TiVO's vs HR2x's
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I think part of the problem is that some of you guys are comparing an older model tivo with much newer model directv boxes.
Most of the older tivo's had pretty loud PATA hard drives. The newer tivo HD's and Premiers use the exact same drive and the exact same fans that the HR2x's use and are all fairly silent.
How is the TiVo DVR better than anything from D*:
1. Search capabilities by keyword, actor, category, and TiVo search are far above any DVR from D* or the cable companies. And nobody has better "wish list" searches than TiVo.
2. Recording from the web is always reliable. I always had problems with D* where scheduled recordings were not scheduled on the DVR.
3. Someone said that they heard Netflix, Amazon, and Blockbuster are available on the "new" box. Netflix and Amazon have been available for years on Series 3! Blockbuster was recently added - not due to TiVo but simply Blockbuster's lame attempt to catch up with Netflix.
4. Season Pass Manager is much easier to use than D*.
5. Thumbs up and down helps TiVo find suggestions for you. Don't think D* has that.
6. As for the remote, it is easy to use and handle. I don't use it to control TV or audio power so I don't care about using it as a universal remote (I have a MX3000 but switch to the TiVo remote because it is lighter and easier to use than the universal when controlling TiVo).
7. Some of the D* remote capabilities are easier to use than TiVo's remote is light and easy to handle.
8. Recovery of deleted programs possible with TiVo - not so with D*.
9. Additional capacity is officially supported by TiVo - not sure about D*.
Some of the OP points on switching between recorded TV and live TV are valid but to me the capabilities of TiVo far outweigh any of its short comings.
1. Search capabilities by keyword, actor, category, and TiVo search are far above any DVR from D* or the cable companies. And nobody has better "wish list" searches than TiVo.
2. Recording from the web is always reliable. I always had problems with D* where scheduled recordings were not scheduled on the DVR.
3. Someone said that they heard Netflix, Amazon, and Blockbuster are available on the "new" box. Netflix and Amazon have been available for years on Series 3! Blockbuster was recently added - not due to TiVo but simply Blockbuster's lame attempt to catch up with Netflix.
4. Season Pass Manager is much easier to use than D*.
5. Thumbs up and down helps TiVo find suggestions for you. Don't think D* has that.
6. As for the remote, it is easy to use and handle. I don't use it to control TV or audio power so I don't care about using it as a universal remote (I have a MX3000 but switch to the TiVo remote because it is lighter and easier to use than the universal when controlling TiVo).
7. Some of the D* remote capabilities are easier to use than TiVo's remote is light and easy to handle.
8. Recovery of deleted programs possible with TiVo - not so with D*.
9. Additional capacity is officially supported by TiVo - not sure about D*.
Some of the OP points on switching between recorded TV and live TV are valid but to me the capabilities of TiVo far outweigh any of its short comings.
Wish list, I wish the HR had a wish list option like the Tivo.
Season Pass is better Than the HR series, you don't have to go into the season pass to change the time of a recording if you stop the one that was original scheduled to record, for example if I want to record the baseball game and it overlaps with two shows I have scheduled with the HR I have to cancel one and go to the recording manager and find a different time for that show, with the Tivo it will do it automatically.
The HR2x boxes do support additional capacity. You can buy an external eSata drive and hook it up to the HR2x box. Then reset your box and the external eSata drive will be active. However, the internal hard drive is disabled and can't be used. So you will have to reset your recordings, series links and recording defaults. Also, once the eSata drive is hooked up to one HR2x, it can't be connected to another HR2x box. This is done for copyright reasons. Once you disconnect the external eSata drive and reboot, the internal drive will be reactivated and the previous recordings and whatnot are still there. D* doesn't charge a fee to do this. Of course you have to buy the eSata drive.
But directv wont support the esata setup, it works but its not officially supported.
Tivo has officially supported external hard drive expansion products.
Tivo also lets you move shows from one box to another, which is handy. You can take shows off a machine with an overfilled hard drive to one with more space, or get shows off of a box with a hard drive thats starting to go south.
Plus when you add a hard drive to a tivo, it retains all of your season passes, settings and existing shows since it 'marries' the two disks. So you dont have a second drive sitting inside the box using electricity and doing nothing.
While the two drive marriage setup increases the failure rate since if either disk fails you lose everything, it also significantly increases performance since the internal drive handles all the system/database activity and some show record/playback while the external drive does the majority of the recording/playback.
In this manner, adding a large hard drive doesnt slow down the box like it does on an HR box.
Tivo has officially supported external hard drive expansion products.
Tivo also lets you move shows from one box to another, which is handy. You can take shows off a machine with an overfilled hard drive to one with more space, or get shows off of a box with a hard drive thats starting to go south.
Plus when you add a hard drive to a tivo, it retains all of your season passes, settings and existing shows since it 'marries' the two disks. So you dont have a second drive sitting inside the box using electricity and doing nothing.
