Need help re-starting a DSR 922 for use w/FTA receiver
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Would be great except I no longer have the analog module. Will have to peak digitally.
An LNBF must be installed with the vertical and horizontal probes at the correct angle (skew). The vertical axis of the dish is the 6/12 o'clock angles when the dish is aimed at the top of the arc (true South). The "0" (zero) skew marker on the rear of the LNBF will be installed in this vertical axis. To state it another way, the zero skew marking on the rear of the LNBF will be aimed at either the 6 o'clock position (straight down) or the 12 o'clock position (straight up) when the dish is parked at the apex of the arc.
Since most of us do not work on the feedhorn when the dish is at the top of the arc and high up in the air, we have a trick to identify the correct angle to install our feedhorns even when we have the dish aimed much lower angle near the horizon on the ends of the arc. To do this, position the dish at the top of the arc (aimed directly towards true south) and mark the bottom rim of the dish for the 6 o'clock position. Now when you swing the dish East or West, you always know that the feedhorn's vertical axis will be aimed at this mark, no matter where you are parked on the arc.
Not tricky at all!
- In advance of the install, go to a web site like Sathint.com or www.global-cm.net and copy one or two transponder frequencies for active channels on each satellite that you wish to find. I would suggest transponders with many channels, a high symbol rate and DVBS (MPEG2) if possible. These wide signals are much easier to find!
- Place the DVBS S2 receiver in the installation menu and select one of the referenced active transponders for the satellite that you are attempting to locate.
- Now use the 4DTV to move to this satellite. Once the dish has moved to the position selected by the 4DTV, observe the DVBS/S2 signal meter reading at the bottom of the install screen. The Signal Quality meter reading will turn green and peak when the dish aiming is optimized.
- If the signal quality reading is not displaying a good reading, SLOWLY swing the dish across the section of the arc where the satellite is located until the Signal Quality meter reading displays a green signal reading and the level is peaked.
- Now save the dish position on the 4DTV like you always have done in the past.
- Perform a Blind Scan of the satellite for "FREE" channels.
Once the scan is complete, select the next satellite and repeat these steps for each satellite.
Often installers just set the arc with there meter and walk away without showing to the customer that each satellite that the customer wishes to receive is programmed into the IRD. While it is useful for the technician to verify that the dish is tracking the arc, you may want to pay him a few more dollars to program each of the satellites into the 4DTV IRD. This will save you considerable time. Even if your installer is going to use his Birdog meter, it would be a great time saver for you to have him locate and save each satellite position on the 4DTV that you wish to receive.
I am heading up to Oroville, CA in a week or so to pick-up a 65' crank-up tower and an amateur radio beam antenna that I bought off of Craigslist. Might have a few hours to help you in exchange for some help loading the trailer....
Titanium, this is very much what I was looking for...a guide. Thank you!!!
Hey that's a very generous offer, and I would gladly reciprocate, but I was in a bad car wreck a few years ago and cannot lift much of anything, let alone a 65' radio tower (yikes!), otherwise you could count me in! Oh I'm fine, walking, driving, usual work for our summer camp that I help run and some of it is indeed physical, but lifting :-\
A good meal and a cool beverage, I can offer that!
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The VCII module was only for descrambling the channel,not receiving it.There are no VCII channels anymore anyway.As I mentioned earlier,there is only 1 analog channel left,Cspan on "C3" channel 7,in the clear unscrambled analog.It's not that far from "G5",try moving the dish there and see if you can get it.
Gotcha...I thought you had to have a VCII module for receiving any analog. Thanks for clarifying!
