Treo vs. Blackberry

[rockymtnhigh]

So.. my trustyworthy treo 700p died on me last weekend; just went into perpetual rebooting. As a result I headed to the Verizon store and got a new one; a 755p. Still palm, but a bit lighter, a nicer feel, and no antenna stub. But in rebuilding my applications, I have grown more than a bit frustrated with the Palm OS. The browser bites; and Opera Minu requires a Java program that Palm no longer distributes. Even Palm's own Chatter email program has been giving me problems.

As a result, I have been debating whether or not to stick with Palm. Sure, I have been using the Palm OS for more than 10 years - and while it went from black and white to color to high res color, and eventually a phone, the OS is pretty much circa 1998.

I am debating using the 30 day guarantee to switch to a Blackberry curve. I know Blackberry users seem to love their devices. But other than playing briefly with a blackberry simulator, it is unclear what the learning curve would be from Palm to Blackberry. Or whether it would be worth the switch?

I know there is no touch screen; I know the calendar and email is setup different from what I am used to. But I am genuinely interested in hearing what people have to say about the blackberry.

 

[Cowchip]

I picked up my first Blackberry last month (Curve 8330) and enjoy the heck out of it. I can't say what the learning curve is from the Palm to his device, but I think you'll catch on pretty quick.

After you learn some of the keyboard shortcuts and where everything is at (which didn't take me too long just by playing around with it) it'll be second nature in no time. The trackball is really nice to use for navigating the operating system and the various applications. It seems I learn more "stuff" it can do every day, and much easier to use than my Mogul I am forced to use from work. It's lightweight, thin, and easy to carry around too which is a big plus in my book. I don't like having the feeling of a brick in my pocket or a purse-like case on my belt. I'm nerdy, but not THAT nerdy!

After owning it for a while now I can see why they call it a "Crackberry". Very hard to put down and I wouldn't give it up for anything that's on the market at this time.

 

[firebirds]

Had no experience with the Blackberry, but I have heard some bad things from them.

 

[rockymtnhigh]

Had no experience with the Blackberry, but I have heard some bad things from them.

Such as what?

 

[Cowchip]

Curious minds would like to know.....

 

[TheForce]

We had the Treo 700w here and my wife loved it. She was forced to switch to a Blackberry by her new employer. Big difference she had to get used to was the lack of touch screen. Blackberry used the track ball but after a few months of bitching about it, she doesn't complain about it anymore. The other issue with Blackberry is that it can't segregate e-mail accounts. Polls her two e-mail accounts like a Blackberry does but lists all e-mail in one list. Her Treo, I had set up to segregate ( File) e-mail into custom folders so her personal messages would be free from her business messages.
She said that everyone in her office use the blackberry because they are forced into it by the company's IT idiots. Most, have two phones, a PPC and the Blackberry. I didn't want the expense so I shut off the Treo.
Whats good about Blackberry is that the Treo used to need rebooting a couple of times per day if she used the many applications. Blackberry never requires rebooting, never locks up. Battery life on the Blackberry is much better too.

IMO, the Palm OS is like windows 3.0 compared to windows Mobile 6 phones. But if you are used to it and don't mind the single apps, it works well. If you want a real power horse, get a 6800 PPC. Heck even Clark Howard admitted this week he finally broke down and got the Verizon 6800.

 

[rockymtnhigh]

We had the Treo 700w here and my wife loved it. She was forced to switch to a Blackberry by her new employer. Big difference she had to get used to was the lack of touch screen. Blackberry used the track ball but after a few months of bitching about it, she doesn't complain about it anymore. The other issue with Blackberry is that it can't segregate e-mail accounts. Polls her two e-mail accounts like a Blackberry does but lists all e-mail in one list. Her Treo, I had set up to segregate ( File) e-mail into custom folders so her personal messages would be free from her business messages.
She said that everyone in her office use the blackberry because they are forced into it by the company's IT idiots. Most, have two phones, a PPC and the Blackberry. I didn't want the expense so I shut off the Treo.
Whats good about Blackberry is that the Treo used to need rebooting a couple of times per day if she used the many applications. Blackberry never requires rebooting, never locks up. Battery life on the Blackberry is much better too.

IMO, the Palm OS is like windows 3.0 compared to windows Mobile 6 phones. But if you are used to it and don't mind the single apps, it works well. If you want a real power horse, get a 6800 PPC. Heck even Clark Howard admitted this week he finally broke down and got the Verizon 6800.

I had the early Pocket PC's (compaq) back about six years ago, and at the time was woefully unimpressed with it, and after a few months went back to Palm. This was before phones. But the PPC used to crash all the time (kind of like the Palm still does when too much is run). Are the 6800s stable? Has the software and interfaces improved?

 

[Cowchip]

Not really. You'll become quite familiar with the small reset hole on the bottom of the 6800 handset.

