Finally!

[Blindowl1234]

Dee, Once you get the hang of lining up a Cband dish the first time, I think its easier than a KU dish any day. I had a hard time when I went to motorize mine. I had my true south but kept losing stuff at the upper end of the arc. I shifted about an 1/8" on the pole and problem solved. When you get to motorizing your dish its another learning experience. Once you learn it you've got it. The little Tv is a big help. That's what I always use outside. Blind

 

[trinidex]

Come on Dee you can do it! We have faith!

This thread alone has so many of us hooked!

This hobby can be frustrating, bu don't give up, you really are close.

FWIW, I find focal depth to be the last thing I bother with, first is dish position, then lnb skew.

A few years back I was having problems with the 99 stuff (wvxf) and I spent days on here, Ice and others helped me keep focused. The signal was fine during the day, but nightly it would drop off for a few hours and then snap back in as though nothing was wrong.

Turned out my feed horn wasn't straight so it wasn't looking at the centre of the dish, as soon as I sorted that, no more problems!

Some signals are easier to get than others and those are the ones you should peak to get get as strong as possible, the rest as they say, is cake...and I like cake

Stick in there for you.... and us!

 

[Phottoman]

It's been 47 hours since she posted anything on Satguys.us, I hope she isn't sick or something like that.

She also said she ordered that 7" portable, so maybe, hopefully, she is just waiting for that to arrive to come back and start telling us what she has accomplished or that she followed some directions and now has her dish dead on and is watching TV.

(-->Phottoman crossing his fingers)

 

[T4Runner]

Or she had her DAD cut off the pole to a lower height and started over....

 

[richyrich]

you have entered the "rocket science zone"

Dee Ann, where are you? This is the thread of any mans desire. But as a Scientist, I must defer to one thing. From reading this thread, I have learned ---

1) Everybody learns "something" a different way, and aiming a c band satellite dish really is rocket science.

I learned from a person who had been doing it every day for 3 years. What he learned during his trial and tribulation, I learned in a quarter second. Drilled into my head was the sequence of events, or the work, from a to z. In rocket science, everything has to happen perfectly from 1/4 second all the way to liftoff, that is first things first. And installing a satellite dish is the same thing.
1) site check first, determination of where a c band polar mounted dish (full arc) can work from.
2) The parts/supplies required to accomplish must be gathered for that spot, i.e. cement, pole, size of pole (how big is big enough), length of pole (how far is the rocket going to go), number of bags of cement for that spot on earth (can the mounting carry the load), for where the dish is going to be installed.
3) Equipment (dish and outside electronics for the "countdown to liftoff" that is going to be put onto pole, cabling and protection of cabling desired, to where in the house or business is the cabling going to go; then the required length of the cabling; then the receiver and what it does (fuel) that is going to commit to the "liftoff"...
4) And finally, the required programming of the dish (rocket ship) and receiver to act as one (the computer, communication to/of the rocket, and all parameters of both sides work in unison, as a system). This is the hardest part. The dish needs to move from west to east and back again, receiving all receiver commands and move so perfectly, that everywhere it moves to, it receives each satellite in the arc, that is, it tracks everyone of them in unison, freely choosing whichever one it want, loose, smooth, free, flowing powerfully into and through the sky (this is why a rocket has one of those spinning tops, a heavy weight spinning at a really fast speed, i can't remember what they call it, and why early rocketry was full of failures because they did not have one attached, anyway, it "balanced" the top of the rocket.) ...

You are at the end of your Journey, as quickly as anyone can learn "rocket science". Now you are taking everything you can learn, and balancing a dish and receiver together on top of the piece of ground, called "your spot on the map of the world". You've entered the "flight" to all quality; where everything you have done matters. (the rocket has entered "no gravity", and now control must calculate where and how it is going to be put into "final orbit"). You also have entered the "math zone"; and your moves of the dish are final calculations. There is a mathematical formula that "describes" what you are doing; it is found doing it on the AZ/EL calculators found online. A moving dish follows every satellite, so therefore, every calculation these calculators give you one at a time for each satellite you can track; is what the dish must do.

