EchoStar Announces Conference Call for First Quarter 2009 Financial Results

[HDRoberts]

I think you are being a little unfair to Dish is some areas.

- Yanking channels off the air, with no warming, in heated public disputes (Lifetime, VOOM, Fisher, Viacom, GolTV, etc.)

Fisher only effected a few cities. Viacom and Lifetime a a long time past. Voom and GolTV only effected a few subs. All accounts are, Dish got fewer Voom complaints then they thought they would. I know you are sore about it, but that does not mean everyone is.

- Value leader no more; AEP used to be a value, but with prices increases higher than cable, they are the new Cable Pig.

The lower packages are still a great value compared to cable. I get 5 times the HD at half the price my local cableco would charge.

- HD Leader no more. They used to offer both the most and best quality HD...those days are long gone since D*, FiOS TV, and U-Verse all offer more HD channels, and their HD-Lite quality speaks for itself.

Once they add FX and Speed, they will beat DirecTV in national offerings, except sports. Yes, I know Fios and Uverse are kicking but, but they are still available to very few people and don't belong in this discussion. And I know HD lite is a big deal for you, but I bet 90% of subs don't notice or don't ate. I am in the latter camp. I can't tell on my 32 inch LCD. Heck, a lot of people watch SD on an HDTV and think and think it's HD.

- Best HD DVRs on the market. Although this is still true, D* had caught-up and, as many of us have discovered, the TivoHD does a pretty good job and Moxi HD is now an option.

The gap is narrowed, but their DVR is still the best. They have just done a poor job of selling it.

- Unlike D*, E* customers pay a DVR fee for each and every DVR on their account - for the most part. I can only assume we're still paying multiple DVR fees to help pay E*'s infringement of Tivo IP.

What does the Tivo lawsuit have to do with anything? I bet most subs know nothing about it. I also bet 90% of subs have not more than 1 DVR, so are unaffected. I agree, change it, but I don't think it is that big of deal.

- Customer service tanked when call centers were outsourced to the Philippines, and I don't see any improvement.

I agree on this point

- Thanks to Charlie's admitted "stubborn" position with Tivo, there is a good chance this will cost E* another $200+ million dollars in the near future.

Again, most subs probably know nothing of Tivo.

- E* is engaged in a billion dollar lawsuit with VOOM for allegedly illegally terminating their franchise agreement.

Again, I think few subs know and fewer care. A sore spot with you, but not too many others.

- E* does not offer a number of sports channels (mostly sports) that are carried by D*.

True.

I think Dish advertizing, customer service, and confusing packages are thier biggest problems. No one knows what Dish stands for, if they will get what is promisided, or even understand what they will get.

But lawsuits, channel dispites, Fios/Uverse cometition. Plese, that his little to do with Dish problems.

 

[goaliebob99]

Once they add FX and Speed, they will beat DirecTV in national offerings, except sports. Yes, I know Fios and Uverse are kicking but, but they are still available to very few people and don't belong in this discussion. And I know HD lite is a big deal for you, but I bet 90% of subs don't notice or don't ate. I am in the latter camp. I can't tell on my 32 inch LCD. Heck, a lot of people watch SD on an HDTV and think and think it's HD.


Again, most subs probably know nothing of Tivo.

Uverse is available widely in Texas, Illinois, Missouri, California, Oklahoma, Kansas, Ohio, Michigan, Wisconsin, Indiana, and Connecticut according to the unofficial universe users chart at uverseusers.com That seems like a wide range of territory, and the myth that they are avaliable to very few is now not true. In my area EVERY major metro city in chicago and the subs has uverse or has been slated to roll out. The only ones that hasnt rolled out is the citys that are fighting att about vrad installs. Even thoughs citys are beginning to allow att to roll in with uverse.

Verizon has a slower approach than att, but combined they hitup half of the nation, a competitive and sizeable chunk out of anybodys pocket book. Uvers is just as cheap as charlie's packages. Click here for the Fios coverage map

Finally, Most subs to know of what Tivo is, Its a common house hold name. Usally someone says they will tivo or dvr it. If you think otherwise then you must be on the board that Charlie is on as that board is tanking dish network real quick. Please jump off the titanic before it sinks, or let us satelliteguys get on board to save it

 

[DodgerKing]

Finally, Most subs to know of what Tivo is, Its a common house hold name. Usally someone says they will tivo or dvr it. If you think otherwise then you must be on the board that Charlie is on as that board is tanking dish network real quick. Please jump off the titanic before it sinks, or let us satelliteguys get on board to save it

Many people think any DVR is a TiVO.

