Splitter vs. 2 indep. cable jacks (622)

[kaman]

In my new home, I had the builder install a central hub box for phone, cable, Ethernet. From this hub, I opted for two cable lines/jacks to where my home entertainment system would be. My thinking at the time, knowing that I was going to purchase 622 and may decide to do the two TV feature (one cable incoming, one outgoing). It turns out I am using both on same TV for now. Anyways, the DISH installer used both lines/jacks from the switch (using two out of four jacks on switch) to go to 622. I assumed he would use one line, and use the included splitter to separate the signal from the single jack to 622. HE SAID HE HAD TO USE BOTH LINES to hook up both receivers on 622, and couldn't use just one line. I don't believe him.

He is wrong isn't he? I would like to connect a currently unconnected jack elsewhere in home to the switch and only use one cable line to the 622 and then split it from the 622 wall jack with the included splitter. Then I would have the extra jack behind the 622 as an outgoing jack, should i want to go to yet another tv. OR I may have to break down and get an OTA antenna since the promise of Cincy HDs went down the crapper, which would use second jack. I should be able to do this, shouldn't I?

Also, is one setup better/more reliable than the other?

BTW, I also made sure to have an Ethernet wall jack behind the 622/home entertainment system. I looks like my hunch is right, assuming that E* follows through on activating Ethernet port on 622.

 

[r_childress]

Depends. If he installed a DP44 switch, then only one lead is required with the DPP separator installed. If he did not install a DP44 switch, I would call and raise a big stink and make him come back and do the job right so you can use the other line to output TV2 to your cebtral hub.

 

[webbydude]

Depends. If he installed a DP44 switch, then only one lead is required with the DPP separator installed. If he did not install a DP44 switch, I would call and raise a big stink and make him come back and do the job right so you can use the other line to output TV2 to your cebtral hub.

Uhhh...not necessarily true. Dish is not in the habit of just giving away DPP44 switches unless they're needed. I.e, 4 orbital slots. Without knowing what other tuners and equipment the OP has, let's please not jump into any conclusions and want to ream Dish.

 

[SmityWhity]

Could we ream Dish and then later say we're sorry?
On the serious side.

The original poster is aware that he probably could have a change in the installation method that would better suit his situation. However, he didn't furnish enough information to help him resolve his problem.

Info that would help:
- What type of dish/LNBF are you using?
- What type of Switch are you using?
- How many receivers & tuners are you using?
- Are you using Cable, OTA-HD, OTA-SD, etc...?
- Why would you like to run a wire from the Switch to a jack elsewhere in the house?

Solutions:

1. If you have either a Dish 1000 or a Dish 500, either one with a DishPro Plus Twin (DPP Twin) LNBF for 119 & 110.
Then you can run a single cable from it, to the DP Separator (not a splitter), and the 2 short cables from the DP Separator to the 2 tuners on the ViP 622 receiver.

2. You said you have a switch. If this is the case, I suspect you do not have a Dish 1000, or even a Dish 500 with a DPP Twin. Therefore, you probably have a Dish 500 with a DP Twin (Not DPP Twin), and a Dish 500 with a DP Dual. The swtich is probably a DP34, which will require 2 cables. You could spend upto $200 to get a DPP44 for a single cable, but it would be cheaper to replace a DP Twin with a DPP Twin for the single cable solution.

3. The Diplexer Solution. Even though you are using the only two available cables to feed the 2 tuners on your ViP 622, you can backfeed the 622's output through one of those cables. You will need two diplexers (approx $10 total), one near the 622; and the other near your hub, or where-ever you can easily make your connections back to the hub to feed the rest of the house.

There is a lot of info at this link, including the Diagrams.
http://www.solidsignal.tv/dishpro_installation.asp

 

[tjwgrr]

A DPP separator will work with either a Dish Pro Plus 44 switch or a Dish Pro Plus Twin LNB. I don't have a DPP44, but I do have a DPP Twin LNB- works like a charm.

Your 622 should have had a DPP separator in the box.

If you don't have a DPP separator, I have an extra one I bought not knowing one was included. Yours if you want it for $6.00 (what I spent for it including shippping.) New & sealed in the package. PM me if you're interested.

 

[Cokeswigga]

Didn't Dish just issue A DPP-33 swich ,which is a 3 orbital location DPP switch which allows for the use of Seperators..


It's probably cheaper to backfeed the TV2 out on one of the lines using a diplexors.

if you are thinking about an antenna, you can also diplex that too with the other sat-line. You might loose a little signal due to the insetion loss.. but you should be ok.

 

[kaman]

OK...Here is what I have. Although I know a more than grandma in this area, I am not an expert in this field (obviously). So I apologize if I put something down that is totally obvious to everyone else (i.e. "I have a gray round dish pointing at the sky"), or irrelevant. I will let you experts glean the germane pieces of info.

Info that would help:
- What type of dish/LNBF are you using?

