No Goltv on Dish?

[boixonoi1]

Here is an interesting one, refreshing our memory that Dish Network was instrumental in GolTV getting off the ground in the first place:

This is what gives me hope that something will be worked out. By virtue of being ahead of the other providers in adding GolTV (and ESPN Deportes (ie CL matches) if I'm not mistaken), I would think that, early on, Dish grabbed a pretty good share of the soccer (particularly Hispanic) fan market. In fact, I remember that when I switched to Dish a few years ago. the amount and variety of soccer available was a marketing theme for Dish Latino. If Dish hasn't bled soccer fans over the last few years, there should be a pretty good bloc of soccer fans they would rather keep than lose. The Setanta preview on Dish Latino and also the fact that Dish has posted a message to viewers in Spanish seem to suggest that Dish are not ignoring this bloc. On the pessimistic side, GolTV has a good deal of leverage with this bloc, and from a PR sense also seems to have the upper hand (justified or not).

You make a good point about Dish not being the only provider to pull stations; however, vis-a-vis Direct they do seem to suffer in comparison. The reputation does get formed whether it is wholly deserved or not.

 

[boixonoi1]

I think the lack of contracts with cable makes it less frustrating when they pull a channel. If you have recently signed a two-year, you probably would be pretty p'd off. So on second thought, maybe Dish does deserve the bad rep compared to Direct.

ESPN does seem well positioned to take back La Liga after this season, as they already have the rights for it for a large chunk of the world. They have the channels that they didn't have a few years ago in English where they can air the matches and ESPN Deportes is more widely available as well. No additional production costs since they already produce studio stuff and the commentary, etc.. in English and Spanish for their international networks.

 

[alexgmny]

Yes....i hope the ESPN would carry La Liga or the Budesliga.....it dont think it will affect the MLS. since i believe the games are on different seasons and also different days. I am not a fan of MLS so i am not sure which days during the week the games are. I say that because the MLS and ESPN have a contract.

But again that will be until next year. I do hope that Goltv and E* come to an agreement soon.

I wonder if Scott has heard any rumors about it.

 

[Rebollos]

I think the lack of contracts with cable makes it less frustrating when they pull a channel. If you have recently signed a two-year, you probably would be pretty p'd off. So on second thought, maybe Dish does deserve the bad rep compared to Direct.

ESPN does seem well positioned to take back La Liga after this season, as they already have the rights for it for a large chunk of the world. They have the channels that they didn't have a few years ago in English where they can air the matches and ESPN Deportes is more widely available as well. No additional production costs since they already produce studio stuff and the commentary, etc.. in English and Spanish for their international networks.

I don't mind ESPN taking back LA LIGA, but showing the games, I remember 10 years ago, more or less, before Fox Sports Americas (now Fox Sports World Espanol) had the rights, ESPN had the rights for LA LIGA in the USA, Do you know how many games they showed?, 0. I recall a Saturday that Barcelona played Real Madrid, and I checked ESPN, and we had TAPE DELAY FISHING. ESPN didn't do much for soccer in this country until recently, and not enough now anyways. ESPN have lots of money, lots of channels, and besides champions league, how many leagues rights they have. The question is not about money, they had EURO 2008 which I assume was not cheap....

 

[boixonoi1]

I don't mind ESPN taking back LA LIGA, but showing the games, I remember 10 years ago, more or less, before Fox Sports Americas (now Fox Sports World Espanol) had the rights, ESPN had the rights for LA LIGA in the USA, Do you know how many games they showed?, 0. I recall a Saturday that Barcelona played Real Madrid, and I checked ESPN, and we had TAPE DELAY FISHING. ESPN didn't do much for soccer in this country until recently, and not enough now anyways. ESPN have lots of money, lots of channels, and besides champions league, how many leagues rights they have. The question is not about money, they had EURO 2008 which I assume was not cheap....

Yeah I remember. The worst was when they sub-licensed the 3rd choice match to whatever Fox Soccer channel was called, while never showing the 1st and 2nd choice matches (meaning no Barca no Madrid). In the 2000-1 season they had matches on PPV on ESPN Extra for 5 or 6 bucks a match if I'm not mistaken, this was better than nothing for me and I gladly paid, although I don't think it worked out so well for ESPN because they quit doing it after one season.