 

[HDRoberts]

When I say nothing of Tivo, I mean the Tivo lawsuit. People are not leaving Dish over the Tivo lawsuit, as alleged. Sorry for being unclear.

Also, I live in Ohio. Uverse is not yet widely available. I am un a desly packed street in the West park neighborhood, yet no uverse here. Sadly, Fios and Uverse have a variation of the Dish HD local syndrome. They think you have it one one street, you serve the whole city.

 

[jacmyoung]

When I say nothing of Tivo, I mean the Tivo lawsuit. People are not leaving Dish over the Tivo lawsuit, as alleged. Sorry for being unclear...

While the sub growth numbers are not directly related to the TiVo v. E* lawsuit, one can argue there is a link at least.

To some extent the per DVR fee and two DVR lease limitation by E* (unlike the per account DVR fee and no limitation on DVR lease by D*) is used to finance the $105M payout to TiVo and another about $20 to $30M additional damages plus interest after this contempt proceeding.

I for one switched from E* to D* over a year ago because I had to pay $350 for a third DVR, they wouldn’t lease another one to me, and of course the per DVR fee, when taking into consideration, made the D* monthly cost comparable to E*. I am sure these factors moved many over, because I had started a thread on how to save another $240 with D* using the AAA membership deal, and this thread is still going on at the D* forum. I counted no less than 50 actually told me they signed on with D* after reading my thread, not to mention all the ones that read my thread but did not say anything. Of course not everyone who signed on to D* switched from E*.

The point is the higher DVR fees and having to purchase the 3rd or 4th DVR, made E* less competitive, especially in the high-end sub group. And there is a link between the higher fee with this on-going TiVo v. E* case.

Now E* is very likely to win this case soon, I just finished reading the entire court trnascript, hopefully after that they can begin to reduce the DVR fee and modify the lease policy.

 

[riffjim4069]

I think you are being a little unfair to Dish is some areas...

These are some of my observation why Dish Network is having such a rough time while D* has been enjoying solid numbers over the past year. You certainly don't have to agree with any of them, but I do believe that they are all factors. Additionally, while it is true that few subscribers know little, or care little, about what's happening with their legal struggles (e.g, Tivo and VOOM), I believe this speaks volumes about the way E* conducts business these days. You're correct when you mentioned Dish Network's marketing department...their advertising and promotions are getting smoked by the competition.

Regarding VOOM...I left Dish Network almost 6-months prior to VOOM being removed from the channel lineup - I just couldn't stand another day of DishHD-Lite. Even if VOOM were to return to Dish Network (never going to happen), there is no way I would ever trade-in FiOS TV for E*...the difference between the two services (quality, value, customer service, etc.) is night-and-day.

Having said that, I would love to see Dish Network turn things around and get back on track. All they have to do is read the many threads from long-time subscribers who have "jumped ship" and they'll have their answers. How many years have we be hearing members telling Charlie to settle with Tivo, get rid of the multiple DVR fees, stop the practice of HD-Lite, get rid of the confusing metal packages, etc.?

 

[jacmyoung]

These are some of my observation why Dish Network is having such a rough time while D* has been enjoying solid numbers over the past year. You certainly don't have to agree with any of them, but I do believe that they are all factors. Additionally, while it is true that few subscribers know little, or care little, about what's happening with their legal struggles (e.g, Tivo and VOOM), I believe this speaks volumes about the way E* conducts business these days. You're correct when you mentioned Dish Network's marketing department...their advertising and promotions are getting smoked by the competition.

Regarding VOOM...I left Dish Network almost 6-months prior to VOOM being removed from the channel lineup - I just couldn't stand another day of DishHD-Lite. Even if VOOM were to return to Dish Network (never going to happen), there is no way I would ever trade-in FiOS TV for E*...the difference between the two services (quality, value, customer service, etc.) is night-and-day.

