Is our Glorystar Dish really aimed at a Dish Elevation of 30.3 degrees?

[MrsSoda]

We are new to FTA. After lurking here for over 6 months, I twisted my husband's arm this week to take me across town to get a Glorystar dish with a Visionsat IV 200 PVR receiver on craigslist. We currently have good reception with the standard assortment of over the air UHF digital channels but I've been dying to see what else we could get with satellite.

Despite following the directions in the wonderful Glorystar Installation Guide and using both the Dishpointer AR iphone app and printouts from the GeostatFinder website, we get nothing.

I've attached several photos of our dish set up hoping something obvious might leap out that we are doing wrong.

We are trying to hit 97W Gal 19 with LNBF #1. For our location, it requires:
LNBF rotation of -21.82
Compass Reading 129.10 degrees
Dish Elevation of 30.3 degrees

The first two we are pretty comfortable we're doing correctly.

The Dish Elevation however, has us baffled. My husband doubled checked the plumb leveling of the vertical post as well as laying the dish on a flat surface to make sure it wasn't bowed. Yet when we tilt the elevation guide to the 30 degree mark, the dish itself is looking straight across the street at our neighbor's house with at most a few degrees tilt.

Does this particular Glorystar dish have a large offset angle and despite its appearance, we really are pointing the dish at a 30.3 degree elevation? It is slightly oval in shape and a little over 36 inches long.

I have great LOS over the neighbor's house across the street so I know that isn't our problem.

My husband entered the standard LBNF setting into the receiver (I believe it was 10750 but I'll have to double check). The previous owner's satellite info for 97 west is still installed. We tried several blind scans, making small adjustment to the dish's azimuth and elevation with no luck. We could get a signal strength of 80-85 but 0 signal quality. Blind scans repeatedly showed 0 channels found.

The receiver and all its settings is pretty Greek to us at the moment. We could easily be missing something here. I was able to find this info on one of the menu screens:

Model IV 200
H/W Ver S1000 1.00
Driver API 1.0
Application Norw v 1.15
Data Version FDU v 1.1

Any suggestions on where we should begin troubleshooting are greatly appreciated. The Glorystar manual assumes we have a receiver other than the Visionsat that came with this setup. We do have the Visionsat manual for reference.

Thanks in advance.
Kathryn

Does this particular Glorystar dish have a large offset angle?

 

[rv1pop]

to answer the first question, no, it is not a large offset angle. However, if you look from the lower edge of the dish and up the arm, you get a better idea of where in the sky you are looking.
First question to you: is the dual holder set at the correct offset as per the Glorystar aiming instructions?
Next are the two bullets turned to the skew on that list?

Then as you look up the arm, aim it for the spot for 99W on your spoting app. Then SLOWly raise the dish and VERY SLOWLY rotate it back and forth looking for a signal on TBN, using the LNB for 97W. After going up around 7 degrees, if you have not found signal, then work your way back down to 7 degrees below the mark you started at. I have never failed to find the signal in that range. Remember a half a degree up or down in elevation at a time and about a pencil point width in rotation at a time is plenty fast. Do not turn anything faster than the speed of "Amazing Grace" .
Be patient ad keep us posted. TV and receiver at the dish during aiming is also almost an absolute.
POP
I almost always have found the signal between 3 and 5 degrees up from the markings.

 

[Wescopc]

Hookup Just one LNB, the one on the left when facing the dish. There isn't much left on 101W satellite, so I would hook up the one LNB without the switch. Make sure your receiver is setup for the Standard LNB with a LO (local oscillator) frequency of 10750. Make sure your receiver is on an active TP (transponder) best one for search is 12152, Horizontal, symbol rate of 20000. Do you show signal strength? If not then something is not right with the connection to the LNB. Your dish maybe set a degree or two low - just looking at the picture. Hope this helps.
Bob

 

[WTguy]

Based on my experience, most offset dishes have an offset of 21 to 24 degrees. If you are supposed to have an elevation of 30, then your dish should have a tilt back of about 6-9 degrees not vertical as your pictures show. I had a 24 degree offset dish aimed at a satellite with an elevation of 28 degrees and it was not quite vertical like your's is. You might look for some specs online for the Glorystar dish and try to find the offset angle. I would be surprised if it were anywhere close to 30 degrees which would require the dish to be vertical but stranger things have happened.
Then like rv said, slowly rotate the dish until you find a signal quality then fine tune the elevation, if your original elevation is close to correct you should be on 97 or very close.
Also, just to be clear, which lnb are you marking as #1? If you are standing in front of the Dish, it should be the on the left.
Good luck.