I use the 2 analogs; both ends of arc progress towards the perfect arc; which is all satellite in the arc that can be received in the end. No cutting tree's; no interference. To start, I do use the existing system and check those two channels (now only one 24 hr. day channel CSPAN) with any analog receiver. The splitter is then installed onto the system for slaving a DVB-S/S2 typed receiver to these analog systems. The DVB-S2 receiver will then "show quality" or "not"; from the existing feedhorn typed older styles. If it does get the qualities from the c band dish as the arc is moved through; then the dish is arced; isn't it? And the "system" is working; and moving; and polarity is changed by the old 4dtv still, right? Then, any part on it can be replaced with "lnbf"; "motor controller"; and "receiver"; easily by the owner; only by changing out the feed system (with lnbf); and wiring the inside correctly for the equipment list (like a two way splitter; with control of lnbf assembly (signals) by the DVB-S2 receiver; and the 4dtv still receiving this loop out typical supplied by the single port passive dc splitter...The lnbf assembly is now controlled by DVB-S2; the 4DTV (slave) position's the dish and has cspan and AMC 15; the power and control of the feed is now done by the DVB-S2 (master). Easy!
The LNBf will work upside down (180 out also); may require perfect one way or the other; to get the sweet spot of the dish and its installation. An LNBf will work backwards (90 degree's out); but requires a blind scan; or "programming of the receiver" backwards; (h->v) to make it show quality correctly. And because quality is so very important; it is important for the channel/TP you know has a perfect set-lnbf quality (known signal) to identify an exact polarity is correct. And Titanium is the Equipment guy for sure (I like the Jellybean instructions; they work great Amiko A9)!
1) When the LNBf is set onto the dish; it will be 90 out; or 180 out; or 80 noto; by the time's or ways you skew it onto the dishes H/V of signal observance; and when you do; try to find the perfect H/V by using the clock of the face of the dish, at aim! Or it will be 10 dredgrees off; but it will only work when "perfectly" placed (adjust for max perfection of the H/V; and scalar use for prime focusing)...it will not get much better than it already is....more channels; add add...........What a problem is something that must be solved; I picked up an old c band dish the other day; AND IT HAD NO DECL. bolt to adjust; so i locked it into a cell of its own; static on one satellite; usd it for my HDTV today! However, if i sold it to somebody else, I would need to set that property; for their location only with a motor and controller and lnbf; but the dish to move across the arc correctly will still need fixing; for the next spot it can go...
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Thanks for the guidance here! I did find two analogs today, C-Span on C3 and I think a shopping channel on C4 or nearby, and also a DC II lock on G1 03 (the old Motorola stream, something is there), but can't find much else going eastward - maps are far too old.
Ran into a snag today that I started a separate thread on - I do not have W5 (AMC 18) in my system. Not sure if you've messed with a 4DTV in awhile or not, but any substitute tiles I could use in its place? 922 will be a dish mover only, polarity will be controlled by the FTA receiver & LNBF. The testing I'm doing now is the existing system, no new toys yet.
The shopping channel is still there?It was supposed to be gone by now,that's why I didn't mention it,that is "C4".
Do you have "W1"already programmed in your sat list?If so move the dish there and see if you can get a DCII lock on channel 300.If you get a lock there you're right next door to "W5".For the next step,if you have the ku coax connected to the 922,remove it,this will prevent accidentally downloading the Canadian maps,which could really screw up your receiver.
OK,with the dish on W1 with a lock on ch300,go to Program satellites,find "X4",highlight it and press enter,if X4 had been programmed in before choose "change settings"if not you should already be on the move dish screen.Don't pay any attention to the "move dish to"number,it will be for the old "X4" which was a different sat.Arrow down to Dish Position and move the dish west 2 degrees,count in your head,1,2,3 and you should be close.Press Go Back to Save and then exit out of all that.
Now go to channel 280 and see if you get a lock,if you do you're there,just need to peak for best quality,just use the arrow keys.If no lock use the arrow keys to home in on it,you shouldn't be to far off.
Once you do get a DCII lock just leave it there,it should download the new maps for X4,it may only take a minute or it may take quite awhile,but you should notice when the maps change.Once you have the new maps,go to channel 937 and you should be hearing the oldies.Music (FREE) channels are from 900 to 940.
