Echostar 14 update

[digiblur]

In the E10 days... I believe the second position of the TID was the uplink center which could help narrow down the beams.

I'll get some lists of the uplinks on Ciel-2 in a bit.

2042,EchoStar10,110W,TP 12,Spotbeam 30 from Cheyenne,E10_SB30.jpg
2142,EchoStar10,110W,TP 12,Spotbeam 46/47 from Gilbert,E10_SB4647.jpg
2146,EchoStar10,110W,TP 26,Spotbeam 34 from Gilbert,E10_SB34.jpg
2157,EchoStar10,110W,TP 27,Spotbeam 46/47 from Gilbert,E10_SB4647.jpg
2159,EchoStar10,110W,TP 29,Spotbeam 46/47 from Gilbert,E10_SB4647.jpg
2262,EchoStar10,110W,TP 12,Spotbeam 45 from Spokane,E10_SB45.jpg
2282,EchoStar10,110W,TP 12,Spotbeam 38 from Spokane,E10_SB38.jpg
2342,EchoStar10,110W,TP 12,Spotbeam 07 from New Braunfels,E10_SB7.jpg
2362,EchoStar10,110W,TP 12,Spotbeam 27 from New Braunfels,E10_SB27.jpg
2382,EchoStar10,110W,TP 12,Spotbeam 16 from New Braunfels,E10_SB16.jpg
2442,EchoStar10,110W,TP 12,Spotbeam 13 from Monee,E10_SB13.jpg
2462,EchoStar10,110W,TP 12,Spotbeam 28 from Monee,E10_SB28.jpg
2482,EchoStar10,110W,TP 12,Spotbeam 20 from Monee,E10_SB20.jpg
2542,EchoStar10,110W,TP 12,Spotbeam 01 from Mount Jackson,E10_SB1.jpg
2562,EchoStar10,110W,TP 12,Spotbeam 10 from Mount Jackson,E10_SB10.jpg
2582,EchoStar10,110W,TP 12,Spotbeam 04 from Mount Jackson,E10_SB4.jpg
2344,EchoStar10,110W,TP 04,Spotbeam 07 from New Braunfels,E10_SB7.jpg
2364,EchoStar10,110W,TP 04,Spotbeam 02 from New Braunfels,E10_SB2.jpg
2384,EchoStar10,110W,TP 04,Spotbeam 16 from New Braunfels,E10_SB16.jpg

 

[digiblur]

Ok... so here's the layout I see as E10 and Ciel-2 used this.

First digit will indicate the satellite E14... 6.
Second digit will indicate the uplink center: 0=Cheyenne, 1=Gilbert, 2=Spokane, 3=New Braunfels, 4=Monee, 5=Mt Jackson.
Third will be the unique indent of some sort
Fourth will relate the transponder number.

I don't believe the third one is related to the actual spotbeam number as in the filings on the satellite they do not use the same order number on the uplink beams for the uplink centers. So I doubt that number will jive with it.

But this should help narrow down some things....

EDIT... more info on the 3rd digit of the TID. I've been studying the data from E10 and it looks like the 3rd digit is tied to the uplink frequency used. If the number is odd, its an odd channel, even=even uplink channel. Here's a small snapshot of the 3rd digit relations to the uplink transponder used.

MTJ
4=TP4
4=TP12
4=TP18
4=TP26
5=TP23
5=TP25
6=TP6
6=TP14
6=TP22
7=TP13
7=TP15
8=TP2
8=TP10
8=TP16
8=TP24
9=TP3
9=TP5

New B
4=TP12
4=TP18
4=TP20
5=TP23
5=TP25
6=TP22
6=TP14
7=TP13
7=TP15
8=TP10
8=TP16
9=TP3

 

[AKGolf]

Sorry, missed it. The folks in Alaska and Hawaii should be happy because there are spotbeams using TPs 1 - 5 for both. Puerto Rico has four of 1 - 5.

We got a nice upgrade to our HD package last year and it looks like we might actually get the rest of the HD that the lower 48 currently gets this year.

 

[harshness]

Launch date usually shows up about a week or so before launch.

Dates for the next launch are often announced immediately after the lift-off of the current launch. We usually have about a month of advanced notice.

In the case of E14, the launch of the previous satellite, Intelsat 16, was on February 12th and the E14 launch date showed up on anik's list the next day.