We've got a half-dozen of the 6800's around here at work and they all come to me for help. Now that they know how to do the reset I get a lot less visits to my office.

 

[Ira Lacher]

As a former Blackberry user, I have to say that Verizon's 8330 (Curve) is the best BBerry out yet, especialy if you have Verizon's EVDO data network. WAP pages especially load very quickly, and even some regular Web pages are fast loaders. The Blackberry browser, unfortunately, is not the best, tending to render most pages in strange forms, washing out colors, etc. However, it does have an improvement to the pointer; it's now a graphic pointer, meaning you can use the trackball to maneuver it anywhere on the screen, as opposed to pacing between clickable links.

Camera is a 2.0 megapixel with flash, plus video. You can send and receive pics by MMS.

As a phone the Curve is very clear, very loud. Reception is great.

If you have Enterprise activation you can seamlessly schedule tasks and events from emails. Best feature of BB in my opinion. Of course, the Enterprise add-on fee is a hefty $40 or so.

The keyboard seems small, but it's easy to type on, even for my large fingers.

Emails are sent quickly; quicker than on any Windows Mobile phone I've ever used.

I like the versatility of applying different profiles, adding custom ringtones, etc. You do this thru the BB Desktop Manager, which is far more stable than Microsoft ActiveSync.

Drawback is not being able to edit Microsoft Office files or store them on the SD card. You can store photos, music, video, etc., however.

All in all, for $149, a superior device. If I weren't working for an iPhone developer I'd go back to it, I think. The iPhone is fun, but lacks much of the BB's business communications functionality.

 

[rockymtnhigh]

As a former Blackberry user, I have to say that Verizon's 8330 (Curve) is the best BBerry out yet, especialy if you have Verizon's EVDO data network. WAP pages especially load very quickly, and even some regular Web pages are fast loaders. The Blackberry browser, unfortunately, is not the best, tending to render most pages in strange forms, washing out colors, etc. However, it does have an improvement to the pointer; it's now a graphic pointer, meaning you can use the trackball to maneuver it anywhere on the screen, as opposed to pacing between clickable links.

Camera is a 2.0 megapixel with flash, plus video. You can send and receive pics by MMS.

As a phone the Curve is very clear, very loud. Reception is great.

If you have Enterprise activation you can seamlessly schedule tasks and events from emails. Best feature of BB in my opinion. Of course, the Enterprise add-on fee is a hefty $40 or so.

The keyboard seems small, but it's easy to type on, even for my large fingers.

Emails are sent quickly; quicker than on any Windows Mobile phone I've ever used.

I like the versatility of applying different profiles, adding custom ringtones, etc. You do this thru the BB Desktop Manager, which is far more stable than Microsoft ActiveSync.

Drawback is not being able to edit Microsoft Office files or store them on the SD card. You can store photos, music, video, etc., however.

All in all, for $149, a superior device. If I weren't working for an iPhone developer I'd go back to it, I think. The iPhone is fun, but lacks much of the BB's business communications functionality.

I appreciate this feedback.

My biggest concern is 1) Not having a touch screen after so long; and 2) integrating gmail and work email into one seemless thread. So much as it is, I am not sure how I would manage it.

Glad I still have a few weeks to think about it.

 

[TheForce]

Cowchip- I probably hit the reset hole twice a month and it usually is when I'm multitasking with several applications running at the same time. and then a phone call comes in .

I had the 6700, now that was a phone I had to reset 3-4 times a day.

I'm getting more active in day trading and my bank now has a PPC mobile day trading app that I'm considering adding. That should be interesting.
One of the things I can do is listen to a podcast, play a game like pool and be downloading files in the background. Then when a phone call comes in the podcast stops while I take the call. If using wifi the download continues, if on EVDO the download stops. Once the call is finished, my game resumes but the download must be restarted. Same goes for sling box viewing. I wonder if BB ever got an app for sling box? MY wife had it on the treo but never used it much.

Hey rocky- when I use my wifes BB trackball, after a few minutes of surfing or something, the first joint in my thumb starts to click. I have to stop and work that ball with my index finger until it starts to click. Am I getting arthritis?

 

[rockymtnhigh]

Thanks Don.

I think I will check out the 6800 at the Verizon store; again, I have 3 more weeks on my guarantee, so this gives me a bit of flexibility to choose.

I see there is a treo update out for the 755p, but it requires you have an actual mini-sd card; and they are hard to find (I am using a micro with a mini-adapter). I doubt I will bother unless I choose to keep the treo.

 

[Ira Lacher]

My biggest concern is 1) Not having a touch screen after so long; and 2) integrating gmail and work email into one seemless thread.

As far as your second question, Rocky, the BB does put all your email into the Messages folder, which appears on the main screen. (There are also separate folders for Gmail and work email, but you can hide them.) So you do have all your messages in one folder.