The main difference now would be the fact that ESPN has places to put the matches. Before, they had to put the matches on ESPN2 with a two day delay, and it seems tape delayed fishing got higher ratings. Now ESPN Classic may be a possibility as they have stopped showing classic matches. They've already started airing a 2nd Champions League match (delayed) each matchday. On the Spanish language side, ESPN Deportes (which only in the last couple years has become more available) could handle La Liga no problem. They already have tons of Champions League (Barca and Madrid matches are always here live if they're not live on ESPN2) both live and same day delay. They can show matches live or on demand on broadband Internet on ESPN 360.

I'm generally not a big fan of ESPN. Sportscenter has become unwatchable. I much prefer watching the American football and basketball on any other network. The 2006 World Cup commentary team had me contemplating suicide. And so on. To give them credit where it is due, they are showing more and more Champions League and they did a good job with Euro 2008 (except for the ticker). If they did get the rights to La Liga, hopefully they would get rid of the damn ticker.

I don't think the US rights to Euro were terribly expensive. UEFA are fully aware of soccer's humble place in the US sports marketplace. First, they make a ton of money in the participating countries where pretty much everyone is glued to the TV. Then, they make some more money in soccer-mad countries that aren't participating. Finally, they pick up a few pennies from indifferent countries like ours. What was important to UEFA was increased exposure within the US market. Euros 2000 and 2004 were on PPV through Setanta for about $200 for the whole tournament I think, which limited viewership significantly. You can't capture any channel zappers when the matches are shown on PPV. The beauty of Euro 2008 was that everyone came out a winner. UEFA got players a lot more exposure in the US, which means more familiarity with players participating in the Champions League and UEFA Cup, which will mean a higher US audience for these competitions, which then eventually means more money (not a ton but still..). ESPN got better than expected ratings and critical praise, plus they will also benefit from the exposure as they carry the CL, which eventually means more money. Viewers got to see a great tournament in HD without having to pay extra $$ beyond their normal bill, plus they get the prospect that this success will encourage more top level soccer programming in the US.

Another thing to consider is the fact that the Spanish federation looks on with envy at how much more effectively the Premiership has maximized international television and marketing revenues. Barca and Madrid market themselves pretty well, but as a whole, La Liga's international potential (meaning profits) is not being fully exploited. They may prefer to partner with ESPN because of its importance and power in the US sports television landscape (see UEFA Euro 2008 above). The open question is whether the Spanish federation can overcome its own Byzantine political battles to do this (Worldsport HD viewers will know what I mean).

 

[kstuart]

I also follow alpine skiing, so I have plenty of "painful" experiences of what ESPN can do to a sport, when they are not interested !

However, when they are interested, they can do a very nice job. The Thursday Night MLS matches generally have terrific HD camera work that would make any US fan of European soccer say that they wished they could see those matches look that good.

In terms of soccer analysis and commentary, there are vast differences of opinion and tastes regarding that, but most have to admit that Andy Gray is one of the best, and ESPN opting to give him a paid US vacation during Euro2008 shows someone there has a clue.

Lastly, the ESPN sports bar in Vegas is awesome - not only a wall covered with feeds of a dozen different events, but also an LCD monitor on your table with a remote as well. And, the food and drink was amazingly good for a sports bar.

So, ESPN are capable both of screwing up completely, or doing an excellent job...

 

[gdodd12]

The "sports pack" for $12 has both fox soccer and Gol Tv ..
So you can add the sports pack to whatever base package you need.



I'm getting a "discount" price right now with $18 or so per month for a years basic discount - then $10 per month for two years for a AAA deal etc etc ...