The actual time of the launch usually comes a couple of weeks prior to the scheduled date.

 

[digiblur]

So here's the updated liste with the uplink centers... working on the list of the uplink channels to the downlink channels. then hopefully after that by process of elimination knock out the matchs to the beam numbers. I glanced at a couple of the TIDs on Ciel-2 and the third digit doesn't seem to follow the uplink/downlink method. So.... the 3 digit is still a mystery.

EchoStar14 119W TP 01 Spotbeam ??(TID 6001) from Cheyenne 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 01 Spotbeam ??(TID 6101) from Gilbert 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 01 Spotbeam ??(TID 6161) from Gilbert 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 01 Spotbeam ??(TID 6191) from Gilbert 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 01 Spotbeam ??(TID 6201) from Spokane 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 01 Spotbeam ??(TID 6291) from Spokane 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 01 Spotbeam ??(TID 6301) from New Braunfels 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 01 Spotbeam ??(TID 6381) from New Braunfels 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 01 Spotbeam ??(TID 6391) from New Braunfels 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 01 Spotbeam ??(TID 6401) from Monee 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 01 Spotbeam ??(TID 6491) from Monee 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 01 Spotbeam ??(TID 6501) from Mt Jackson 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 01 Spotbeam ??(TID 6571) from Mt Jackson 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 02 Spotbeam ??(TID 6002) from Cheyenne 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 02 Spotbeam ??(TID 6102) from Gilbert 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 02 Spotbeam ??(TID 6152) from Gilbert 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 02 Spotbeam ??(TID 6202) from Spokane 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 02 Spotbeam ??(TID 6252) from Spokane 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 02 Spotbeam ??(TID 6302) from New Braunfels 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 02 Spotbeam ??(TID 6352) from New Braunfels 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 02 Spotbeam ??(TID 6402) from Monee 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 02 Spotbeam ??(TID 6452) from Monee 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 02 Spotbeam ??(TID 6502) from Mt Jackson 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 02 Spotbeam ??(TID 6552) from Mt Jackson 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 02 Spotbeam ??(TID 6592) from Mt Jackson 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 03 Spotbeam ??(TID 6003) from Cheyenne 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 03 Spotbeam ??(TID 6103) from Gilbert 20000 QPSK 5/6 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 03 Spotbeam ??(TID 6193) from Gilbert 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 03 Spotbeam ??(TID 6203) from Spokane 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 03 Spotbeam ??(TID 6293) from Spokane 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 03 Spotbeam ??(TID 6303) from New Braunfels 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 03 Spotbeam ??(TID 6393) from New Braunfels 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 03 Spotbeam ??(TID 6493) from Monee 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 03 Spotbeam ??(TID 6503) from Mt Jackson 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 03 Spotbeam ??(TID 6573) from Mt Jackson 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 03 Spotbeam ??(TID 6593) from Mt Jackson 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 04 Spotbeam ??(TID 6004) from Cheyenne 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 04 Spotbeam ??(TID 6104) from Gilbert 20000 QPSK 5/6 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 04 Spotbeam ??(TID 6144) from Gilbert 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 04 Spotbeam ??(TID 6154) from Gilbert 20000 QPSK 5/6 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 04 Spotbeam ??(TID 6204) from Spokane 20000 QPSK 5/6 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 04 Spotbeam ??(TID 6254) from Spokane 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 04 Spotbeam ??(TID 6304) from New Braunfels 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 04 Spotbeam ??(TID 6354) from New Braunfels 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 04 Spotbeam ??(TID 6404) from Monee 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 04 Spotbeam ??(TID 6454) from Monee 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 04 Spotbeam ??(TID 6504) from Mt Jackson 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 04 Spotbeam ??(TID 6554) from Mt Jackson 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 04 Spotbeam ??(TID 6594) from Mt Jackson 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 05 Spotbeam ??(TID 6005) from Cheyenne 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 05 Spotbeam ??(TID 6105) from Gilbert 20000 QPSK 5/6 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 05 Spotbeam ??(TID 6165) from Gilbert 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 05 Spotbeam ??(TID 6195) from Gilbert 20000 QPSK 5/6 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 05 Spotbeam ??(TID 6205) from Spokane 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 05 Spotbeam ??(TID 6295) from Spokane 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 05 Spotbeam ??(TID 6305) from New Braunfels 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 05 Spotbeam ??(TID 6385) from New Braunfels 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 05 Spotbeam ??(TID 6395) from New Braunfels 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 05 Spotbeam ??(TID 6405) from Monee 20000 QPSK 5/6 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 05 Spotbeam ??(TID 6495) from Monee 21500 8PSK 2/3 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 05 Spotbeam ??(TID 6505) from Mt Jackson 20000 QPSK 7/8 added
EchoStar14 119W TP 05 Spotbeam ??(TID 6595) from Mt Jackson 21500 8PSK 2/3 added