You are now on W5 which is now called X4 but in either case is really AMC18.
One small problem: I don't have W1 300. The channels go to 400, then a random handful of channels up through the 900's and that's it.
Also, there is an X4, but no 280...a few in the 100's, some at higher numbers but not much else.
However I completely follow your technique here in finding W5 / AMC 18 and tried to do something similar today, using W1 as a guide, but then realized the maps were so old that it may end up taking a tech with a signal meter at the dish to bring in W5 + using either X4 as you suggested here or a generic placeholder for W5.
I think you've got a great solution here, but is there another channel other than 300 that will work? I probably stopped updating maps when I shut off all paid programming around 2008 or so...
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Each satellite DC-2 lock relies upon have moved some of their "mapping" to different satellites. The only update satellite for them is the W5 mapped TP (for pay tv only systems) and satellite services of DC3 are now cable only TP's by only commercial devices, MPEG-4 today for the Moto boxing. If you enter the W5 satellite; it will re-map the W5 pay tv mapping that is new ; the problem is if any interruptions occur (loss of signal at the wrong time) ... If you are not going to use any pay tv from skyvision; leaving it out will keep the receiver from putting any new satellite mapping into the 4DTV (but many locking of DC2 channels will not be correct). I believe most of the problem in the new mapping system had been resolved by now; but if you map them; it is the map's problem (as well as the count overflow problem; or any of the other's) that you do not have now by not mapping it with the new data.
Your system is working already; and you cook too; I will be over in a while! TV on -> what a blast!
And the VC-2+ module problem is a switch in the back of the 920/922 case; that shuts the power off if the vc2+ module is not seated into its socket. I believe the switch has been removed by software; but in the old days; the switch was just hotwired to always keep the power on.
The positioner in the 4DTV is the best ever made; so far. Once the two limits are in it; and the far east (or west) satellite is put into memory; you can program the positions very easily by calling the satellite names and positions (already in the 4DTV program satellite menu), AND THE DISH MOVES EXACTLY TO THEM making the first USALS (but 4DTV is better); as it can also ID THE SAT AT THE SAME TIME (but is not doing it this way for it is consumer good). These auto-count to satellite positions determine if the dish is a perfectly arced dish; the arc is programmed only by buttons easier than all the rest of the controllers. This powerful position is made up with both types of counters (high/low/mid counting mechanism's can all be used too); it is how good they are that determines how well the 4DTV counts to its many positions; and returns properly each time.
Once you program it this way; the DVB-S2 receiver "is then installed; old school" using a 2-way single port power passive splitter to slave the 2nd receiver to the 4DTV. Or "it being a LNBf" also; for the DVB-S2 receiver to use the power pass port instead to control the LNBf; and the 4DTV to be the slave; with only positioning and analog what it does.
right now (my opin only), the best DVB-S2 receiver is the Amiko A9 running Jellybean (and can stream tv to your Android/iPhone/smartphone; as it is one itself). all the new DVB-S2's are getting this "double" connection; one for their satellite dish; and one for internet tv hooked up to your network wiring or wireless; to watch tv on a pc (and on your HDTV). The A9 has voice control; where you set up your commands via your own voiced words; neat and tidy.
I use a microHD because it is my last receiver; and I ran out of GEOSATpro hdvr1200 also. The 1200 is a great little receiver; and recommend it in novice (non-computer geek; easy button) roads I travel; mainly because it has auto-update for itself (in fta mode only, a first) on a satellite; G19 Ku TP (FTA ONLY receiver too); that is keeping itself up to date with their satellites changes; and is a 16psk (top of the day) DVB-S2 and H.264 receiver also; that worked great on my c band dish (and still will once i get some more boxes).
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Okay try this,goto W1 and use generic CE ch180 and you should get a DC lock,should even say "this channel not available"on screen.Now goto Program Sats and choose CF ch100 and move the dish west and you should get a DCII lock,you should now be on AMC18/W5/X4.If that all worked,now program X4 into that position,try every channel and see if you can find a lock.Aslo check in Parental Controls and make sure that none of the channels are locked out.