Basically, when you have your locations declination angle to apply to the dish; your locations dish elevation angle to apply to your dish; and true south; all of the calculators numbers are calculated by the dish. If anything is wrong with these calculators, finding true south with a compass is usually their problem, because they do not normally do that. True south on a compass is found by setting up the compass for your spot on a map. Magnetic deviation is applied to the compass; that is, each place on earth has a different number that adds or subtracts from the magnetic N/S reading a compass has. This is called the "magnetic deviation" that must be applied to make a "true" line to follow (where you must aim the mounting device that your dish pivots on, so it can calculate all the numbers correctly; this is also why early ship navigators got lost, magnetic deviation made their compasses point the wrong direction, and some areas made them go way off tracking the straight line they should have followed, almost "curving themselves and their maps" so that they couldn't find certain places)
1) find out what your magnetic deviation is for your home in Texas.
2) add or subtract the amount from the compasses magnetic reading.
3) That direction is the true north/south line you aim the mount.

This will take a lot of the trial and error out of the process of finalizing the aiming of your polar mounted satellite dish. Step by step, you'll now be able to "trial and error"; the configuration of your dish inaccuracies, that is, adding and subtracting elevation and the declination as well as the polar mount finding of true south, only a little amount (starting with only elevation until most come in), because the meter doesn't lie, you want it to be the best, and meters make easy the best.

Be soft in your dish movements, move it very little; touch it lightly; adjust slowly, starting with only the elevation until you get the most satellite east to west that you can.

May the force be with you...

 

[Phottoman]

@richyrich, wow, I read through both posts twice and I think you are over complicating things for her, she has already SAID she is having trouble with the math, and it even sounded complicated to me, and I'm just a college grad that doesn't use his degree.

Also, she is already close to the TS she needs, all it needs now is a little tweaking.

I think the more people that try to add suggestions, the more she is getting lost. How about we just wait to hear from Dee-Ann herself and see what (if any) steps she has completed, and THEN try to give her advise on setting her dish. She is already very close to her TS, and once she lands ON her True South (TS) the rest will more than likely fall into place. As I said in one of my above long posts, each persons TS will be different, even people living as close to a mile apart will not get the same readings. Plus even in her yard moving as little as a few feet away from one spot may make an entirely different reading on her magnetic compass. She IS there, and VERY close. So let's hold back on more info until she decides to let us know what's happening and try hard not to speculate any more than we have too.

Just my opinion, for what it's worth.

Photto

 

[dougruss]

I'm a firm believer in the K.I.S.S. Concept... for newbies.. k:

Keep it Simple Stupid

 

[Pixl]

When I put up my first C-band motorized I got it right in one try (and I was pretty new at this fta thing).
I went out at night and aimed the back side support at Polaris (North Star) then went to bed. Next day I found I had the whole arc. No sat signals or TS were used at all! If anyone is interested I'll try to find the previous posts on this procedure.

 

[Phottoman]

When I put up my first C-band motorized I got it right in one try (and I was pretty new at this fta thing).
I went out at night and aimed the back side support at Polaris (North Star) then went to bed. Next day I found I had the whole arc. No sat signals or TS were used at all! If anyone is interested I'll try to find the previous posts on this procedure.

YEAH !!!! Some one that did it the same way I posted about several times. Go out at night, find the North Star, lay something on the ground pointing from the dish to the North Star, then go to bed. Next morning you know True North, aim the dish in the EXACT opposite direction, TRUE SOUTH.

Thanks Pixl.

But then again, not everyone can SEE Polaris, or know which star IS Polaris. Living in the country can help a lot, but clouds and or lights from the city (Light Pollution) can interfere with sighting the North Star.

Also, a LOT of people think mistakenly that Polaris is the brightest star in the northern sky, wish that it were so, but it isn't. If you can find the Big Dipper, the two bottom most stars point outside the dipper at Polaris, not that that will help, but that's how you find the North Star.

Photto

 

[Pixl]

Photto,

Sorry, this thread has gotten so long I didn't see that you had posted that, and so long I doubt that Dee is reading it anymore. The procedure I had in mind is more accurate than just laying something on the ground.