But I have the plus HD DVR ... for $72.99 per month .. + $12 sports pack + HD extra pack = $90 per month total price .. this includes HD, DVR fee's, locals etc etc

I only have one DVR on the account.

with dish a similar service would be ... Americas top 250 - $55 + $5 for locals + $20 for HD + $6 for equipment fee's = $86 total price. (i could not figure out from the website what the difference between HD gold and HD platinum was. But as i have the HD extra pack with directv - i would guess HD platinum was the equivalent)

So dish would work out to be $4 less per month for me ... but i can deal with the $4 price difference because i prefer the HD (speed HD was one of my Must-haves and Dish does not have my local HD's) , customer service, DVR software, and the peace of mind of knowing that my channels won't be pulled at the first sign of a contract dispute.

This is not counting the $18 per month for 12 month and $10 per month for 24 months discounts that i am getting... which makes the total package for me $24 cheaper for the first 12 months - then $6 cheaper for the next 12 months.

If you only want FSC and GOL .. i'm guessing that you could add the $12 sports pack to a lower tiered package ?



As i said - it will be different for everyone - for me Directv is the best choice right now - for you it may not be .. that is why having a choice is good

Ok, so I was right then. When you don't factor in the sign up deals, the same package with DirectTV plus a few more HD channels is about $25 a month more. But yeah, if you like switching providers all the time, that is the way to go I guess. Not sure what you are talking about with DVR software. The DVR is great for Dish, as I am sure it is for DirecTV.

 

[gdodd12]

Here is an interesting one, refreshing our memory that Dish Network was instrumental in GolTV getting off the ground in the first place:

Yeah. That is why I got Dish many years ago. A friend told me how I could watch Serie A games. He told me how Dish was the only one carrying GolTV.

 

[mrsdrgn]

One of the reason that I switched to D* is because of E* always had problems with contract negotiations. Always loosing channels. Even temporrary loos bothered me. I don't mind paying a little extra for good service. But to wake up one morning and not have my favorit channel on? I don't think so! And that's what I did nol like about E*. At least give us some notice. Good luck to all of you E* subscribers.

Happy D* customer enjoying GolTV and all the other channels that E* has problems negotiating.

 

[tfultz]

Happy D* customer enjoying GolTV and all the other channels that E* has problems negotiating.

Thanks for rubbing it, mate

As for ESPN carrying La Liga, like everyone else said, it depends what ESPN does with it. The 08 Euros were better than I expected and I had more comments regarding it from non-footie people than the WC, mostly in the form of 'Is your Celtics team in this tournament' but at least it showed that ESPN can give some major exposure when it wants to.

If ESPN commits to carrying live matches in the US and not tape delaying or interrupting a derby for NASCAR, fishing, ice dancing, etc I'd be happy for them. La Liga would probably dwarf the EPL stateside due to our large Latin/Spanish communities if ESPN can give it the proper exposure.

 

[ehren]

thank good p2p streaming of GolTV is available, not bad quality too, about 800k

 

[Rebollos]

I checked with 13 people, some of them friends of mine, all have Dish and love soccer. 11 of those 13 will switch to a company that will carry Goltv by the end of the month if the problem is not resolved. The other will consider swithing but they would like to have more info, like who is at fault in this situation. If we apply this percentage nationwide with this many people willing to switch, and they don´t care who is right or if they have to pay more in order to have Goltv, I think Dish could be facing losing a lot of customers.....

 

[Airblair]

Big time soccer fan here.

I can't say where I heard this . . . mostly because I can't remember. I'm not creative enough to make this up.

But the rumor is that ESPN is going to significantly alter ESPN Classic. It's going to get rid of the reruns, change the name, and make it a soccer channel. It's going to compete with Setanta, FSC, and GolTV.

This includes going after US rights for the Premiereship, La Liga, and the Bundesliga.

They've already made a significant investment in MLS--10 years and $150 million. That alone covers half of the league's payroll. ESPN is already the go-to provider for the US Men's and Women's National Teams and the World Cup, and their excellent Euro 08 coverage (most games were live and broadcast in HD, using UK announcers who actually had a clue) got great ratings.


So if Dish knows this, and Dish knows that Gol TV's rights for the latter two leagues are expiring . . . then doesn't everyone here agree that Dish has Gol TV over a barrel?