Having said that, I would love to see Dish Network turn things around and get back on track. All they have to do is read the many threads from long-time subscribers who have "jumped ship" and they'll have their answers. How many years have we be hearing members telling Charlie to settle with Tivo, get rid of the multiple DVR fees, stop the practice of HD-Lite, get rid of the confusing metal packages, etc.?

The only thing I disagree with you above are the lawsuits.

For VOOM, E* did the right thing to get VOOM and also did the right thing to get rid of it. As part of the deal they got the Rainbow satellite, a key component in their Eastern Arc plan, and regardless who was at fault, VOOM had no future and was draining E*'s bandwidth. VOOM's demise on E* could not have contributed to the sub slow down.

On TiVo v. E*, while I do believe the per DVR fee has a lot to do with financing the cost of the lawsuit and damages, I see it as a necessary evil, this is even when I agree E* and TiVo working together would be a great thing. But on balance, E* eventually proving that TiVo does not hold the monopoly in DVR technology, and in fact there are ways to accomplish DVR functionalities without infringement, is ultimately going to benefit the consumers and take the DVR development to new height much faster simply because real competition will flourish.

For over a year Charlie seemed to have lost his faith in satellite TV business model, and the results followed. But lately a lot has happened on the Dish end, it remains to be seen if the new trend will yield good result. If anything, the fact D* continues to attract such a large number of new subs each quarter should change his attitude about the future of DBS. DBS can compete with cable and Fios and such by making their DVRs an integrated part of the home entertainment, home networking, remote networking and mobile phone service all in one. The key is to be several steps ahead of cable and even Fios/Uverse in terms of hardware capabilities.

 

[jacmyoung]

Now seeing how the DirecTV CE development is advancing, E* better move quickly on the new DVR features front, roll out 922 and all the new hardware and network/mobile functions. Hopefully the new remote access release is a good sign. This is the only way to compete with Fios/Uverse.

 

[jacmyoung]

Just read the Team Summit Report, even though what Charlie said was expected, still knowing what I said above in the end they both actually match very well, is quite satisfying

 

[riffjim4069]

Dish Network 1Q profit rises on equipment sales

Source

Dish Network Corp., the nation's second-largest satellite TV provider, said Monday that its first-quarter profit rose 21 percent as revenue climbed partly on equipment sales.

But the Englewood, Colo.-based company lost about 94,000 net subscribers during the quarter, which it blamed on the recession, signal theft and increased competition due to slowing growth in the pay-TV industry.

Dish also pointed the finger at itself in a filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission, saying it has "not always met our own standards for performing high quality installations." The satellite TV provider said it fell short at times in other areas, including answering customers' calls in an acceptable timeframe, communicating with its subscribers and resolving customers' problems.

Full Article

 

[tomcrown1]

Source

Dish Network Corp., the nation's second-largest satellite TV provider, said Monday that its first-quarter profit rose 21 percent as revenue climbed partly on equipment sales.

But the Englewood, Colo.-based company lost about 94,000 net subscribers during the quarter, which it blamed on the recession, signal theft and increased competition due to slowing growth in the pay-TV industry.

Dish also pointed the finger at itself in a filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission, saying it has "not always met our own standards for performing high quality installations." The satellite TV provider said it fell short at times in other areas, including answering customers' calls in an acceptable timeframe, communicating with its subscribers and resolving customers' problems.

Full Article

Charlie not right

1 BAD MARKETING DEPARTMENT!!!! fire you're marketing staff they STINK

2 the worst customer service in the cable satellite business get rid of your overseas customer service department

3 GOING AFTER LOW TEIR CUSTOMER!!! Were direct tv beats you is that they go after the high tier customers. Their top end tier has better pricing then dish when you consider all of dish stupid add on charges. The low tier customer will hope around as they always will look for the cheaper deal. Follow direct tv lead and go after the high tier customer.

 

[riffjim4069]

I just wanted to update the list now that DirecTV and Dish Network have posted (I have no idea when Cox, Cablevision and others publish their quarterly results):

Winners:
MediaCom gained +21,000 customers
Time Warner gained +36,000 customers
AT&T U-Verse gained +284,000 customers
Verizon FiOS gained +299,000 customers
DirecTV gained +460,000 customers

Losers:
Charter lost -22,200 customers
Cablevision lost -23,100 customers
Comcast lost -78,000 customers
Dish Network lost -94,000 customers