If you can't get any of the old X4 channels to lock,there is another way to do it but it involves manual tuning and I'd have to find the instructions.
After the arc is determined to be "perfect" by using your 4DTV; using both limits and one manually programmed satellite name in the perfect position (these are the feature); then the pre-programmed satellites (their location does not rellly change; only the name and map points). So a satellite at 95W is always moved to no matter the name (but you must re-map for the features to work perfectly). Keep all the original names matched with their positions first; and make sure that the names other than those you used already making the moved to arc and named "old" convention; are only generic's entered into the memory of the 4dtv receiver..
Then you need the receiver to fit your bidding; features; features; features; but when you are on a C Band dish; you better get the better ones; cuz the old ones are every year changed in format somehow; the broadcasters depend on Moores Law (every year) ho, ho, ho like they are santa's themselves giving gifts! Well, that is what they are doing. Their FTA broadcasting!
And every 2-5 years; I get the newest best one also to keep up with them. Right now; they are running into a glass ceiling, ho, ho, ho...
4DTV mapping done by a satellite signal does program the new names and exact positioning and codec and everything to do with the 4DTV receiver keeping itself up-to date with ALL of the changes that occur; THAT THEY PROGRAM THEMSELVES with a satellite signal. Because of the thousands of changes; and dATED-NEST they have done for the past 30 years; this is a very involved part of the 4DTV you are working on; and if you do it yourself; requires a very light touch compared to them doing it. Keeping additions in Generic satellite formats allows it to continue working how you programmed it. It just cannot get itself any newer than its manufactured dated software you are using; and if you get off of the old; the new programming you do to it will mess up the one feature you need; positioning. Keep it without updating; keep it in its old time and name zone.
This means that you can program the positions as if it was the last updated satellite name list (factory reset machine); there is no way to change it without new software loaded by them. The dish then moves correctly to each of the old named positions; and the new generic names and positions also. There is no way to back it up; but there is no way for a new map to mess it up either. That is all you can do. Do not put anything generically into your programming that is the same position and named word for it that matches ant other name (the micro "looks it up" it front to back for matching name; then move; commands). Any other named the same would make it think very funny; like a trick was pulled; and it will revert to nothing and do nothing; cuz of 2 the same; or a changed name is no longer there) typical mind in play.
Keeping the named positions factory fresh allows the " C Band USALS" to kick the answer back to you; is it counting correctly? Is it a perfectly arced dish? Then you start watching TV again. To get the 1000 channels to scan; is going to be where you want to spend your time programming; as this takes me a day or more; professionally; to accomplish. I use a channel list made for my DVB-S2 receiver I am using (then I replicate this in 10 seconds for anybody else)!!!@@@!!! This is what you can back up; make fresh with new dates; new software; new channels; A CHANNEL LIST; is a beauty for ease of use (to start, this one for the 1200 is full of C Band FTA channels from 2013 for the 1200 only?); and is provided in software by the equipment manufacturer for their equipment only; that you can DATE; PERFECT for yours or any Satellite TV System of the same brand and model; and is completely legal for use (on your system, or anybody elses); very powerful; they are!
Then you need the receiver to fit your bidding; features; features; features; but when you are on a C Band dish; you better get the better ones; cuz the old ones are every year changed in format somehow; the broadcasters depend on Moores Law (every year) ho, ho, ho like they are santa's themselves giving gifts! Well, that is what they are doing. Their FTA broadcasting!
And every 2-5 years; I get the newest best one also to keep up with them. Right now; they are running into a glass ceiling, ho, ho, ho...
