-pitch hardware requiring the right skills and equipment. I have access to highly trained space-qualified assemblers and equipment.

 

[bhelms]

My 622 HDMI went out after almost 4 months of use...Sure enough, a pin had lifted from the PCB...So, why are these pins coming lose after 4 months in the field?...One could say connector movement...Here's another thought....If there is any gap between the chassis and the port it will get pulled back flush with the case. This could be applying stress to the connector....Also, as the box heats/cools the PCB will move relative to the chassis (different thermal coefficients), this will also stress the solder joints...

Great post D_L !! You have actually experienced/proved something that we have speculated about, and that E*has confirmed, for quite some time! The connections on the PCB are fragile and prone to breakage, potentially by several mechanisms. I agree with your suggestion that it might be due to thermal cycling. I believe this is another reason to try to keep the inside of the 622 as cool as possible. Glad you got it working again. If I were able to spot a lifted PCB connection I might try that repair myself, but I'm very concerned about the fine-pitch spacing (1mm?) and my lack of skills. I might instead be inclined to find an "expert" to do that repair...

 

[billinmidmich]

I too did fix.

My 622 HDMI went out after almost 4 months of use. After reading some comments at the "other" forum, I decided to pop the lid and take a look at the connector.

Sure enough, a pin had lifted from the PCB (don't think any software update is going to fix that). This is in sync with the tech forum (if you port was working then stopped, the connector has failed).

So, why are these pins coming lose after 4 months in the field?

One could say connector movement, but they do have the port screwed into the back of the chassis. There is only one screw, so I suppose that a twisting motion could pivot on the screw and stress the port solder joints.

Here's another thought....

During manufacturing the PCB is (presumably) assembled outside the chassis. They then drop it into the chassis and install the screw through the chassis into the port. If there is any gap between the chassis and the port it will get pulled back flush with the case. This could be applying stress to the connector.

Remember, this is not a big thru-hole with nice long leads to absorb motion. This is a fine pitch surface mount connector.

Also, as the box heats/cools the PCB will move relative to the chassis (different thermal coefficients), this will also stress the solder joints.

Dish blames the connector itself. I would only partially agree with that. It's Dish that chose this connector for this application (it might be fine in a device). They need to use a different HDMI port. This could force a rev of the PCB and the Chassis.

Well, I touched up the solder joint, though I'm not sure how long it will hold. If all the pins are under stress, it's very possible that another will fail (they may all need to be reflowed after installation in the chassis). But hey, my HDMI is functional again !!!

NOTE: I'm not condoning anyone try a self repair. This is fine-pitch hardware requiring the right skills and equipment. I have access to highly trained space-qualified assemblers and equipment.

I too fixed my 211 the same way. I also do not recommend a self repair. I had to use a magnfier just to see the pins. I touched the pins with a toothpick and the first one on the left was loose. Looking at connector from rear of reciever. I resoldered and all is well.....HDMI working again.

 

[David_Levin]

I too fixed my 211 the same way. I also do not recommend a self repair. I had to use a magnfier just to see the pins. I touched the pins with a toothpick and the first one on the left was loose. Looking at connector from rear of reciever. I resoldered and all is well.....HDMI working again.

Hmmm,
I believe it was the same for me (the pin marked 19).

Picturing (in my head) from the rear....
As they tighten down the HDMI support screw (clockwise), the connector rotates a bit in the same direction....

The pin on the left lifts from the pcb. Wonder if it's the same pin for everyone?

How long ago did you make the repair?

 

[billinmidmich]

Hmmm,
I believe it was the same for me (the pin marked 19).

Picturing (in my head) from the rear....
As they tighten down the HDMI support screw (clockwise), the connector rotates a bit in the same direction....

The pin on the left lifts from the pcb. Wonder if it's the same pin for everyone?

How long ago did you make the repair?

This morning after reading the post. I was getting nowhere trying to convince them that it was probably not software. I had a pencil type solderer and just touched the pin with it. Made sure the solderer was warmed up good. Like i said in my post, I had to use a magnifier to see. I too hope that it keeps working. The only reason I went to this cable on a stick system is becuase of the use of HDMI and HD. I always had a "pristene" picture on my Cband dish. Except now a lot of the stuff on there has went to digital and is like the normal soft looking picture becuase of the rebroadcasting and jamming more stuff together. O well..i'm getting off track here. Great to have the HDMI back.

