Really don't know what's wrong

[shankle]

Thanks for trying to help.
The setup with the Pansat 2800a and the Uniden sq530 was working with
the previous dish before the tree incident. The procedure is to turn on
the Uniden and move the dish to whatever location is needed. Then it
is powered off and the Pansat takes over. No wires have been touched.
Last week I was, with the new chaparallel feedhorn, getting goodies on
amc 3 and Intelsat 9 and Q in the 70s. Then I added the guy wires to
center the feedhorn and that's when my problems started.
Today was another disaster. Got exactly nowhere. On G12 I was able
to get the Classic Art Showcase on Analog but it would not come in on
C-band. The best signal I could get was 65 and a Q of Zero.
Same thing up on Amc 3. This is near my Zenith.

These are the things I will try over the next few days.
1. Take off the new chaparral feedhorn and put the 30 year old c-band
feedhorn on and see what happens.
2. Take the guy wires off and leave the old feedhorn on and see what happens.
3. Put the new feedhorn back on and leave the guy wires off and see what happens.
4. ?????????????

 

[Lak7]

The procedure is to turn on
the Uniden and move the dish to whatever location is needed. Then it
is powered off and the Pansat takes over.

Try leaving the Uniden On.

 

[FaT Air]

Could you draw a diagram of how your system is wired, and attach it to your next post? Connections of your disqc, fta/ analog receiver/lnb's. Use MSPaint for this. (Save As: jpg or jpeg) There is something funny going on here because if you can get Classic Arts analog sparkle free, you should have no problem getting it via FTA/Digital. see attached of a typical setup using basically what you have there.
Brain storm here- - what kind of feed LNB setup was on your previous dish? Was it a C/Ku setup, or was it two C band lnb's?

 

[shankle]

To Lak7,
If the Uniden is on, there is no Signal on the screen from the Pansat 2800.
If the Panat is on, there is no signal from the Uniden.

To Fat Air,
I really hate to mess with the wiring. As I said before, it was put it in years
ago.
I can tell you this. There are two wires coming from the dish. One is C-band
and the other is KU. They are controlled by a DISEQ switch in the house.
This is how J. MCDougall installed it years ago. Regularly the function of
the Uniden is to just push the disk. The only reason I am using it to get
some Analog signals now is to get the dish reprogrammed.

I have no choice but to try your method if everything else fails. Would like
to put it off for the time being and try the things I mentioned in my previous
post.

 

[stanleyjohn]

Thanks for trying to help.
The setup with the Pansat 2800a and the Uniden sq530 was working with
the previous dish before the tree incident. The procedure is to turn on
the Uniden and move the dish to whatever location is needed. Then it
is powered off and the Pansat takes over. No wires have been touched.
Last week I was, with the new chaparallel feedhorn, getting goodies on
amc 3 and Intelsat 9 and Q in the 70s. Then I added the guy wires to
center the feedhorn and that's when my problems started.
Today was another disaster. Got exactly nowhere. On G12 I was able
to get the Classic Art Showcase on Analog but it would not come in on
C-band. The best signal I could get was 65 and a Q of Zero.
Same thing up on Amc 3. This is near my Zenith.

These are the things I will try over the next few days.
1. Take off the new chaparral feedhorn and put the 30 year old c-band
feedhorn on and see what happens.
2. Take the guy wires off and leave the old feedhorn on and see what happens.
3. Put the new feedhorn back on and leave the guy wires off and see what happens.
4. ?????????????

If no luck i would start with step 2 first (might be the easiest).Im glad your not giving up!I thought i saw that you was retired!You have plenty of time to get it working.

 

[shankle]

Hi Stanleyjohn,
Thanks for the reply.
To do #2 first makes more sense.

I know how difficult it is to help someone thousands of miles away.
I sometimes do that with computers. I can understand where FaT Air
is coming from. My argument is that I have a hands off approach
to messing with the multitude of wires in the back of my receiver.
To my way of thinking, if I haven't touched the wires and they
worked last week, how is that the problem?
Sure something could fail or it's time to junk the Uniden and get a
G-box. BUT I would like to do a little more checking 1st.
Maybe I should take a picture and you guys could see what I'm up against.

 

[shankle]

Latest test. Took the guy wires off. Didn't make a bit of difference.
But it was late in the day and the sun was shining on the face of the dish
at G12 (133d). I was trying to tune in Classic Arts Showcase and as I loosened
the bolts to change the Azmuth I noticed the face of the dish dropping.
When I got the Classic Arts Showcase tuned in nicely, I tightened the
bolts and don't you know the face of the dish raised. This is what's causing
my problem IMHO. The round pole with a SQUARE mount. Makes for very
difficult adjustment. To difficult for me.

Solution (there are 2 that I can think of) more ideas are welcome.
1. Most expensive - junk dish, buy new one with round mount.
2. Take the dish down and cut the pole so that a sleeve of about 20" or so
will fit over the bottom pole and over the end of the top part. Have holes drilled
and threaded for the Azmuth bolts. Might have to drill a hole at the bottom
part to keep it from sliding to the ground. Then I will have a round pole
and a round sleeve. Leave the original one tightened and never touch it.
Making the sleeve the full length of the pole minus the square part of the mount
would give more stability and could be supported on the concrete.

 

[stanleyjohn]

I wouldnt go with getting a new dish!it looks fine to me.what you can do is look for a new polar mount that would fit your dish and fit snug over the round base pole.These days v or g boxes are cheap!May be a good idea to upgrade and get rid of that rats nest of wires you now have.