4DTV mapping done by a satellite signal does program the new names and exact positioning and codec and everything to do with the 4DTV receiver keeping itself up-to date with ALL of the changes that occur; THAT THEY PROGRAM THEMSELVES with a satellite signal. Because of the thousands of changes; and dATED-NEST they have done for the past 30 years; this is a very involved part of the 4DTV you are working on; and if you do it yourself; requires a very light touch compared to them doing it. Keeping additions in Generic satellite formats allows it to continue working how you programmed it. It just cannot get itself any newer than its manufactured dated software you are using; and if you get off of the old; the new programming you do to it will mess up the one feature you need; positioning. Keep it without updating; keep it in its old time and name zone.
This means that you can program the positions as if it was the last updated satellite name list (factory reset machine); there is no way to change it without new software loaded by them. The dish then moves correctly to each of the old named positions; and the new generic names and positions also. There is no way to back it up; but there is no way for a new map to mess it up either. That is all you can do. Do not put anything generically into your programming that is the same position and named word for it that matches ant other name (the micro "looks it up" it front to back for matching name; then move; commands). Any other named the same would make it think very funny; like a trick was pulled; and it will revert to nothing and do nothing; cuz of 2 the same; or a changed name is no longer there) typical mind in play.
Keeping the named positions factory fresh allows the " C Band USALS" to kick the answer back to you; is it counting correctly? Is it a perfectly arced dish? Then you start watching TV again. To get the 1000 channels to scan; is going to be where you want to spend your time programming; as this takes me a day or more; professionally; to accomplish. I use a channel list made for my DVB-S2 receiver I am using (then I replicate this in 10 seconds for anybody else)!!!@@@!!! This is what you can back up; make fresh with new dates; new software; new channels; A CHANNEL LIST; is a beauty for ease of use (to start, this one for the 1200 is full of C Band FTA channels from 2013 for the 1200 only?); and is provided in software by the equipment manufacturer for their equipment only; that you can DATE; PERFECT for yours or any Satellite TV System of the same brand and model; and is completely legal for use (on your system, or anybody elses); very powerful; they are!
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That should work, and am trying it as I type this, but something is messed up. I cannot get a lock on W1 using CE 180 at that position. I've tried slowly moving the dish east and west a few ticks, nothing. Maybe the skew is off? There does not appear to be an option to change the skew for CE but that might be because I'm in Program Sats?
Hold the phone, I think you might have helped me nail this! I never did get a lock on W1, but from the existing position in the receiver, I programmed CF 100 and moved west, and hit a DCII lock, Quality 99. Is this W5? I don't have KU hooked up so I'm sure I didn't move as far west as Anik lol...
Edit: I just programmed X4 in this spot as you suggested and have a lock on 18 X4 channels starting at 251. Says This Channel is Not Available. Somehow I think we are on AMC 18?
Let me know...whew! Now just a matter of finding some of these other random satellites, although should be easier as they are already programmed in & should be close...I have no idea how to get W1 tho.
Thanks!
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That should be it.Now try putting X4 in the same spot and see if you can get any of the channels to lock.Don't forget to go into Parental Controls to make sure none of the X4 channels are locked out.
I was able to get a lock on 18 channels on X4 (edited my message above a bit late sorry), so this must be it. Now to figure out how to get locks on some of these others like W1, G4, T5 etc. For the moment I feel secure in knowing that the dish is indeed following the arc pretty well, but each of the satellites need a little tweaking. Thank you for helping me get AMC 18!
One thing that the maps cannot receive anymore are MPEG-IV (DC-3); which they remove manually by replacing their transmitter/receiver gear. But it should still lock; right? No, it is not "backwards" compatible (like a DVB-S/S2 meter; or lock does); it is digicipher and is really way to old to look for; almost today; but gone tomorrow. Do not get me wrong; the meter on a 4DTV is extremely good; it just isn't used by the cable companies; anymore; and fun is fun; right?
Sure makes the process that much more interesting and throws a lot more variables into the mix that we didn't have 10 years ago! This used to be so much easier haha... we shall see how easy once I get set up with FTA!
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