 

[SatJim]

I've been working on this for a while now and I think you're on to something.

Using the first two digits works well. Tie that with the database filed with the FCC, that would make the 6001~6132 and 6101~6132 TIDs CONUS. Which is interesting in itself.

At least that's what I come up with so far.

 

[HDRoberts]

I posted the link a few posts up Here it is again... most beams seem to have one or two TPs between 1-5.

http://www.satelliteguys.us/dish-ne...lite-utilization-information.html#post1842789

Echostar 14 Spotbeams that do not have TP's 1-5 (not launched yet)

Click on the beam to view the coverage area.

Spotbeam A6 - North Dakota - Transponders 8

Spotbeam B1 - Oregon - Transponders 8,10

Spotbeam B5 - Minnesota/Wisconsin - Transponders 9

Spotbeam B6 - Utah - Transponders 10

Spotbeam B19 - North Florida - Transponders 9,13

Hmm, you know what might be neat with these maps? I don't know if is even technically feasible, but somehow showing DMAs. I think it would be interesting to see if the DMAs covered by these beams are already well covered by other spots, and if HD locals are available.

 

[MikeInAlaska]

Whats the meaning of life?

So what does this mean for 119? Same stuff, different sat? HD on 119? I can see that it means more spots for Alaska so does this mean they may be shuffling stuff all around? I get good signals on 110, 119 and 129 right now so does this probably mean nothing at all new for me?

Mike

 

[digiblur]

I've been working on this for a while now and I think you're on to something.

Using the first two digits works well. Tie that with the database filed with the FCC, that would make the 6001~6132 and 6101~6132 TIDs CONUS. Which is interesting in itself.

At least that's what I come up with so far.

Typically the 4 digit TIDs are spotbeams... 3 or less are CONUS. And yes, E-14 has the capability to be used CONUS on TP 1-32 from either Gilbert to Cheyenne, of course their licenses at 119 does not allow this but it makes sense to have a flexible bird.

Here's the ranges today:
2-21 - E7 CONUS
4-89 - E7 Spot (also uses the same last digit downlink TP method)
101-132 - 61.5 CONUS
201-232 - 110 CONUS
240-290 - Ex-E8 beams at 110(last digit is downlink TP)
301-332 - 148 CONUS
401-432 - 129 CONUS (17-32 currently used by Ciel2)
501-532 - 121 CONUS
601-624 - 105 CONUS
701-732 - 118.7 CONUS
801-832 - 77 CONUS
901-932 - 72 CONUS
1101-1915 - 61.5 Spotbeams(last digit is downlink TP)
2042-2391 - 110 Spotbeams(last digit is downlink TP)
4001-4586 - 129 Spotbeams(last digit is downlink TP)
6000-etc - 119 new Spotbeams(last digit is downlink TP)

 

[HDRoberts]

Hmm, for example, spot checking the North Dakota spot, they already get HD locals off 129 (spots 7 and 8, Fargo and Bismark, no other DMAs there) with room for more on those spots.

Again I wonder if much of the spot capacity on E14 isn't backup for E10 and Ciel-2.

 

[rocatman]

Hmm, for example, spot checking the North Dakota spot, they already get HD locals off 129 (spots 7 and 8, Fargo and Bismark, no other DMAs there) with room for more on those spots.

Again I wonder if much of the spot capacity on E14 isn't backup for E10 and Ciel-2.

You can look at it as backup but you need to think about how much spotbeam capacity will be needed to carry all the local stations in HD in the future. Realize also that once the Western Arc (WA) goes to all MPEG-4, the number of CONUS TPs required will decrease significantly even with more HD channels because at that time, Dish will not need to downlink the duplicate SD channel. Certainly there will still be a large number of national channels in SD for the foreseeable future but these will take up half or less bandwidth space that they currently do with MPEG-2/QPSK.