 

[FaT Air]

My polar mount is also square, on a round pole. If I were to really loosen my azimuth bolts, it would sag probably 3 to 5 degrees. When i loosen it to adjust azimuth, I only loosen the bolts maybe 1 turn from tight. It's still fairly snug, and only drops a fraction of a degree, but a bump on the edge of the dish will move it that 1/2 degree east or west to see if Q is affected. I leave it that snug, at the end of the arc, so that while driving the dish with the actuator, to look for a Q improvement, it doesn't move the polar azimuth(rotation).
Because you said that you had Classic Arts sparkle free, but nothing when you tried FTA/digital, tells me there is something amiss in your switching set-up. I do believe you didn't do anything at the dish when that was tried in your earlier post. That said -
I would be very helpful to know how your system is wired, to know how H/V and C/Ku switching and selection is accomplished. I think it may point to an obvious thing to check.

 

[shankle]

Ok FaT Air I don't know all the tricks that you do.
I have loosened the bolts quite a bit to move the dish. Guess I was afraid
of warping the dish by pushing to hard.

Will work on the diagrams. Have no idea how long that will take.
At least I won't be in the sun doing it.

 

[FaT Air]

Well, take your time. Maybe at the same time mark the wires, assign each a letter. and mark same on diagram. This will make putting it back together much easier If we have to take any thing apart to diagnose what's going on there. But I think we all agree, there's more than just dish alignment that's a bit off here, as you've said "that's not the way it was". And I think that is where a a lot of your frustration has come from.

 

[stanleyjohn]

Shankle!looks like others have the same type of polar mount as yours!thats good to know.Heres a few tips for you!When removing wires or anything else!Take some close up pics with a digital camera so you know exactly where put them back.Mark your pole with masking tape so if it gets misaligned you know where to go back to.Also when I'm playing with the elevation,declimation angles i wrap a piece of tape on the bottom or top edge of the nut so i know where to put it back too if needed.

 

[shankle]

Thanks guys for your patience with a novice.
I'm a bit exited this morning as I have been dishing it all night.
I do my best analyzing while asleep.
Here is what I have come up with.

1. I have the polar mount from the dish that was destroyed.
It was an Orbitron and had a round polar mount. Why not weld a 1/2 inch
plate on the bottom of the square polar mount and weld the round part to it from the Orbitron?

2. Like I said I haven't touched the wires inside the house. However I
had to connect the wires from the blue box on the Chaparral Corotor
ll Plus. The colors were different and the directions from Chaparral
were bad. Might have it wired wrong.

I will send pictures of the wires on the Chaparral feedhorn when the
sun comes up.

 

[shankle]

Here are the pictures I promised from the previous mesg.

one is of the back of the Uniden that connects to the blus box on the Chaparral Corotor ll PLus.

Another is of the wires and they seem to be done right.

Another is of the piece from the Orbitron that I might be able to use on
the bottom of the square mount.

 

[stanleyjohn]

On that last pic i can see how it might be a pain when making adjustments!Mine is round to round and even with that when i tighten the bolts it can effect the Q somewhat.The secret is to tighten each bolt alittle at a time!not one at a time.Sounds like you got some good ideas on what to do next.Catch you later!hope its a good day.

 

[shankle]

To FaT Air,
Here is the diagram of my wiring that you requested:
See Attached diagram

A. - Actuator motor & Sensors
B. - Grnd, Pulse, Dc6v from the Chaparral Corotor ll Plus
C. - from the Pansat 2800 to the Uniden Ant IN
D. - from the Uniden TV OUT to the Television
E. - C-Band IN to Splitter A
F. - Splitter A to Splitter D
G. - Splitter D to Uniden RF INPUT
H. - Splitter A to Splitter B
I. - Splitter B to Pansat 2800 IF INPUT
J. - Splitter B to Splitter C
K. - Splitter C to Splitter D
L. - KU IN to Splitter C

 

[stanleyjohn]

I may be wrong but i think you would do better using a v box instead of that Uniden!since you say that you use that for moving the dish only.Every time you go threw a splitter you can expect some signal loss and it looks like your doing alot of splitting.You can get a 2x1 Diseqc 22k switch to go from c to ku and a v box can be bought for under $50.Less wires,less sig loss due to no more splitters.Im sure the way you have it did work in the past but i think a upgrade will give you better results.
Update!I know electronics but this satellite stuff is still new to me.What is the blue box on the LNB used for? Power?? If so looks like 6 v which would require a power source not from the receiver or v box and throw all i said above out the window

 

[shankle]

Hi StanleyJohn,
I have been thinking the same thing, BUT how do you set up a dish with a
G-box with no analog as a reference point? The pico peaker I have is practically
useless. There is no reference point with a Pansat 2800. I assume there is
none with the G-box. I know almost nothing about how a G-box works other
than it is a later model than the V-box.

I'm really tempted to dismantle the dish and have the part welded to the base
of the polar mount. As a side benefit it would get me about 12" more off the ground. Also I can then center the feedhorn more accurately with the guy wires
from the ground. Paint a few bolts and pretty it up a bit.

 

[stanleyjohn]

ill keep my thinking cap on and hopefully come up with some more ideas.Lets see what Fat and others come up with.

 

[shankle]

Hi Stanleyjohn,
Don't go with the V-box. It's old technology.
Not my opinion but other guys on here recommend the G-box.
Been doing some reading on this and find that it's made in China.
That worries me. Also It's like the Uniden with old satellites programmed
in that can't be changed. The same problem with the G-box. They can't
be changed either.
I'm totally without TV now and am waiting to hear what FaT Air has to
say about my wiring. Hope he doesn't get to disgusted with me.
Tempted to start dismantling the dish tonight....