Is there a way to request OTA guide data?
- Thread starter benjamindorsey
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You are correct. Last week I purchased the CM DVR+ during the one day sale for my OTA needs and took all of them off my Dish box. It is so nice to have all the sub channels listed. This WILL make it easier to drop Dish. None of the local Atlanta sub channels on either my 722 or 211 have ever had sub listings on the guide. Seems like a simple fix. Now just have to get the wife acclimated to the CM DVR+ and Dish will no longer have to worry about any more requests for local guide data from me.
I tried to find the very, very long thread in which the Dish rep stated clear as day that Dish is no longer adding or correcting sub-channel guide data but the search function has a limit on the number of results it returns.
Yep So many threads on it, hard to choose just one
Scott said Dish told him they aren't going to do anything in this thread
http://www.satelliteguys.us/xen/threads/need-ota-guide-info-updated-dirt-member.346573/page-2
The 2nd thread with posts of the missing channels
http://www.satelliteguys.us/xen/threads/report-dish-guide-issues-here.346644/
This one a Dish email said they didn't have the bandwidth to supply guide info
http://www.satelliteguys.us/xen/threads/no-new-ota-guide-data.342499/#post-3539748
I think this is the first thread from 2011 with guide issues popping up
http://www.satelliteguys.us/xen/threads/ota-epg-info-incorrect-or-displaying-digital-service.246013/
I did find better results, including the last thread you linked (yes, it was started in 2011 .... says a lot !!), after I added search terms. I guess we can hope that Dish might change their mind.... 
Thanks for all of the replies and information. I'd have to personally say this seems like quite the blind spot by Dish in terms of providing a seamless experience.
YOU are the example of the kind of customer I was trying to describe. "This will make it easier to drop Dish" was your quote. That's what I mean about keeping Subs by providing the sub-channel data from which ALL OTA via Dish subscribers benifit, and those subs can't be that expensive for Dish. In other words, they are far more likely to be making money on you if you stayed, maybe not a fat whale account, but with a DVR and constant payment for a monthly Dish package, they can begin to make money on your soon enough and KEEP, rather than LOSE subscribers.
Now, maybe Ergen believes he is making it too easy to get the low cost package and OTA and not get a big enough return on that, and he wants you to go to CM DVR+ or the TiVo option. That's stubborn Charlie. Please, this is NOT the 1990's when Dish could be out of business very easily. Dish can now afford a small enhancement to KEEP subscribers.
Well, it would be nice if during some interview (or the now ceased Charlie Chats) we could get an idea of why Dish refuses to provide all sub-channel EPG data. I think that is what we all really want: a sense of IF it is EVER going to change, and the reason why or why not, accept it, and move on. Those Chats and Forums did get more about marketing in the later years, but we could still glean some idea as to how or what Dish is thinking in regard to economics be it about channels, services, or features. Now we get NOTHING!
I remember someone alluding to that some time ago, and glad the links are not provided
TiVo Roamio and Mini's are good products, but the Mini's have some big and small annoying limitations compared to the Joeys. Hopper, Genie, and TiVo Roamio are in the same top 3 class with TiVo a solid 3rd place, but superior to the CM DVR+, especially if TiVo maintains the total $399 for Roamio OTA box and Lifetime. Replacing the smaller capacity OTA HDD with a much higher capacity HDD is as simple as pulling the old one OUT and connecting the NEW one, and booting it up. Thta's it! All done. No special steps. It's that brain dead easy with Roamio's. The CM DVR+ can become more expensive and limiting depending upon the needs of the household. However, with SlingTV built in, the DVR+ is still compelling.
Bandwidth, or more precisely, the size of the file downloaded to our DVR's during EPG data updates may be legitimate because even back to the old Tech Forums, Mark Jackson did comment on how HUGE the file was at that time (they eventually had to compress the file), and I can imagine how all those sub-channels all over the USA could be a MASSIVE, hyper massive file, even with compression. However, my earlier suggestion of using our internet connections to send at least SOME of the EPG data to take the pressure off of the sat or the size of the file sent by sat could be one solution. The file via internet could be files based upon regions to keep the file from being too large.
Of course, this will take a little bit of effort and initial cost along with server space, but it can reward Dish in the long run, IMHO. I really do think this is more of a stubborn Charlie issue. He just won't go there and views it as sucking up his servers and traffic on the backbone.