While the two drive marriage setup increases the failure rate since if either disk fails you lose everything, it also significantly increases performance since the internal drive handles all the system/database activity and some show record/playback while the external drive does the majority of the recording/playback.
In this manner, adding a large hard drive doesnt slow down the box like it does on an HR box.
i have 2 tivo series 3 hd models i use with cable. the mrv is a farce because it won't transfer anything that is copy protected, which is just about all current programs.
i have been able to transfer one program so far. it was made in 1955 and, therefore, no longer copy protected.
Well this will be my first post on this forum.
I am a new DirecTV customer, as of April 22nd. I have been a TiVo devotee since 2002, and just closed my account. This was more of a financial decision, rather than a technical choice. I do love my TiVo, but cable costs were way out of line. That is a whole other discussion.
From my POV, each could benefit from each other.
TiVo Pros : Great UI, great remote, easily upgradable hard drives, Netflix streaming, transfer one show to another tivo with more room.
TiVo Cons : MRV is slow, and usually have to transfer program first before watching, extra subscription costs, Getting a Cable Card from the cable companies is still a PItA.
D* Pros: MRV is pretty flawless, out of the box more HD storage, free VOD is nice (but tivo has some too), MRV Playlist is very transparent (you see all the shows on your networked DVRs)
D* Cons: No recently deleted items (nice if you accidently delete a show), UI looks OLD, random audio dropouts, remote signal issues (IR and RF) LEASED equipment (Thank goodness for eBay, I now have a HR21 with a 1.5 TB Drive - Owned
)
This is coming from only a few weeks of HR2* use.
Love the HD PQ, and customer service has been as good as cable.
Thanks,
Alex
I am a new DirecTV customer, as of April 22nd. I have been a TiVo devotee since 2002, and just closed my account. This was more of a financial decision, rather than a technical choice. I do love my TiVo, but cable costs were way out of line. That is a whole other discussion.
From my POV, each could benefit from each other.
TiVo Pros : Great UI, great remote, easily upgradable hard drives, Netflix streaming, transfer one show to another tivo with more room.
TiVo Cons : MRV is slow, and usually have to transfer program first before watching, extra subscription costs, Getting a Cable Card from the cable companies is still a PItA.
D* Pros: MRV is pretty flawless, out of the box more HD storage, free VOD is nice (but tivo has some too), MRV Playlist is very transparent (you see all the shows on your networked DVRs)
D* Cons: No recently deleted items (nice if you accidently delete a show), UI looks OLD, random audio dropouts, remote signal issues (IR and RF) LEASED equipment (Thank goodness for eBay, I now have a HR21 with a 1.5 TB Drive - Owned
)This is coming from only a few weeks of HR2* use.
Love the HD PQ, and customer service has been as good as cable.
Thanks,
Alex
I've had two TiVo boxes in the past and when we switched to E* 2 years ago I was disgusted with our new DVR. My blog post pretty much says it all Password Graveyard: Dear DVR Users . Please keep in mind that I am not afraid of new interfaces, I love playing with new gadgets and I have to say, even our new HR20 sucks compared to what we had with our old DirecTivo box. I'm just waiting for the new DirecTivo to be released so I can dump our new DVR
Cool features for many. I never use this. But the HR can do most of what you listed here, including Key Word search.
Both can do this. It is my TiVo, not my HR that misses recordings.
Not a Direct TiVo comparison. Remember any TiVo Direct gets will have software approved by Direct and I doubt they will allow Netflix, ex. They want you downloading their VOD
Not even close to being true. Not only does Direct require fewer key strokes and folder navigation's, it is much easier to see exactly what is done and what is scheduled in a simple list. They don't use those stupid thumb gestures as well.
Oh...What do you know? You brought up what I just criticized. The first thing I turned off and first thing most people turn off is this stupid suggestion feature which automatically records crap that you do not want.
Then talk about making something difficult that should be simple. Nothing is more confusing and more annoying than the thumbs up and down features.
This is definitely nothing that is better
Really? The fact that they have a separate button located near the #2 button for doing one of the most important tasks, turning off your TV tells me the designer of this remote must like his TV on all of the time.
The buttons are closer together than the HR. Those annoying and useless thumbs up and thumbs down buttons take up the most space.
What is more important, turning your TV off and on, or hitting the seldom used ugly big green thumbs up button?
It is lighter, but not easier to handle. I am always hitting the wrong button
Although I don't like this feature and I wish I could turn off this feature, I will admit this is one plus for TiVo.
External drive on the HR can be used. Remember, this too is a Direct feature, not necessarily a TiVo feature. Just because a TiVo you buy for your OTA TV can do this, does not mean the Direct TiVo can.
You listed only one thing that a Direct TiVo has that their HR does not, recovery of deleted programming. Everything else is either a feature that will never be seen on a Direct TiVo, is not an advantage, or a matter of opinion.
Not necessarily an advantage.