Charlie didn't become rich by locking himself into crappy contracts.


EDIT: Here's where I heard it.

 

[boixonoi1]

If ESPN commits to carrying live matches in the US and not tape delaying or interrupting a derby for NASCAR, fishing, ice dancing, etc I'd be happy for them. La Liga would probably dwarf the EPL stateside due to our large Latin/Spanish communities if ESPN can give it the proper exposure.

On the Spanish language side, there is absolutely zero doubt that the matches would be live on ESPN Deportes. If I'm not mistaken, La Liga gets the highest ratings in its time slot in Spanish speaking households. On the English language side, I especially could see problems during college football season in the fall. One question, does anyone know what the ESPN alternate channels are or can be used for? I speak Spanish so it doesn't matter so much if they screw up on the English side, but I can understand how ESPN could be a pain in the ass compared to GolTV for non Spanish speakers.

 

[kstuart]

The big advantage of ESPN is that we might see those matches in HD...

PS Boixonoi - did you ever play poker semi-professionally ?

 

[boixonoi1]

Big time soccer fan here.

I can't say where I heard this . . . mostly because I can't remember. I'm not creative enough to make this up.

But the rumor is that ESPN is going to significantly alter ESPN Classic. It's going to get rid of the reruns, change the name, and make it a soccer channel. It's going to compete with Setanta, FSC, and GolTV.

This includes going after US rights for the Premiereship, La Liga, and the Bundesliga.

They've already made a significant investment in MLS--10 years and $150 million. That alone covers half of the league's payroll. ESPN is already the go-to provider for the US Men's and Women's National Teams and the World Cup, and their excellent Euro 08 coverage (most games were live and broadcast in HD, using UK announcers who actually had a clue) got great ratings.


So if Dish knows this, and Dish knows that Gol TV's rights for the latter two leagues are expiring . . . then doesn't everyone here agree that Dish has Gol TV over a barrel?

Charlie didn't become rich by locking himself into crappy contracts.

It would make good business sense for ESPN. The three top leagues (Eng, Spa, Ita) play matches for the most part at different times. Consolidating them on one channel plus having Champions could do well.

I don't know if Dish has GolTV over a barrel. La Liga fans will switch to Direct or cable and will have no reason to switch back to Dish if and when GolTV loses La Liga. Especially if they have to pay Dish on the way out to break a contract.

 

[boixonoi1]

The big advantage of ESPN is that we might see those matches in HD...

PS Boixonoi - did you ever play poker semi-professionally ?

Yes, the HD possibilities would increase. That would be great. La Liga in HD was pretty sweet while it lasted. No, never played poker. Why?

 

[cky27]

In response to Airblair, I've heard similar rumors. Although most of what I've heard had more to do with ESPN buying Setanta USA outright, instead of competing with them. I don't have any doubt that the loss of La Liga and/or the Bundesliga would kill Goltv.

As for Bundesliga matches on Dish, is anyone in the forum familiar with ( pardon the butchering of the spelling) Die Sieben Welt. I thought I saw that Bundesliga games are available (in German of course ) their. I'd appreciate any answers forum members can provide

 

[jokeworm]

Ok, so I was right then. When you don't factor in the sign up deals, the same package with DirectTV plus a few more HD channels is about $25 a month more.

nope - $4 per month more ... (but of course i am also getting more channels) when you factor in the sign up deals its $25 per month less expensive.




The following prices are with zero discounts ..

I have the plus HD DVR ... for $72.99 per month .. + $12 sports pack + HD extra pack = $90 per month total price .. this includes HD, DVR fee's, locals etc etc

I only have one DVR on the account.

with dish a similar service would be ... Americas top 250 - $55 + $5 for locals + $20 for HD + $6 for equipment fee's = $86 total price. (i could not figure out from the website what the difference between HD gold and HD platinum was. But as i have the HD extra pack with directv - i would guess HD platinum was the equivalent)

So dish would work out to be $4 less per month for me

 

[alexgmny]

Anyways..................................Any news out there about E* and GolTV coming to an aggrement?

Have you heard anything Scott?