I did a quick search and found the following link, the 90cm dish is a 24.6 offset angle and the 120cm dish is a 27 offset.

http://www.glorystar.tv/p/shop/?ws_pid=764&ws_cat=470

 

[Mikey11]

going by the 4th picture it appears you are aimed lower than 30 degrees....around 28 degrees

 

[Mikey11]

something i just noticed from your iphone app pic.....your LNB is skewed/rotated in the wrong direction.....you should be rotating it counter-clockwise instead of clockwise....when looking at the LNB from behind the dish.....

 

[Wescopc]

something i just noticed from your iphone app pic.....your LNB is skewed/rotated in the wrong direction.....you should be rotating it counter-clockwise instead of clockwise....when looking at the LNB from behind the dish.....

It is rotated correctly for the Northwest, click on the Picture above and you will see that minus is clockwise when viewed from the front of the dish.
Bob

 

[SatelliteAV]

The way that the NPRM base is placed on the porch will prevent the dish from sweeping left or right without contacing the support tripod legs. I would rotate the NPRM 180 degrees to get the tripod legs out of the way. The LNBF rotation (skew) is correctly set for Washington State.

Follow Wescopc suggestions for bypassing the switch and directly connecting only to the left LNBF (labled LNBF #2 on the bracket) and tuning to transponder frequency 12152.

The elevation pointer in your photo is set at 28 degrees. The dish wshould be tilted back only 5 -6 degrees from vertical to be actually aiming at 30 degrees. The dish makes people think that it is picking up signals from the angle that the reflector is pointed, but the offset design is actually pointed at an elevation that is 24.6 degrees higher than then the reflector is pointed! I would start at 30 degree setting then SLOWLY sweep the dish 10 -15 degrees to the left and right of compass reading 129. If the Signal Quality reading does not increase, tilt the dish up or down in 1 degree increments and repeat the SLOW pan of the dish.

Once you have peaked the Signal Quality on transponder frequency 12152, perform a Blind Scan of the satellite using the FTA mode to log all free channels on the satellite. You may have to cheat the dish a fraction of a degree to the west to receive the transponder 11842. If 3ABN, Hope Channel, LLBN channels do not scan into your channel list during the Blind Scan, you may need to manually enter this transponder frequency. Peak and balance the dish for best Signal Quality on both 12152 and 11842 then perform a TP (transponder) scan to add these additional 17 channels on 11842.

 

[MrsSoda]

We have read everyone's suggestions and have made the following adjustments, yet still no signal quality.

1. We switched to LNB #2 (the one on the left as I face the front of the dish). We are connected directly, bypassing the switch that use to connect the signals from the two LNB's before heading to the receiver.
2. We selected the frequency of 12152 on the 97W screen page

I've uploaded two photos. Have we overlooked any entry or maybe left something marked "off" that should be "on"? The Dish Setting photo is the screen where we have been looking for any change in the signal quality as we slowly move the dish. We can make the Signal Level move from around 80 to as high as 87. The Quality regardless stays stuck at 0.



The second photo is merely for reference as to the model and firmware info for our receiver.

Since the Glorystar double LNB set up was meant to shoot in between the two satellites of 97W and 101W, should we change our LNB skew to that of 99W? It isn't much of a difference, -20.21 vs -21.82.

I wish I had more positive news.

 

[Mikey11]

assuming your post is level set your elevation at 30 degrees and sweep VERY SLOWLY back and forth....if nothing increase the dish elevation by a degree and sweep again....keep doing that till you get to 35 degrees....after that start at 30 again and work your way down to 25 degrees.....you should get something....

i am not familliar with the lnb that you are using so maybe somebody else can varify the lnb freq....that is the only setting that could possibly be wrong.....everything else looks fine.....

as a last resort if you have a circular LNB the you can try installing it and aiming for 91w which should be simple to find....this would at least give you a reference point to start from.....

 

[Mikey11]

just looked at the pic of your LNBs and your freq should be set to 10750 so everything seems correct

 

[T4Runner]

One more voice in this thread should not confuse things too much I hope.. Sometimes it is the simple step that gets overlooked and can keep us from finding that satellite.

1. The two LNB bracket if you must use it (I'll get to that later) should be set with the skew setting for the satellite between the two satellites 97W and 101W, which is 99W as stated above. Once you set that elev on the bracket, don't change it. [Where I am, in central California, the two LNB settings are -27.7 and -23.5, so the bracket is set at -25.4 for 99W]

2. The two LNB's should be set 3/4 inch from the face of the LNB to the edge of the bracket looking from the top. When (not if) you get the satellite locked, you can "tweak" (turn left/right and slide in/out) the LNB's for the highest QUALITY. The line at the top of the LNB should line up with the line on the top of the bracket to start.

3. Facing the dish front, the LNB on the left is always called LNB#2 which is also pointed at 97W.

4. Some people have assembled the dish bracket upside down, but yours looks correct from the picture with the "A" visable.

5. If all else fails, you can get a single LNBF bracket from Glorystar and it will be much easier to lock one satellite only; and that would be 97W. The Directv satellite at 101W is a pretty strong signal and causes some problems for installation.