Pix

 

[Phottoman]

All is good My Friend, and I/We all hope she IS reading this still.

Other than just Dee-Ann reading this, it would also seem that a few others are also gaining knowledge from the thread, it HAS been useful and informative and making (I think) clear to a lot of people just how easy it is to tweak their dishes.

At least this is My opinion, your mileage may vary.

Photto

 

[Phottoman]

Well, it is time to start worrying about Dee-Ann. It's been 3 days and two hours since she last posted.

She had mentioned she was climbing up and down on a rickety old ladder. I/We hope she didn't fall and hurt herself.

Photto

 

[zamar23]

With all we've being through already with Dee-Ann, I see future of this project a lot brighter.

 

[stanleyjohn]

shes around! just checkout her profile and you will see that she has been viewing lately.Like someone said earlier!maybe shes waiting for the small tv before making any new attempts.

 

[Dee_Ann]

I had to take a break from all this for a few days.

I just said "Forget it!" and just threw it all on the floor and walked away for a few days.

Then I had a few days where I had things to do, it was one year ago my best friend and roommate passed away and I had to go get flowers and make an arrangement and travel a few hundred miles to the cemetery to spend some time there at her grave site.. This past week has been very trying for me..

I haven't read everything you guys posted yet since earlier in the week, I'll see about that in a bit. I simply moved the browser page over to another desktop and left it there to come back to later.


So.. I got that little tv set in. I haven't taken it outside yet but I will soon.

I did hook it to the coolsat and while the picture leaves much to be desired, it is very readable. I will have no problem at all reading the screen (provided I remember to take my glasses out with me!)..

A friend of mine on facebook told me about an app called VNC. I was able to use it on my desktop work computer and my iPhone to see the coolsat when I plugged the video wire into the pc capture card. I had an old capture card in my work pc for converting old video tapes and forgot about it. So that VNC app let me see my desktop from my iPhone but it's awful small and I'm farsighted so that doesn't work so well. I did try it a little and I was able to move the dish around enough to get a much better signal on WVXF than I had been.

So anyway, this little tv, it has a tripod mount on the bottom, THAT is seriously awesome for me, I have several professional tripods, one of them quite large and sturdy, it cost me about $2,000 in the day..

I have an unused wire that runs from the house to the "dish farm" as you guys are so fond of calling them. So, I can connect that wire to the video out of the coolsat and out at the dishes, connect the other end to the little tv set. I have several of those remote pyramids that let me change channels from anywhere in the house. I can take one of them out in the yard with the tv and operate the coolsat and the Gbox without having to take all that stuff out there. Just two items, the tv and the pyramid remote thing. Everything else stays inside...


Just before I gave up on it all and took a break, I messed with it one night (yes, I sleep during the day and I'm usually out in the yard standing 8 feet up in the air on a ladder at 3am messing with that stupid dish).

As I mentioned earlier, I was able to get a very strong signal of 97%, up from 63% on WVXF.

I also located several other satellites. The signals on them all vary and are usually chirpy and weak and all blocky.. Terrible. When the signal is weak it makes these horrible chirps and squeaks that pierce my brain like an ice pick! I can't tolerate that noise so if I can't get tv without that, I won't watch it at all. Even 1% of the time doing that is intolerable to me.

Here's the satellites I have been able to locate and can go back and forth to using the Gbox controller.

87, 91, 95, 97, 99, 101, 103, 107.3 and 113.

Some of them, I find a lot of channels, some, not so much.
Thing is, I did find them. Some of the channels come in really well, but mostly not so well. I even found Canadian weather! Not very useful though considering I'm on the Gulf of Mexico.. Oh well...


And there is where I left it.

On 87, all I can get is NASA. It comes in really well but I can not find thisTV or MeTV again. I spent HOURS out there messing with the stupid lnb, in the dark, in the mosquitoes. I believe that tree limb is what's causing me my grief.