 

[desifan]

Did you watch the night-lime launch of the Space Shuttle on HDNET? It was awsome.

 

[AKGolf]

So what does this mean for 119? Same stuff, different sat? HD on 119? I can see that it means more spots for Alaska so does this mean they may be shuffling stuff all around? I get good signals on 110, 119 and 129 right now so does this probably mean nothing at all new for me?

Mike

We only get one spot beam from 119 right now for the locals, adding five more should allow them to get more HD to Alaska. I'm not sure anyone knows what Dish will do, but putting up HD on these seems logical and would allow us to catch up to the lower 48.

 

[djmaui]

We got a nice upgrade to our HD package last year and it looks like we might actually get the rest of the HD that the lower 48 currently gets this year.

I thought HI/AK were getting 2 spots each w/ 5 TP's, but it's actually 1,3,5 on one spot and 2,4 on the other for HI. AK is similar, but w/ one more even TP (10).

Still, this is easily enough room to give HI/AK all the missing HD that the contiguous 48 states get. Hawaii is currently missing about 16 HD premiums and 13 HD nats.

HI receives 38 HD channels on 5 TP's @ the 129 spot.

The only thing on the existing (1TP) 119 spot for HI is our SD locals.

 

[desifan]

You can look at it as backup but you need to think about how much spotbeam capacity will be needed to carry all the local stations in HD in the future. Realize also that once the Western Arc (WA) goes to all MPEG-4, the number of CONUS TPs required will decrease significantly even with more HD channels because at that time, Dish will not need to downlink the duplicate SD channel. Certainly there will still be a large number of national channels in SD for the foreseeable future but these will take up half or less bandwidth space that they currently do with MPEG-2/QPSK.

When is the Western arc expected to go all MPEG-4? After E14 is fully functional?

 

[HDRoberts]

You can look at it as backup but you need to think about how much spotbeam capacity will be needed to carry all the local stations in HD in the future. Realize also that once the Western Arc (WA) goes to all MPEG-4, the number of CONUS TPs required will decrease significantly even with more HD channels because at that time, Dish will not need to downlink the duplicate SD channel. Certainly there will still be a large number of national channels in SD for the foreseeable future but these will take up half or less bandwidth space that they currently do with MPEG-2/QPSK.

Thing is, when the WA goes EA and no duplicate MPEG2 SD locals are needed, there will also be massive amounts of space on E10. When that happens, there will be all the space they need on the WA for HD LiL. Plus, in the example I gave, there are only 7 HD locals in Fargo, and 6 in Bismark. Plenty of space for all on the existing 129 spots.

 

[mike123abc]

119 currently has 5 TPs in use for spot beams. If memory serves me they reused each TP about 5 times for a total of 25. Essentially it looks like they have gone from 25 to 62 beams, or about 2.5x more LiL ability. It should help with a lot of secondary station capacity, plus able to pick up some remaining markets.

 

[mike123abc]

Thing is, when the WA goes EA and no duplicate MPEG2 SD locals are needed, there will also be massive amounts of space on E10. When that happens, there will be all the space they need on the WA for HD LiL. Plus, in the example I gave, there are only 7 HD locals in Fargo, and 6 in Bismark. Plenty of space for all on the existing 129 spots.

I do not think WA will go MPEG-4 like EA this year, I think they are just converting to 8PSK which the newer MPEG-2 boxes support. It will probably be a few more years before they are ready to dump the remaining MPEG-2 boxes.

 

[HDRoberts]

I do not think WA will go MPEG-4 like EA this year, I think they are just converting to 8PSK which the newer MPEG-2 boxes support. It will probably be a few more years before they are ready to dump the remaining MPEG-2 boxes.

Dish does not have to carry 100% of HD LiL in markets before 2013, so they have time.

 

[navychop]

When is the Western arc expected to go all MPEG-4? After E14 is fully functional?

There is no set date, but it is certainly years off. Once all transmissions are MPEG-4, millions of older receivers will be obsolete and no longer work. Replacing them will not be a minor expense. Best to spread that expense over some years. Of course, the bandwidth recovered will be of great value, too - delaying or eliminating the need to launch another sat.