 

[David_Levin]

Just looked up the HDMI pinout...

Pin 19 is "Hot Plug Detect". Not a data line. If this is a common failure I wonder if they could be trying to reprogram the HDMI to ignore this pin (I have no idea if HDMI could operate without this signal - is it in or out?).

Casual reading:
www.hdmi.org/download/HDMI_Specification_1.1.pdf

 

[David_Levin]

One more thought on possibly stressing the HDMI port....

When screwing down the top cover, the back panel gets pulled outward while the cover gets pulled in. Pulling the panel out would also put pressure on the HDMI solder joints.

 

[David_Levin]

Well, I'm certainly curious to know is anyone else has spotted lifted pins (or has lost the DVI port and does NOT have lifted pins).

If you're afraid to post publically, how about a PM or E-Mail (I'll post a summary).

 

[delanewf]

I saw during the August Tech Chat that Dish admitted to a problem with the HDMI connector in the 622. A physical and software problem. Wouldn't the 622 and 211 and 411 have the same HDMI connectors and presumably were manufactured using the same process? If so, they should eventually have the same problem with all of them, right? This means they might have to replace all of these receivers or at least repair them if possible. How much is that going to cost Dish?

I don't think Dish wants to own up to their mistake and have to "Dish" out new receivers at their expense. I bought a 35ft HDMI cable for my projector. IT WAS NOT CHEAP! Customer service told me to use component cables because they were more reliable. If I got an HDMI connector and a $100+ cable, I better be able to use them.

Should I demand a new receiver? More importantly, should all of us with 622,211,411, demand new receivers?

 

[bhelms]

...Wouldn't the 622 and 211 and 411 have the same HDMI connectors and presumably were manufactured using the same process? If so, they should eventually have the same problem with all of them, right?...

Per the title of this thread, the "no HDMI output" problem is common across all the models. The recently-confessed broken connnector problem is just one of multiple potential root causes.

I can't speculate whether the same connectors are used as I own only a 622, but the net result is apparently the same for all 3 models; "excessive" force on the HDMI plug can fracture delicate SMT socket connections on the PCB. E* alluded to this problem (and a potential SW/"incompatibility" issue with the same result - no HDMI output) in their last Tech Chat. Their plan for mitigation has not been announced. In the interim customers who want to use the HDMI option and find it to be unoperational should raise the issue with E*. E* may or may not accommodate a ready swap-out. (Mine took two calls.) One concern I have had is that E* may not really know the extent of the problem if owners/users are not reporting it.

 

[delanewf]

bhelms,

Excellent response. Thank you. So the moral of this story is "Report your problems... as many times as possible."

 

[bhelms]

Rephrased slightly..."as many times as it takes". I believe I was fairly treated. When I first called-in it was early in the learning curve for both parties and some confusion and/or possibly inaccurate responses from E* are part of the game, at least at that stage. Since E* has now admitted the problem I would hope they would be a bit more proactive in helping the customers out. We still see instances reported in this forum where E* is apparently telling complainers that it's a SW problem that will be solved with a future update and not even mention the possibility that there could be another problem like a broken HDMI connector. I would also hope to see some type of announcement to all 211/411/622 users that they could help the situation by applying appropriate care when connecting or handling the HDMI plug and not let the weight of the cable be supported only by that plug, etc. That would be a reasonable remedial measure until a more robust, permanent fix is deployed...

 

[delanewf]

We still see instances reported in this forum where E* is apparently telling complainers that it's a SW problem that will be solved with a future update and not even mention the possibility that there could be another problem like a broken HDMI connector.

I got the aforementioned "software problem" explanation and my complaint was raised just this past Sunday, August 20th. They are either slow in informing their customer reps or they believe their customers are gullable and uninformed. I will be placing another call this evening.

 

[patrickpiteo]

I want to call but I do not want to go around and around with these guys.