Hmmm... ideas? Only getting Vertical polarities.

[northgeorgia]

So, I ordered an Avenger Ku-band PLL Universal LNBF to try it out (model PLL321S-2), and was quite impressed with its speed and accuracy until -- I realized it was scanning the vertical transponders twice, first reading them as Horizontal, and then as the correct Vertical polarities. None of the actual Horizontal polarities are coming in. When I scan on the microHD for the Horizontal only transponders, I just get the Vertical ones again (labeled as Horizontal). Odd. The settings are the same as my old LNBF. I'm going back out in a sec to check the lines, connections and skew, but this seems odd. I kept one old transponder channel saved in the memory (3ABN English TV), and it reads No Signal, then it disappears and shows 72% Quality but no audio or picture. Ideas?

 

[phlatwound]

Have you checked your voltage output?

I think it's about 13 VDC for the V, and 18 VDC for the H.

 

[Wescopc]

Was the old LNBF Universal or Standard?
Bob

 

[northgeorgia]

Both were universal. Update: Went out to the dish with an OpenBox s10. Works flawlessly. Next culprit is the coax and connectors.

 

[northgeorgia]

Interesting....I checked my coax and connectors. Right now, my Openbox S10 is blindscanning the H and V transponders without a hitch indoors. The microHD is only scanning the Vertical ones the same as before (reading them as both Horizontal and Vertical) with no true Horizontal transponder readings. Time to see what happens when: 1. I replace the DRO lnbf and 2. use the PLL lnbf at the dish with the microHD.

 

[northgeorgia]

ah ha...found the culprit... stand by...

 

[northgeorgia]

The troubles all stemmed from a small connector coax from my power surge protector to the microHD. Upon closer inspection, it was RG 59! I swapped it out for a proper 3 ft. RG 6 cable with nice end connectors I found at Goodwill for a dollar or so, and now everything is up and running.

Edit: well, nope....there's something else going on. Works ok now in the standard high band, but still double scanning (and even missing a few H transponders) in the universal low band. Even scanning standard frequencies is hit and miss... I tried moving from 95 to 97W to blind scan... at first it couldn't find anything, so I tried a detailed scan after I was sure it was receiving the satellite. Now it has just completed its scan and looks fine. Do PLL lnbfs sometimes take longer to lock on a frequency then DRO lnbfs?

 

[Pi314]

LNB - LO

For Ku-band PLL, I set my LNB-LO for 10750 and do not use the universal setting.

 

[northgeorgia]

Did another test. Exact same connections and setup between microHD and dish and the Openbox s10 and dish. Openbox had no problem blindscanning 45W with two low band universal frequencies and one high band standard feed. MicroHD was giving mixed results: first only scanning in the standard feed, then on a second attempt, scanning in the feed and one of the low band frequencies (Vertical only). I haven't tried the microHD out at the dish yet to see how it responds. That will probably have to wait for another day. So at this point, I have placed the DRO lnbf back on. This resulted in both of the two low band frequencies returning on the microHD. A detailed blind scan found the Horizontal station but not the Vertical one or the feed. A transponder scan of the vertical transponder did yield the channel. Retried the Openbox with this setup. Same issues except on trial one (regular blind scan) it found the feed and none of the channels, and on trial two it found the Horizontal channel but nothing else. These Atlantic channels on 45W don't usually boom in with their signal in any case.

If the weather cooperates, perhaps I can try the PLL lnbf with the microHD out at the dish tomorrow. Unfortunately, I don't have a voltage meter to read the outputs in the STBs. It's just odd that the PLL lnbf gives me strange polarity readings and some absent channels with the microHD and yet the Openbox seems to be in love with the PLL, reading everything accurately. I'm still thinking it has to do with the long coax run. Some would say just use the Openbox. However, I don't like the recording format of the Openbox, among some other annoying problems. I suppose I could slave the microHD to the Openbox and enter transponders for recording into the microHD, but that seems like overkill. Anyway, I'll give the microHD a test out at the dish soon and continue experimenting with the PLL lnbf. If it seems to blind scan decently with the microHD on the standard high band, which is what I use most often, I'll transition over to it. I got this one instead of the one offered by SatelliteAV just because on the East Coast it's nice to have the universal lnbf, for the occasional Latin American feeds or channels that come ITC from time to time on the Claro mux on 50W. Yet for all the problems, I have been impressed at the accuracy of the scans when they read the transponders -- the frequencies are right on.

More to come later

 

[northgeorgia]

For Ku-band PLL, I set my LNB-LO for 10750 and do not use the universal setting.

I'll give that a try tomorrow and see how it compares to the universal setting. Thanks!

 

[Jim S.]

The Avenger is 10600, not 10750.

 

[SatelliteAV]

The new LNBF may have a higher voltage switch point for polarity selection than the previous LNBF. Also, the two receivers are likely to output slightly different voltages. The longer cable run may be reducing the voltage arriving at the LNBF and the polarity switch is not performed.