Of course, this will take a little bit of effort and initial cost along with server space, but it can reward Dish in the long run, IMHO. I really do think this is more of a stubborn Charlie issue. He just won't go there and views it as sucking up his servers and traffic on the backbone.
That's not even necessary. I mean, ideally it would download in the background and there's no urgency that it be downloaded in a 1/2 second vs it taking 2 minutes.
DISH added the program info for Antenna TV in Tampa sometime last year, and added LAFF TV a month ago. So if that post was made it certainly isn't true. In addition WWSB, not the main ABC channel in Tampa did have program guide data, then it disappeared, and that returned at the beginning of the year.
AND in addition to all that, they added the info for a Latino channel at 62.1 at some point relatively recently I don't know when. Oddly it only had 62.2 info at one time.
Channels 10.2 and 28.2 ? Did those channel numbers already exist and have a different network (like a "weather" channel) before ?
I've seen that happen and what it was is the station changed the TSID (Transport Stream ID). When they did that, Dish lost the reference number they use to match up and display the guide data. If they change it back, the guide data on Dish's side auto-magically reappears.
That sounds like what happened to the guide data for WMFD (012-00 on Dish but 068-01 OTA) years ago. When Dish first launched WMFD, the guide data was properly mapped to the OTA channel, but at some point the guide data mapping got broken and it has never been fixed. 068-01 still only says "Digital Service" in spite of the fact that Dish actually carries that channel. I guess Dish is trying to map the guide data to 012-01. There is a 012-01 in my guide, but the TSID is missing. (012-01 is labeled as "DTV" which is common for channels appearing on their actual RF channel numbers rather than being mapped to their virtual channel numbers.) If Dish could recognize that the guide data for 012-00 is supposed to be mapped to 068-01, then the guide data would reappear on both 068-01 and 012-01. (At least, that is the way it works for other OTA channels that have guide data and show up in the guide on both the virtual channel number and the "DTV" channel number.)
Your only hope is to get the TV station to change it back to what it was. Dish isn't likely to fix it. I learned about this many years ago through the "Dayton HDTV local channel" thread at AVS. One member had a list of the local channels and their TSID values and one day, a few of us with Dish reported that the guide data went missing. That person checked the actual TSID, checked his records, and said "the station changed the TSID". We had two options - ask Dish to update their records or ask the station to change it back. Mind you, back then, Dish did actively maintain this data. Someone said they "knew" some of the engineering staff at the station and suggested asking them to change it back first, which they did within 1-2 days, and like I said above, the guide data on Dish receivers auto-magically updated.
Okay, so it sounds like "option two" would be to get WMFD to map their TSID to 012-01 instead of 068-01, since according to James Long's local channel list at dbstalk, Dish is mapping the guide data to 012-01.
If anyone is bored, you can peruse the local channel information here, http://uplink.jameslong.name/locallist.html. Iceberg showed me this information some time ago.... This effectively shows you Dish's records of your local markets channels. For my market, Dayton OH, Dish has the channels in blue. I added the channels in red that exist, but have no info in Dish's system and therefore, no guide data.
2-01 WDTN
2-02 WDTN2
7-01 WHIO
7-02 WHIO2
7-03
16-01 WPTD
16-02
16-03 WPTD3
16-04 WPTD4
16-05 WPTD5
16-06 WPTD2
22-01 WKEF
22-02
22-03
26-01 WBDT
26-02 WBDT2
45-01 WRGT
45-02 WRGT2
2-01 WDTN
2-02 WDTN2
7-01 WHIO
7-02 WHIO2
7-03
16-01 WPTD
16-02
16-03 WPTD3
16-04 WPTD4
16-05 WPTD5
16-06 WPTD2
22-01 WKEF
22-02
22-03
26-01 WBDT
26-02 WBDT2
45-01 WRGT
45-02 WRGT2
I have said for years that DISH should do only the big 4 or 5 networks( ABC/CBS/Fox/NBC/CW) on the satellites and use PSIP data over the air for all Sub channels and or all smaller or independent channels in local dmas. This would give both DISH and their customers what they want. Yes, it would be limited guide data for sub channels ,but it would better than none. I don't see why this wouldn't work, since all tvs made in the last few years allow you psip data for their ota broadcast portion of their sets. They could also allow guide data to be downloaded to your receivers over the internet, for their hd receivers since all the Vip and Hopper receivers allow internet connections. With cord cutters and cord nevers growing, it really makes no sense continuing to piss off their subs ,who want full guide data for their ota sub channels.