+ Single Dish pointing at 3 birds (110, 119, 129). I don't know what kind of hardware is on roof (LNBs or Dish Pro Plus, Dish 1000). It was a new install in May, 2006. On dish installation screens (i.e. peak angle) SuperDish is selected. Given the location of the dish on roof, it is impossible to see the front of the dish to read what it says. I am physically disabled, so climbing on the roof ain't happening, and my helicopter to airlift me on my roof is missing a helicopter.

- What type of Switch are you using?

+Switch=DP34 There are three inputs into the switch and four outputs. If I am reading my sys info screen correctly on the inputs, 1=Dual 2=Twin 3=Twin. On the four outputs, 2 are going to the main basement entertainment center (622), one to bedroom (508) and one to living room upstairs (508). There is not an additional switch connected to DP34 (empty connectors on right side of switch). It just occurred to me..DP34 means "3 inputs, 4 outputs"??? and DP44 means "4 inputs, 4 outputs"??????

- How many receivers & tuners are you using?

+ I have three receivers with a total of four tuners (622, 508, 508). The 622 is running software version L365. Both tuners are going to the same TV. The two 508's are running on software P363. The sys info on 508 says device is DP34-500 (does this mean Dish 500?) The 622 does not show the "-500" identifier...just DP34.

- Are you using Cable, OTA-HD, OTA-SD, etc...?

+ I am not using any other OTA, cableTV. Although I do have cable internet, it is totally separate from in-house RJ-6 network. Cable comes in from street, to hub box casing (no connections) and directly to the cable modem located at the hub...then ethernet from cable modem to router...then ethernet from router back to hub to ethernet jacks throughout the house (as well as Wi-Fi).

- Why would you like to run a wire from the Switch to a jack elsewhere in the house?

+ I have two additional cable-ready rooms I would like to use (without getting second switch). One room would get a new receiver and the other room the signal from 622. If one cable to 622 can be used, then a port would open up on switch. I could use that port for 5th TV.

Your 622 should have had a DPP separator in the box.

+ Yes I have i have the DPP separator that came with 622. I also have a couple of diplexors (left over from old install in old house). So I have 1 separator and 2 diplexers. I think I am understanding the separator (splitter) vs diplexer difference. Separator=one signal split into two. Diplexer=two RF signals such as sat and OTA merging onto one line.

Soooooooo, does this help? Can I do one cable to 622 (sans Wiggas diplexer tip)? Sorry for the novel.

 

[Cokeswigga]

Since you are using the DP 34 you cannot use the seperator.

But since you have 2 diplexors, you can back feed the tv2 ouput on one of two lines going to your entertainment center.

Since you are currenty using all 4 tuners, an easy way to add more tuners is to get another DP34 or get a DPP44


If you get the DP 34 you would add it to your switch,
2 lines to the 622 (with the back feed for tv2)
1 line to the 508
1 line to the other 508
other switch
1 line to new receiver
3 lines open for expansion


if you get the DPP 44 you could REPLACE the DP34
1 line to the 622
1 line to the 508
1 line to the other 508
1 line to the new receiver

 

[kaman]

Ok then...I indicated (verbal only) to DISH installer that I intended to use the second cable as output and use 4th port for additional receiver (not owned at the time of install). Should I call DISH and tell them that I needed and requested a DP44 (at least functionality a DP44 gives) at the time of install, and ask for them to switch it out? Will they do it? Is DP44 part of the normal free install if customer has need for it?

Also, I need my DISH realigned anyway...I'm slowly losing some sat 129 channels, even on clear days. I used to not have this issue. I have re-tightened all the connections (except on roof of course), which helped maybe 20%. But install was last May. Is there a statute of limitations for them to fix install issues?

No offense to you DISH "freebie" installers, but I considered going ahead and paying someone else $$ to come out at re-align it and getting better service. I did not like the installer, who didn't even use my PVC pipe/run from attic to basement, like I requested. I put the run in specifically for this purpose and ensured it was easy access. IT WAS NOT EXTRA WORK FOR HIM TO DO SO. Instead he put the cable down the side of my house and drilled through the foundation. He could have easily drilled a hole at the top by the eaves into the attic instead of low, which would have been about three feet from the attic entrance in the garage. And the entrance to the run (top of the pipe) is also about 3 ft from the entrance to attic. So when you enter attic, 3 ft ahead is the run and to your right 3 ft is the hole he could have drilled for the cable. This is all at the tall/open part of the attic, so no squeezing into tight places or fishing cable. The run ends in the basement right at the hub.

 

[SmityWhity]

I'll let someone else provide info on what Dish will or will not do, but as "webbydude" said, I kind of doubt that they will give anything extra unless it's needed for the equipment they are furnishing.

I believe there may be two current software versions for the 508; P363 and P364.
http://www.dishnetwork.com/content/customerCare/technical/software_versions/index.asp

I'm not sure if the screen would should something different if you had a DPP Twin instead of a DP Twin. Maybe someone else has more knowledge. Otherwise, it sounds like you have a Dish 1000 installed to receive 119, 110 & 129. The Dish 1000 comes with a DPP Twin and a DP Dual. It is possible the DPP Twin was replaced with a DP Twin when the DP34 switch was installed.