My dad suggested that we (WE?) climb the tree and cut the limb down. He said he has a 24' ladder (OH HECK NO!) that will easily reach the offending limb. I have a chainsaw back from hurricane Rita (everyone had to get one). If he thinks I am going to go up there that high and cut a limb as big around as my thigh, he's out of his mind! Originally he said he would see about paying someone to do it. Now he's using the WE word... Um, no.............

But seriously, I'm sure that's the problem.

I just don't understand how it is I had that channel coming in great for a few days then POOF! all of a sudden it's gone??!!

Oh, and yes, I have tried the suggestion of tipping the dish up and pulling it down.

I suspect that 90% of the problem is with the lnb holder. I don't even think it's lined up right. And by that I mean the ring that holds the lnb. I don't think it's square with the dish at all, I don't think it's centered properly either. I think the whole thing is all wonky and warped.

It may be impossible to get this thing properly aligned.


Oh, yesterday I went to the cemetery which is waaaaay out in the deep woods of SE Texas. I was afraid to go that far alone so my parents took me, for safety sake. On the way back my dad said he wanted to stop in Beaumont at a tool place called Harbor Freight. I have seen you guys mention Harbor Freight numerous times so I asked him if he would buy me a new one of those tilt meters. That one he loaned me is missing the face and the needle is bent.

Mom and I waited in the hot car for like 45 minutes (and they say women take forever to shop?! HA!) and he finally came out with ONE wrench and two of those tilt meters. He bought a new one for me and a new one for himself. He said they were only $4 each. He told me to keep the old one he loaned me. (why?)

So I have a brand spanking new tilt meter that is all mine.

Another thing, I sent off for a like new but gently used cordless drill. It's a "DeWalt" brand. It has a hard shell carry case, a charger, two batteries and numerous other accessories. My dad said he will give me some adapters that will allow me to use tool sockets on it so that it actually works like a motorized wrench. And of course, drill holes and work as a screw driver too. It should be here Monday. Dad paid for it, it was pretty expensive too. He's all giggly about me working on all this stuff so he's thrilled to give me tools as gifts. Sheesh.. Well, I'll take em I guess. Why not? If it makes the work easier then great. It's not like I'm begging for free stuff. He offers so why not...

He also gave me a box of BIG wreches for tightening the bolts on the dish, some of them are quite large and a pair of kitchen pliers just doesn't get it done.

It's scary the tool collection I've started to amass. TOOLS!
I can't believe I have all these tools! Crazy!!!


Oh yeah! And I see The Old Man Channel took a powder and History is back! WOO HOO!!! Now I can get American Restoration and American Pickers again! And other cool stuff!


So now I have this little tv set and pretty soon I will get back out there and see what I can do with that stupid dish.

I think though that today I will stay up a little past sunrise and see if I can pull the limbs out of the way with a rope and my John Deere. Dad loaned me some strong rope and a pulley. He said I could try to put the pulley on the base of the tree, pass the rope through it, tie one end to the mower and the other end around the limb. The pulley will make sure the limb bends in towards the tree and hopefully stress it enough to break, it will also keep it from flying at me when it breaks since I will be driving away from the base of the tree. In theory. Dad said this may not work or may make matters worse and he's more in favor now of climbing the tree and chainsawing it. I am not in favor of climbing the tree. I fell out of a tree when I was little and was badly injured. I don't like heights or trees.

I'll try the redneck method first.

I still think though that this little dish just isn't going to get the job done.


Oh, and my dad looked at the poles and said that he CAN cut them down and for the little dish with the bolts in it, he said he can "drill and tap" it again right where it is. He put bolt threads in it, I assumed he did that on a machine in his garage but he said no, he used a tool called a "tap" to do that while it was on the ground and that he can do it anywhere. So we figured to cut the pole down by two feet, that would leave plenty of clearance for the motor from hitting the ground or being underwater but would bring it down enough so I could just stand on a bucket instead of that dangerous old trashpile ladder way up in the air like I have been.

The other pole for the 10 foot dish needs to be cut way down too but I have no idea yet how much. I can take a GUESS at it by looking at the smaller one. I had no idea these things would be so flat, like big bird baths! I thought because they are big they would need lots of clearance. I guess I was thinking like they would point down a lot more, like the little ku dishes.. Boy was I ever wrong!