If I was closer to you, I would be glad to help, as your tenacity is great! But it appears we are a few states apart...

 

[MrsSoda]

We have signal quality!!!

Within 10 minutes of my last post, my husband started to get hits on the quality. He peaked at a signal level of 90 with a signal quality fluctuating between 75 and 79.

Moving to LNB #2 and taking a much SLOWER approach to moving the dish systematically left/right, then SLOWLY raising the elevation did the trick. We ended up with a dish elevation marking on the post of approximately 34-35 degrees and it appears our compass reading of 130 degrees may have been off a bit because he found the channels closer to a compass heading in the high 120's.

We scanned all channels on 97W and found 185 TV channels. When we scanned for FTA only, we got 140.




Is a signal quality of 75 to 80 more than adequate, or should we attempt adjustments anywhere else, such as the LNB?

We are so happy right now, we're almost nervous that we might mess it up and lose what we have.

I know we still need to seek out the most current/stable mfg firmware for the Visionsat and then get up the nerve to search for other satellites. My husband is most interested in sports feeds and I'm most interested in Biography/History channel and news channels.

Another dish or a motor is next on the list. For now we are going to have fun exploring what is on 97W.

Thank you everyone for your help.

Kathryn

 

[T4Runner]

Congratulations! Now comes the fun part! When you have exhuasted the batteries in the remote control from channel flipping;>) ..... change the settings for the DisEqc switch using #2 for 97W and #1 for 101W, BUT.... TURN OFF THE SATELLITE RECEIVER BEFORE INSERTING THE SWITCH INTO THE LINE AGAIN.

And you only want to scan one or two transponders on 101W.

 

[Elchucko]

If picture 6 of 7 is showing the LNBFs looking from the dish, they are skewed to the right. If you are in the Pacific Northwest, the LNBFs should be skewed in the other direction!

 

[Jim S.]

Moving to LNB #2 and taking a much SLOWER approach to moving the dish systematically left/right, then SLOWLY raising the elevation did the trick. We ended up with a dish elevation marking on the post of approximately 34-35 degrees and it appears our compass reading of 130 degrees may have been off a bit because he found the channels closer to a compass heading in the high 120's.

Congratulations!

Many dish mounts are off by a few degrees. My GeoSatPro (same as your Glorystar) was dead on, but maybe there are manufacturing variations. The compass reading can also vary depending on your local geology, power lines, etc.

In any case, moving slowly is ALWAYS the key, as long as your equipment is working.

We scanned all channels on 97W and found 185 TV channels. When we scanned for FTA only, we got 140.

Is a signal quality of 75 to 80 more than adequate, or should we attempt adjustments anywhere else, such as the LNB?

As of this morning, the total count is 246 TV and 143 radio, I think, so you're missing some transponders. (With your receiver not doing MPEG4, it may classify some TV channels as radio, but there are only a few MPEG4. Then again, it may not. My Coolsat 7000, which is supposed to be similar to the Visionsat, always reported them as TV.) Whether you want to mess with it depends on whether you're missing anything you want to watch

I don't know how the quality reading on the Visionsat works, because every receiver is different. Somebody who owns one will have to help you there.

I know we still need to seek out the most current/stable mfg firmware for the Visionsat

If you have a NORW version, it's a pirate version. It WON'T hurt anything, and MIGHT be better than the last factory version (the Coolsat's was.)

(Other readers please note, this doesn't go for all receivers and all firmware. There are some brands where, if you're not pointing at a Dish satellite, it doesn't want to work at all.)

 

[MrsSoda]

I obviously don't want pirate firmware. I've searched the forums and seen references to a mfg firmware version 1.45 (if memory serves) If I download and reinstall this firmware, does that get me back to a standard Visionsat receiver?

 

[Wescopc]

Congratulations! Were you able to get 11842? It has 3ABN, Hope, LLBN ..... Your signal quality is good - so If you get 11842 you are good to go!
Bob

BTW Your skew has to be correct and to the minus side - if you were skewed in the opposite direction - you would get nothing.

 

[Semokid]

I obviously don't want pirate firmware. I've searched the forums and seen references to a mfg firmware version 1.45 (if memory serves) If I download and reinstall this firmware, does that get me back to a standard Visionsat receiver?

Yes the 1.45 appears to be the latest factory file,and yes it would return the receiver to factory status.Just go thru and write down your settings in the menu if you cannot remember them,do a factory reset and download the 1.45
file,reset settings and rescan the satellites!

 

[Mr Tony]

I obviously don't want pirate firmware. I've searched the forums and seen references to a mfg firmware version 1.45 (if memory serves) If I download and reinstall this firmware, does that get me back to a standard Visionsat receiver?

yes it will. I just got 2 of these a couple weeks ago and both had old pirate firmware in it. Loaded the software, did a master reset and was good to go