I will give you this one. This does annoy me with the HR. If I wanted to cancel the recording of one show in a series it ends up canceling the whole series. What I do is wait for it to record and then delete the recording. TiVo is better at this.
BTW, deleting the recorded program as well as mail is much easier on the HR. Fewer steps needed (one press of the red button)
Which means the Direct TiVo will have the same limitations.
Remember everyone, we are talking about using TiVo with Direct vs using the HR with Direct. Many of these TiVo features you praise will not be available with Direct
To the OP:
1. Tivo Search capablities are one of its main selling points. Very useful to find your favorite actor or actress and to have their shows recorded automatically if you want.
2. I had trouble with D* web scheduling since I am early adopter. Havent used it lately so I may be wrong. But I have never had Tivo miss a recording from the web or directly from the device where it wasn't due to extended power or internet outage. I haven't had either of those external problems in quite a while and they are of course not TiVo's fault anyway.
3. Not sure why you negate the value of having Netflix or Amazon available. Netflix Instant Queue is very handy and is included free with all of the standard plans, even if you only get 1 DVD a month for $ 8.99.
4. Season Pass Management seems easier to me on TiVo than on HR. Probably just a preference.
5. TiVo suggestions: yes, I turn off the auto record to avoid filling up my drive. BUT, you can still browse the list of suggestions, and I have found many shows and movies I would have otherwise missed that I liked.
6/7. The TiVO peanut remote is designed for the human hand, unlike D* boxy remote. As for other functions, as a audio/videophile I have a complicated setup with many devices, so I use a MX-3000 controller for selecting sources, turning on/off the whole system, volume, etc. However, as I said, for TiVo related functions, I often switch to the TiVO remote even though I don't have to - simply because it is light and easy to handle.
8. Not sure why D* (and the cable companies, for that matter), don't recognize the need for a recycle bin. How many times have you accidentally "whacked" something? As for deleting something in Tivo, it is easy, just go to the list of programs, highlight program, and hit clear. No confirmation message because you can always recover it if you didn't mean to delete it.
9. As the other posters have said, additional capacity is officially sanctioned by TiVo. D* tells you it is available, but doesn't support officially.
1. Tivo Search capablities are one of its main selling points. Very useful to find your favorite actor or actress and to have their shows recorded automatically if you want.
2. I had trouble with D* web scheduling since I am early adopter. Havent used it lately so I may be wrong. But I have never had Tivo miss a recording from the web or directly from the device where it wasn't due to extended power or internet outage. I haven't had either of those external problems in quite a while and they are of course not TiVo's fault anyway.
3. Not sure why you negate the value of having Netflix or Amazon available. Netflix Instant Queue is very handy and is included free with all of the standard plans, even if you only get 1 DVD a month for $ 8.99.
4. Season Pass Management seems easier to me on TiVo than on HR. Probably just a preference.
5. TiVo suggestions: yes, I turn off the auto record to avoid filling up my drive. BUT, you can still browse the list of suggestions, and I have found many shows and movies I would have otherwise missed that I liked.
6/7. The TiVO peanut remote is designed for the human hand, unlike D* boxy remote. As for other functions, as a audio/videophile I have a complicated setup with many devices, so I use a MX-3000 controller for selecting sources, turning on/off the whole system, volume, etc. However, as I said, for TiVo related functions, I often switch to the TiVO remote even though I don't have to - simply because it is light and easy to handle.
8. Not sure why D* (and the cable companies, for that matter), don't recognize the need for a recycle bin. How many times have you accidentally "whacked" something? As for deleting something in Tivo, it is easy, just go to the list of programs, highlight program, and hit clear. No confirmation message because you can always recover it if you didn't mean to delete it.
9. As the other posters have said, additional capacity is officially sanctioned by TiVo. D* tells you it is available, but doesn't support officially.
Because it is not a feature available with Direct. It doesn't matter what TiVo can do, it only matters what Direct TiVo can do. Remember we are comparing DVRs through Direct
My upgraded TiVo was the best DVR I've ever used to this day, ease of use is subjective, not everyone digs all the way into the guts for every little thing, you can't just dismiss it with 'too many buttons/screens/etc' - that's your opinion and I beg to differ.
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I remember seeing those when I had a directivo years ago. But that one you found may be related to something involving the new directv tivo. I sort of doubt it though. After stonecold said there was a major sticking point about tivo needing to incorporate some rather major architectural features that werent in the tivo product and tivo not wanting to do it...that doesnt sound like something they're going to resolve in a month or two or three, and coming when the product is already very far past its initial release date....sounds like its probably not coming soon, if at all.
There is one feature I remember I liked when I used my HR10-250 compared to the features of the HRxs:
With the HR10-250(DirecTivo) you could select either the grid guide or list guide.When you were in the list guide you could go backwards in time to see if you missed the time of a program you wanted to watch.
With the HR10-250(DirecTivo) you could select either the grid guide or list guide.When you were in the list guide you could go backwards in time to see if you missed the time of a program you wanted to watch.
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