To add another receiver, you are going to need another Switch. You can buy a DPP44 for under $200 and use the DP34 for a spare; or you can buy another DP34 for under $70, and connect it to the current DP34 which will allow you to have upto 8 tuners.

As stated before, you can use 2 diplexers to back-feed one of the 2 other rooms using the ViP 622 TV2 Output. However, since you prefer not to get another switch, then maybe you get a splitter, and backfeed the 622 RF Output to both of those rooms. Then you could also, turn on TV1 Output, so that both tuners are being backfeed to those two rooms. Then you could buy another UHF PRO remote for the other room to control TV1 when no one is watching it downstairs. Each room could watch a different program, and if they watch recordings, the 622 could record 2 new shows at the same time.

DPP44 - 4 sats, 4 receivers - upto 8 tuners
DP34 - 3 sats, 4 receivers - upto 4 tuners
DPP33 - 3 sats, 3 receivers - upto 6 tuners (not available yet)

TV/Cable Splitters - splits same RF signal to multiple locations; usually can be reversed to combine separate RF signals.
Diplexers - Will combine and then split, 1 sat signal and 1 RF signal; but not 2 of same.
DP Separator - Separates 2 satellite signals, which are combined by a DishPro Plus LNBF or a DishPro Plus Switch. Will only work on a DishPro Plus Receiver (Dual Tuner).

You now know as much as the rest of us.

EDIT: TV/Cable Splitters that work in the higher frequency range will also split a satellite signal; but except for in limited circumstances, it will not work (properly).

 

[webbydude]

Ok then...I indicated (verbal only) to DISH installer that I intended to use the second cable as output and use 4th port for additional receiver (not owned at the time of install). Should I call DISH and tell them that I needed and requested a DP44 (at least functionality a DP44 gives) at the time of install, and ask for them to switch it out? Will they do it? Is DP44 part of the normal free install if customer has need for it?

Also, I need my DISH realigned anyway...I'm slowly losing some sat 129 channels, even on clear days. I used to not have this issue. I have re-tightened all the connections (except on roof of course), which helped maybe 20%. But install was last May. Is there a statute of limitations for them to fix install issues?

No offense to you DISH "freebie" installers, but I considered going ahead and paying someone else $$ to come out at re-align it and getting better service. I did not like the installer, who didn't even use my PVC pipe/run from attic to basement, like I requested. I put the run in specifically for this purpose and ensured it was easy access. IT WAS NOT EXTRA WORK FOR HIM TO DO SO. Instead he put the cable down the side of my house and drilled through the foundation. He could have easily drilled a hole at the top by the eaves into the attic instead of low, which would have been about three feet from the attic entrance in the garage. And the entrance to the run (top of the pipe) is also about 3 ft from the entrance to attic. So when you enter attic, 3 ft ahead is the run and to your right 3 ft is the hole he could have drilled for the cable. This is all at the tall/open part of the attic, so no squeezing into tight places or fishing cable. The run ends in the basement right at the hub.

No offense taken . Going on a limb here and guessing he didn't take advantage of that existing wiring due to grounding and NEC restrictions. Ya know, stuff that can save your equipment from blowing out due to electrical surge; not to mention save his job and ass.

 

[webbydude]

Didn't Dish just issue A DPP-33 swich ,which is a 3 orbital location DPP switch which allows for the use of Seperators..


It's probably cheaper to backfeed the TV2 out on one of the lines using a diplexors.

if you are thinking about an antenna, you can also diplex that too with the other sat-line. You might loose a little signal due to the insetion loss.. but you should be ok.

Ah yes...the mythical DPP33. If you see one, please tell me. Last I heard, there was one strolling down the street, walking alongside Santa, the Easter bunny, and my winning multi-million dollar lotter ticket

 

[kaman]

Just to clarify, the whole "run"/pipe thing had no wiring/cabling. It was just an empty conduit (3" PVC pipe) for easy access to run the future cabling from the future dish to the hub (attic to basement). Of course, from the hub to all the jacks in the house had cabling that came with the house, which was used.

Webby, I see you are in Canton, OH. Do you personally know of any RELIABLE installers in the Cincy area who could come and re-align my DISH correctly and thoroughly? Or if you are coming down this way anytime soon, would you be willing to do it for some extra cash? I suppose this goes for anyone out there, not just Webby. What about you TNGTony, are you an installer (u know where I live from another post)?

 

[webbydude]

Kaman, if I was in the area I would love to do that. But I do have a few questions. How recent was your install? If it's within 90 days and you feel the signal is low and could be better, you are entitled to free service calls during that time. Otherwise, the RSP I'm affiliated with pretty much services the whole state and parts of Indianna and WV. I can give you their number if you feel comfortable with that. Just shoot me a PM.