DTV setup for a large house

[Tired Techie]

I am not a Direct TV (DTV) customer but am trying to help an existing long-term Direct TV Satellite customer that is not tech savvy.

I believe they first went to DTV as they had the best sports offerings. They subscribed to NFL, NBA, MLB, and a Sports package.

They moved five years ago, so the satellite dish is five years old.

Last year I helped them get set up with the NFL Sunday Ticket + RedZone from YouTube.

They are in a large house now, with lots of TV’s. They have a mixed bag of services but can only watch one DTV channel at a time, although it can be displayed on multiple TVs using an existing Control4 system, that they hate. Also, being a large house, that was already wired with CAT6, they would prefer to not use WiFi for TV services.

I am exploring alternative configurations that remove Control4 from the equation and get them multiple DTV channels simultaneously.

Option 1) Stay on DTV satellite
Let’s assume the satellite dish is current. If not, it will be upgraded as needed.

My understanding is that the dish delivers channels via coax to either a Genie (HR54), or a Genie 2 (HS17).

The house is wired with CAT6, but not coax. I have been told that they can put Gemini boxes at each TV and then have each TV on a different channel (or streaming app), if desired. And that older, or non-tech savvy people generally like the “cable-box” feel of the Gemini and its remote. (Cost $7/mo + $49/one-time fee for each Gemini.)

I have been told that the Gemini can be connected to the Genie (or Genie 2) with CAT6 directly, and no coax. Others have said DTV does not support CAT6 and you need coax + DECA to connect the Gemini using the ethernet port. Which is correct?

Also, the Genie 2 only supports eight Gemini boxes, and seven simultaneous connections. If you want more TVs, you cannot add a second Genie 2. How would you connect TVs 9 and 10?

I was also told (by a DTV salesperson) that the Gemini doesn’t work well with 4K. For 4K, they recommended a stand-alone HD receiver. Is this correct? And does this require a coax run?

I was also told that if the satellite is impacted by weather, that the system would be able to use the internet to continue receiving the channels. But only three simultaneous streams from the internet.

Option 2) DTV Streaming

I was told Streaming has all the same programming, except no Music station. That is not an issue.

Aside from not needing a dish on the roof, would the boxes and wires in the house be the same?

Is the total experience the same, better, or worse?

If they put in a fiber internet connection, would there be any latency issues as compared to the satellite?

Option 3) DTV Internet

Is this different that Option 2 – DTV Streaming?


Is DTV really the best service provider for a non-tech savvy person? They are familiar with the cable-box paradigm – giving them a remote with channel numbers, a channel guide, and then the modern addition of apps (e.g. Netflix, Prime, YouTube). However, it appears that since NFL moved to YouTube, and all the other sports packages can be licensed without DTV, what is the DTV advantage, if any?

I know there are a lot of questions above. And that is after many hours of reading forums, DTV and other websites, and talking to salespeople. But there is nothing like the actual people that have and use the system to tell it like it is. Your help is very much appreciated. Thank you.

 

[b4pjoe]

The easiest path would be the HS17 which does not connect to a TV. You would need coax from the dish to the HS17. You use clients at each TV and they can be wired or wireless. Wired clients need coax. You can have 8 clients on the HS17 but can only watch 7 at a time. As far as the Gemini DIRECTV shows the setup for wired is with coax to a DECA and an Ethernet cable to the Gemini. Wireless setup for the Gemini would connect wireless to the HS17 but they would all have to close enough to the HS17. There are other wireless clients you could use instead of the Gemini but none are 4K. I am not sure if the HS17 can use 7 Geminis on the HS17. I know there were reports of not being able to use more than one on the HR54 at one point. Not sure if that was ever fixed or if it applied to the HS17 also.

4K via the Gemini uses HDR (no Dolby Vision). Looks great but you can only watch DIRECTV 4K from 2 clients at a time. The Gemini can have streaming apps installed on it. Other clients cannot. If you need more than 7 TV you can also install the DIRECTV app on some smart TV’s or on a Roku, Fire TV device, Apple TV etc…but it depends on what you are trying to watch as the app has most of the channels that are on satellite but not everything. I think you have 3 streams using the app but with the app there aren’t dedicated remotes with channel numbers.

DIRECTV via Internet and Stream are the same service. Stream is a BYOD (Bring Your Own Device). With DIRECT via Internet you can have the DIRECTV devices ($7.00 per month for each device) with the remote with channel numbers. It also has a 2 year contract, Advanced Receiver Service fee of $15 per month and RSN fees that can be as high as $15.99 per month. The Stream service has no contract or these extra fees.