As for the touch screen: yes, there is that loss in functionality, especially if you've goosed your 6800 with third-party apps. But there are two positive takeaways:

1. You don't accidentally activate something on the screen when the phone is against your cheek, and
2. You gain a much brighter screen for outdoor use because the technology used on most touch-screens, with the exception of the iPhone, has its limitations. Those phones tend to be fairly dark, even at the highest brightness setting (which also uses more battery). I found that the 6800 screen was nearly invisible in bright sunlight. But the BB is very bright and clear. Also, the Verizon interface, with its move-anywhere arrow, does give you more flexibility in navigating than previous BBs.

 

[docpadds]

The BB does handle multiple email accounts without issue, just setup the Enterprise one first and add the rest after.

The devices are rugged too, have a Curve here thats been run over by a car and still runs fine, wouldnt know it but for scratches on the back.

I am now running 4.5 Blackberry OS on my test devices and its a huge leap, HTML emails working and a nice clean up to the interface.

If you keep your phone on your belt, the BB also has the advantage of knowing that and acting differently in the holster then out of it per your choice.

Shame your not on ATT, I have about 15 spare 8800s and Curves right now, could let you try one


-Jonathan

 

[rockymtnhigh]

I am confused by the whole Enterprise thing on the BB. Is that what the $30 data plan is called?


ALso, in fairness to my years as a PalmOS guy, I downloaded a new phone app for the palm called UltimatePhone. This has the most slick Palm OS interface I have ever seen. It is an app launcher; a new call log; new contacts manager; and new dialer... if it is stable (I will work the heck out of it the next few days), I might just stick with Palm for two more years... See UltimatePhone - Palm OS


Still, keep the comments flowing; I am finding this very helpful. Three real choices; but whatever one I make I am stuck with for at least 18 months.... (Apple iPhone is out; contact manager is insufficient for me; and I am under a Verizon contract).

 

[TheForce]

One more thing I forgot to mention as a negative for the 6800.

I can't do conference calling on outbound calls. Only inbound.

Let me explain- If I receive a call and need to set up a conference call I can do that no problem. BUT, if I call out to first party and try to call a second party the first one drops. I had Verizon working on it and UT Starcom tech support. Seems this is a flaw in their OS for the phone and until the firmware is upgraded or the phone it will remain with this bug.
So, if you do much conference calling forget the 6800.


Re the issue reported about the screen brightness in bright sunlight. Florida sun is pretty bright but I have no problem with it and it is actually brighter than the iphone which I compared outside in the sun side by side at the Apple store last year. What I do have is the optional 3rd party screen software that has a slider to change screen brightness from the main screen which is nice to preserve battery on the fly quickly. I use SPB Pocket Plus which I feel is a must have as it makes the screen work like a real windows desktop with tab pages so I have icons on the screen to launch applications.

 

[rockymtnhigh]

One more thing I forgot to mention as a negative for the 6800.

I can't do conference calling on outbound calls. Only inbound.

Let me explain- If I receive a call and need to set up a conference call I can do that no problem. BUT, if I call out to first party and try to call a second party the first one drops. I had Verizon working on it and UT Starcom tech support. Seems this is a flaw in their OS for the phone and until the firmware is upgraded or the phone it will remain with this bug.
So, if you do much conference calling forget the 6800.


Re the issue reported about the screen brightness in bright sunlight. Florida sun is pretty bright but I have no problem with it and it is actually brighter than the iphone which I compared outside in the sun side by side at the Apple store last year. What I do have is the optional 3rd party screen software that has a slider to change screen brightness from the main screen which is nice to preserve battery on the fly quickly. I use SPB Pocket Plus which I feel is a must have as it makes the screen work like a real windows desktop with tab pages so I have icons on the screen to launch applications.

Never used the phone for a conference call, so not an issue. I need to actually get to the verizon store and play with one of them.

The app program sounds interesting.

 

[Kru83]

None.

Go HTC Mogul.

 

[docpadds]

I am confused by the whole Enterprise thing on the BB. Is that what the $30 data plan is called?

Yes. If you r company has a Blackberry Enterprise Server (BES) then you will need Verizon to set you up on their Enterprise Blackberry service. If you just plain on using the Blackberry Internet Service (BIS) you can go with the cheaper Blackberry data plan.

The reason for the difference is really the carriers finding two things they can charge people for. BIS attaches to IMAP/POP3 etc.... BES attaches to those AND a corporate Blackberry server.

I hate the way the providers devide it up like that, Tmobile divides it into 3 services somehow. Caused a lot of work for me when i converted 95 users over to their own self-liability plans across their choice of providers.

 

[rockymtnhigh]

Shame your not on ATT, I have about 15 spare 8800s and Curves right now, could let you try one


-Jonathan

And I would have taken you up on that offer!