More later.. I need to read all the stuff posted over the past week and try to process it and get a grasp on it. I'm slow to understand a lot of this stuff and I have to read and re-read it many times before I hear the big DING!

Thanks guys!

 

[trinidex]

I had to take a break from all this for a few days.

I just said "Forget it!" and just threw it all on the floor and walked away for a few days.

Then I had a few days where I had things to do, it was one year ago my best friend and roommate passed away and I had to go get flowers and make an arrangement and travel a few hundred miles to the cemetery to spend some time there at her grave site.. This past week has been very trying for me..

My dad suggested that we (WE?) climb the tree and cut the limb down. He said he has a 24' ladder (OH HECK NO!) that will easily reach the offending limb. I have a chainsaw back from hurricane Rita (everyone had to get one). If he thinks I am going to go up there that high and cut a limb as big around as my thigh, he's out of his mind! Originally he said he would see about paying someone to do it. Now he's using the WE word... Um, no.............

He also gave me a box of BIG wreches for tightening the bolts on the dish, some of them are quite large and a pair of kitchen pliers just doesn't get it done.

It's scary the tool collection I've started to amass. TOOLS!
I can't believe I have all these tools! Crazy!!!

I think though that today I will stay up a little past sunrise and see if I can pull the limbs out of the way with a rope and my John Deere. Dad loaned me some strong rope and a pulley. He said I could try to put the pulley on the base of the tree, pass the rope through it, tie one end to the mower and the other end around the limb. The pulley will make sure the limb bends in towards the tree and hopefully stress it enough to break, it will also keep it from flying at me when it breaks since I will be driving away from the base of the tree. In theory. Dad said this may not work or may make matters worse and he's more in favor now of climbing the tree and chainsawing it. I am not in favor of climbing the tree. I fell out of a tree when I was little and was badly injured. I don't like heights or trees.

More later.. I need to read all the stuff posted over the past week and try to process it and get a grasp on it. I'm slow to understand a lot of this stuff and I have to read and re-read it many times before I hear the big DING!

Thanks guys!

Condolences for your loss Dee, may you keep fond memories alive.

We all get sucked into this hobby, meanwhile life passes on by!

Good find on that TV - I have the exact same one! I agree PQ is not great but it will more than suffice what younkers and will make you're doing a damn site easier.

So you've amassed a fine collection of tools eh?! I love reading this thread, not just to see how're you getting on, but to read how're you're doing it all.

Keep up the good work!

 

[trinidex]

WOW I did not read that last reply before posting!

The tv...is a great little TV ideal for what you're doing and will make it easier for you to tweak.

Your setup with the spare cable to the farm that will let you hook the tv up outside and IR pyramids is pretty cool, I still use another person shouting out PQ numbers!

 

[Phottoman]

"Oh, and yes, I have tried the suggestion of tipping the dish up and pulling it down."

It's NOT a matter of just "tipping the dish" Dee, you have to hold it there for a few seconds and wait for the meter to respond, maybe three to five seconds.

Dee, again I think you are skipping over steps. You said you spent "hours" messing with the lnb, but AGAIN you skipped a step. Get the dish lined up first, THEN spend a few minutes on the lnb. The fact that you have found and can return to so many satellites proves that you ARE on the arc, but you'll forever miss the channels you want until you align the dish properly.

I, for one, am glad your back. At least we can stop worrying about you and your health, and/or finding that you fell off your rickety ladder. And a step stool is much safer than an upside-down bucket any day of the week.

If you wont take advise on tweaking your dish before messing with the lnb, good luck, I hope it turns out good for you.

Photto

 

[Mr Tony]

I've got one of those little TV's too...they work great for aiming the dish and are alot easier to take on the roof than a 13" TV

 

[kodaz]

I've got one of those little TV's too...they work great for aiming the dish and are alot easier to take on the roof than a 13" TV

cept for s2 signals, my coolsat beeping function connected to an fm transmitter and my walkman has aided me a lot.