Dish Expansion: What is Committed/Uncommitted?

[gpflepsen]

In the world of setting the DiSEqC switch settings for 4x1 and 8x1 switches, what is Committed and Uncommitted? I saw this on my pc when setting up my simple 4x1 switch, but I'm going to start combining a 4x1 and a couple 8x1 switches to get away from a lot of motor movements. What is Committed?

Do you think I'll run into signal level issues due to level drop through multiple switches?

Currently have 8' and 90cm dishes in use. Looking to get a 10' and maybe a 12' mesh planted along with several 84e and another 90cm Channel Master installed. And the newest addition to the shop is a 1.8m Prodeline.

Sent from a phone, probably while I'm driving over the speed limit through a school zone with construction workers present.

 

[gpflepsen]

I'll add that my initial plan is to use a 4x1 diseqc to a sole receiver. From the 4x1 switch, two ports will go to 8x1 switches to service stationary dishes. The two remaining 4x1 ports will go to motorized dishes.

If you think this would be a train wreck in the making, please say so!



Sent from a phone, probably while I'm driving over the speed limit through a school zone with construction workers present.

 

[Mr Tony]

The 8x1 has to be first, then the 4x1's

uncommitted is 1st (which is the 8x1)
committed is the 4x1's

http://www.satelliteguys.us/xen/posts/1344319/

http://www.satelliteguys.us/xen/threads/digiwave-8x1-uncomitted-switch.110067/

 

[Mr Tony]

committed means any receiver will handle it
uncommitted means the receiver has to have diseqc 1.1 capability or the only port that works is port 1

 

[Titanium]

Good reading:
http://www.eutelsat.com/files/contr...sociated docs/applic_info_turner-receiver.pdf

 

[Keith Brannen]

You can have a committed switch (standard 4x1) first after the receiver, and then put uncommitted switches (8x1) on those four ports (of course, that is assuming your receiver can handle the combination of committed/uncommitted switches).

My AZBox Ultra has a Combination mode where you can tell it whether the path is committed first and then uncommitted, or vice versa, though I don't know how critical that is to setting it up. For example, someone else on another site was running through his AZBox one 4x1 first and four 8x1 on those ports with the setting as uncommitted then committed, and it did work. Believe it worked because most/all? receivers send the DiSEqC commands multiple times, so it did eventually find the correct path. But setting it up correctly in the receiver probably would reduce switching times (milliseconds?).

YMMV depending on your receiver.

 

[Mr Tony]

Any time I ever put the 4x1 1st it didnt work. Now then this was back in the olden days with the CS5000 and Visionsat so it may have changed since then. I never tried my MicroHD with that because I went back to motorized and a fixed dish at that time

 

[KE4EST]

Yeah, the way it is supposed to work is the committed switch goes first, then you come out to the uncommitted. Who knows though with some of the strange firmware that was on and is on some of these boxes.

 

[Keith Brannen]

Any time I ever put the 4x1 1st it didnt work. Now then this was back in the olden days with the CS5000 and Visionsat so it may have changed since then. I never tried my MicroHD with that because I went back to motorized and a fixed dish at that time

Well at least your old receivers could do it in some combination! My Pansat 3500SD firmware didn't do 1.1 for quite a while until they finally added it, and while it could then do uncommitted, it could not be set up to do the combination of committed and uncommitted. As I said, YMMV depending on the receiver!

 

[a33]

Though you can probably read some/most of this in the eutelsat document, this is what I found out learning about diseqc switching:

The word 'committed' derives from the fact that diseqc 1.0-switching is in fact compatible with (so: committed to) other (older) methods for switching band, polarization, position and option.
Diseqc 1.0 is therefore compatible with 13/18volt switching; 0/22kHz switching; and toneburst switching. (For switching on option-command, there is no other (older) way of switching than via the diseqc protocol.)
The LNB-switching between band and polarization is very very rarely done with diseqc though, I believe. The old switching method prevails there.

The uncommitted switch-commands can be used totally free, in any way you like.
There are 2^4 switch possibillities in uncommitted switching, so even 16/1 switches exist!
Combining them with committed switches, even more possibillities arise.

The switches can be used parallel or serial (cascading). In serial use, the order is not important, as long as the diseqc commands can reach them through the cascade.
Therefore your receiver should be able to give the commands in the order of your switches, or be able to repeat commands.
Most receivers use as standard order: first uncommitted command, then committed command.

Be aware with 8/1 switches: some switch purely on uncommitted commands, others switch on a mix of committed and uncommitted commands. With some you can set the (wanted) switching mode. Some even can switch on diseqc 1.2 commands!

With 8/1 or 10/1 or 16/1 switches switching in combined 1.1/1.0-mode: I don't know if the order or repeating is important there; never seen that tested. As ONE IC(chip) inside will receive all the commands for the switching, my assumption is that order of commands is irrelevant, and/or repeating commands is unnecessary.

Not all switches can endure motor-current. So be carefull there: chose your switch and/or motors wisely! (The faster the motor, the more current used, usually.)

Greetz,
A33

 

[gpflepsen]

Thanks A33 for a detailed response!

I have on hand a couple Amiko D-8/1 (uncommitted) on hand along with a couple Amiko 4/1 committed switches. I want to run one 4/1 and two 8/1 to support two general dish areas.

I use the Amiko A3 for most of my FTA play, and I've noticed the switch settings include both DiSeqC 1.0 and 1.1 settings. I should probably test an assembly of switches before "committing" to a switch scheme. (see what I did there?)

Sent from a phone, probably while I'm driving over the speed limit through a school zone with construction workers present.