 

[John2021]

the wired gemini still uses the coax from an old mini and converts it into eithernet. how many t.v.s are we talking about hooking up the HS-17 can handle 8 tvs but can only stream 7 at once

 

[Tired Techie]

There are ten TV's in the house, but only seven would need the cable-box experience. The other three can use the DTV app. However, if the HS17 can only support two TV's at 4K, that is not so great as this is a sports oriented house. And if the Gemini's need coax, that doesn't work at all.

I am reluctant to suggest they use wireless Geminis, even though there are access points throughout the house, as the wifi is so much less reliable than hard wired connections.

Can anyone recommend a DTV solution for a large house that supports 4K with CAT6 instead of coax? Or are we better off looking at other services and technologies?

Thanks.

 

[John2021]

There are ten TV's in the house, but only seven would need the cable-box experience. The other three can use the DTV app. However, if the HS17 can only support two TV's at 4K, that is not so great as this is a sports oriented house. And if the Gemini's need coax, that doesn't work at all.

I am reluctant to suggest they use wireless Geminis, even though there are access points throughout the house, as the wifi is so much less reliable than hard wired connections.

Can anyone recommend a DTV solution for a large house that supports 4K with CAT6 instead of coax? Or are we better off looking at other services and technologies?

Thanks.

you could do 7 boxes and the rest on the dtv app. seems dtv is also charging for installs now the coax to the gemini comes from the splitter from the dish. you can place the HS-17 where ever you want we have ours in the media room in a closet hardwired to our roter. id'e take the hardwired over the wireless geminis for smoother transport and dont have to worry about it dropping out from loss of wifi

 

[b4pjoe]

There are ten TV's in the house, but only seven would need the cable-box experience. The other three can use the DTV app. However, if the HS17 can only support two TV's at 4K, that is not so great as this is a sports oriented house. And if the Gemini's need coax, that doesn't work at all.

I am reluctant to suggest they use wireless Geminis, even though there are access points throughout the house, as the wifi is so much less reliable than hard wired connections.

Can anyone recommend a DTV solution for a large house that supports 4K with CAT6 instead of coax? Or are we better off looking at other services and technologies?

Thanks.

The limit on having 2 4K's at once isn't something that would be a problem most of the time as DIRECTV rarely has more than two sports events in 4K at the same time. Unless you are wanting to be able to watch the same event on more than one TV at a time. The 2 4K limit only applies to DIRECTV programming so if you are watching a streaming app that is showing 4K events the limit is only what your internet service is.

DIRECTV doesn't officially support this but once a Gemini is setup you can remove it from the DECA and use Ethernet only. (HS17 wired ethernet to your local networks and then Gemini wired ethernet to your local network) I think you do have to have the DECA to setup the Gemini as a client to the server (HS17) or you may be able to set it up wireless and then change it over to Ethernet after the setup is complete. But you are most likely on your own if you have problems with it. DIRECTV install instructions only say use the DECA or wireless. I also wonder if DIRECTV even supports all 7 clients being Gemini's.

 

[prushing]

The Control4 needs to be fixed so they don't even know it's there or gotten rid of like you said. If they aren't tech savoy, that was a terrible decision to install. FYI, you will most likely have to pay a dealer to make changes. It's a great system if you have a good dealer but without that, people waste their money on it. I would look at the cost to fix it first as they probably already paid for a ton of hardware.

With that many TVs, will they ever be on at the same time? You need to start with that. If the TVs aren't on at the same time, it doesn't really matter how many there are. Do the TVs need to be in sync if they are showing the same channel/program?

This is what I would do.

1. Stay with DTV
   
   1. Fix Control4 - their limitation to watching 1 channel is because of a stupid setup. They should have up to 8 DTV clients sitting in the closet (or wherever they are) and then using HDMI to ethernet to send the signal to the TVs. Then make sure the remotes are able to connect or fix that.
      1. You can limit the # of boxes, send the same signal to multiple TVs, etc.
   2. Remove Control4 and use DTV clients at each location - you should be able to use wired setup and isolate traffic to its own switch (assuming this house has a network closet with Control4 installed it should)
      1. Connect all the clients and HS17 to the new switch, to keep it off the rest of the network traffic
2. Go to Streaming
   
   1. Fix Control4 - you can setup streaming similar and then send the same signal to any TV, multiple, etc
      1. Have as many streaming devices as you need, same setup needed to send signals to TVs
   2. Remove Control4 devices and use streaming devices at each TV