PLL LNBFs have a higher current draw and I have noted that is is even higher current draw on dual output PLLs.

 

[northgeorgia]

The new LNBF may have a higher voltage switch point for polarity selection than the previous LNBF. Also, the two receivers are likely to output slightly different voltages. The longer cable run may be reducing the voltage arriving at the LNBF and the polarity switch is not performed.

PLL LNBFs have a higher current draw and I have noted that is is even higher current draw on dual output PLLs.

Interesting. If the weather cooperates, I'll try the microHD out at the dish tomorrow and post my results. However, I don't think the weather will cooperate. Looks like rain from tomorrow through Monday. Ah well.

Unfortunately, there isn't a way to reduce the length of my cable run. What could be a possible solution in this case? Replace some or all of the cable with RG-11? Other ideas? Or will I be stuck with DRO for now ?

 

[polgyver]

Interesting. If the weather cooperates, I'll try the microHD out at the dish tomorrow and post my results. However, I don't think the weather will cooperate. Looks like rain from tomorrow through Monday. Ah well.

Unfortunately, there isn't a way to reduce the length of my cable run. What could be a possible solution in this case? Replace some or all of the cable with RG-11? Other ideas? Or will I be stuck with DRO for now ?

What is the length of the RG6 cable? Could it be that the inner conductor, steel wire with copper clad surface, has such a high resistance that it causes voltage drop fooling LNB, especially current thirsty, to "believe" that it is being fed only 13 to 14 Volts?

 

[northgeorgia]

I believe it's right at 150 feet.

What is the length of the RG6 cable? Could it be that the inner conductor, steel wire with copper clad surface, has such a high resistance that it causes voltage drop fooling LNB, especially current thirsty, to "believe" that it is being fed only 13 to 14 Volts?

 

[Bongu]

I would try to reseat or replace all your connectors. As has been mentioned already, it sounds like the MicroHD cannot overcome the voltage/current drop that is present in your signal path (coax). Reseating/replacing the connectors should reduce the resistance of each connection.

You mentioned a short coax run from some type of surge protection. Have you tried bypassing the protection temporarily?

Not meaning to knock the MicroHD, but I have found that it does not deliver the same current/voltage that my Sonicview, Viewsat, and Opensat do. You could always go with a modified multiswitch with external power for the LNBF. If it is a dual output PLL LNBF, this is a great solution for multiple receivers.

 

[northgeorgia]

Yeah, I did try bypassing the surge protection and hooked up the coax directly to the STB, but it didn't make a difference. I'll try the microHD (once weather permits) out at the dish with a short coax and see what happens. If I get positive results, I'll definitely take a look at the connectors.

My Openbox s10 absolutely loved the new lnbf and worked perfectly with the setup I have. I just prefer the instant .ts recordings for computer playback and the overall intuitiveness of the microHD over the Openbox. How do the Prof and TBS PC cards/USB boxes do voltage wise with these PLL LNBFs and longer coax runs -- has anyone tried?

By the way, could someone point me to a thread or explain how to do the modified multiswitch with external power? Sounds complicated, but perhaps not too bad if I take a look. I'll do a search on the forums to try to read up more

-- Just to clarify (since it's been implied a couple of times), the Avenger PLL321S-2 is a single output PLL LNBF.

 

[Anole]

Here is the thread to modify the multiswitch.
http://www.satelliteguys.us/showthread.php?t=174802

Edit: the mod is only for LNBs, not for LNBFs.
(actually, the switch is capable of handling two dual output LNBFs, or all four LNBs on a two-band ortho)

Not really applicable to your one-output LNBF.
Many of us assumed you had the PLL322S-2, which has dual outputs.
The damned things have way too similar part numbers.

 

[northgeorgia]

The microHD not only worked great at the dish, it worked great after the 100 ft. run, too. I tried it at the entry point into the house, where it runs into some old Dish network coax. Inside the house is where the problem lies, and I suspect this cable. They must have used RG59. Anyway, until I can get permission to drill a hole or run another RG6 under the muddy excuse of a foundation our farmhouse is on (I say with affection heheh), then I'll just set up the Openbox to use with the PLL, and use the MicroHD with the DRO. Florida Channel at 71Q! PLL does work!

I used the Openbox extensively today, and then I remembered one of its issues -- it gets so hot you could cook bacon on it! By evening, I had the DRO back on with the microHD.

 

[northgeorgia]

Update: ran RG-6U cable through the floor and under the house (that was a mess...the old red clay soil had a pit of water beneath it, but fortunately, I was able to scale the sides near the so-called foundation and swing the cable on out). Connected the PLL LNB up to the microHD and it seems to be working well. During the first band of wind and rain from the tropical storm, LPB stations showed 0-15% Q, but for the most part stayed on the air!