Cold and confused

[techpuppy]

Of course my receiver would arrive as the temperature here went from the mid 60's to single digits. So you can imagine that after a rough aiming and hooking up the receiver I got 87% signal strength I thought some tweaking would get me quality which is at zero. After some experimenting with the dish aiming...adjust the dish, thaw, repeat, I find that I get 87% signal strength no matter where the dish is pointed. Obviously something is wrong. I tried changing transponder settings on the receiver and different transponders show different signal levels and no quality. I tried disconnecting the coax to the dish and signal levels went down to zero. Now what?

Here's the setup: Primestar .9 meter dish with separate V & H connectors (I'm using vertical.) Receiver is a DVB express ST-7700. Based on other threads I was trying to get a signal on G10R, transponder frequency 12114 and symbol rate 0444Khz, Vertical polarity, 1.50 ms skew. Under antenna setup, antenna #1 (I only have one), LNB Frequency is set to 10750, 22Khz control is off, DiSEqC is disabled, Tone burst is off, Positioner is off, 12 volt output is off, LNB power is on, and I have it set to scan all channel types, although with no signal quality it can't find anything during a scan. My zip code is 65484.

What would be a good order of troubleshooting?

 

[PSB]

Sounds like a pointing issue, signal strength means zippo, only quality.

I would enter a LIVE TP, and have a small TV at the dish, its the only way to get it done!

Huggins, MO 65484
     Latitude 37° 15.972'N Longitude 92° 8.916'W

              Sat Name Sat Lng Az(t) Az(m)   El  Skew
-----------------------------------------------------
                      
            Telstar 12   15.0W  97.9  96.5  1.5 -52.0
          Intelsat 901   18.0W  99.8  98.4  3.9 -51.7
                 NSS 7   22.0W 102.3 101.0  7.0 -51.0
          Intelsat 905   24.5W 104.0 102.6  9.0 -50.6
          Intelsat 907   27.5W 106.0 104.6 11.4 -49.9
         Hispasat 1C/D   30.0W 107.7 106.4 13.4 -49.3
          Intelsat 801   31.5W 108.8 107.4 14.5 -48.9
          Intelsat 903   34.5W 111.0 109.6 16.9 -48.0
           AMC 12/T 11   37.5W 113.2 111.9 19.2 -47.0
               NSS 806   40.5W 115.6 114.2 21.5 -45.9
             Pas 3R/6B   43.0W 117.6 116.3 23.4 -44.8
                Pas 1R   45.0W 119.3 118.0 24.9 -43.9
          Intelsat 705   50.0W 123.8 122.4 28.5 -41.4
          Intelsat 707   53.0W 126.6 125.3 30.6 -39.7
          Intelsat 805   55.5W 129.1 127.8 32.3 -38.1
                 Pas 9   58.0W 131.8 130.4 34.0 -36.4
              Amazonas   61.0W 135.1 133.7 35.9 -34.2
            EchoStar 3   61.5W 135.6 134.3 36.2 -33.8
             Rainbow 1   61.5W 135.6 134.3 36.2 -33.8
      Estrela do Sul 1   63.0W 137.4 136.0 37.1 -32.6
          Brasilsat B2   65.0W 139.7 138.4 38.3 -31.0
          Brasilsat B1   70.0W 146.1 144.7 40.9 -26.4
              Nahuel 1   71.8W 148.5 147.1 41.8 -24.6
             DirecTV 1   72.5W 149.5 148.1 42.1 -23.8
                 AMC 6   72.0W 148.8 147.4 41.9 -24.4
                 SBS 6   74.0W 151.6 150.2 42.8 -22.3
            Echostar 4   77.0W 155.9 154.5 43.9 -19.0
                 AMC 5   79.0W 158.9 157.5 44.6 -16.6
               Nimiq 2   82.0W 163.5 162.2 45.5 -13.0
                 AMC-9   83.0W 165.1 163.7 45.7 -11.8
          Brasilsat B3   84.0W 166.7 165.3 45.9 -10.6
              AMC 2/16   85.0W 168.3 166.9 46.1  -9.3
                 AMC 3   87.0W 171.5 170.2 46.4  -6.7
                  IA-8   89.0W 174.8 173.4 46.7  -4.1
             Galaxy 11   91.0W 178.1 176.7 46.8  -1.5
             Nimiq 1/3   91.0W 178.1 176.7 46.8  -1.5
          Brasilsat B4   92.0W 179.8 178.4 46.8  -0.2
             Telstar 6   93.0W 181.4 180.0 46.8   1.1
             Galaxy 3C   95.0W 184.7 183.3 46.7   3.7
             Telstar 5   97.0W 188.0 186.6 46.5   6.3
             Galaxy 4R   99.0W 191.2 189.9 46.2   8.9
       DirecTV 1R/4S/8  101.0W 194.4 193.1 45.8  11.4
                 AMC 4  101.0W 194.4 193.1 45.8  11.4
            Spaceway 1  102.0W 196.0 194.6 45.6  12.7
                 AMC 1  103.0W 197.6 196.2 45.3  13.9
                AMC 15  105.0W 200.6 199.3 44.7  16.3
           Anik F1/F1R  107.3W 204.1 202.7 43.9  19.0
           DirecTV 6/5  109.5W 207.3 205.9 43.1  21.4
            EchoStar 6  110.0W 208.0 206.6 42.9  21.9
            EchoStar 8  110.0W 208.0 206.6 42.9  21.9
               Anik F2  111.1W 209.6 208.2 42.4  23.1
         Solidaridad 2  113.0W 212.2 210.8 41.5  25.1
              SatMex 5  116.8W 217.2 215.8 39.6  28.7
             DirecTV 5  119.0W 219.9 218.5 38.4  30.7
            EchoStar 7  119.0W 219.9 218.5 38.4  30.7
 EchoStar 9/Telstar 13  121.0W 222.3 220.9 37.3  32.4
            Galaxy 10R  123.0W 224.6 223.2 36.1  34.0
             Galaxy 12  125.0W 226.8 225.5 34.8  35.5
         Galaxy 13/H 1  127.0W 229.0 227.6 33.5  36.9
  Telstar 7/Echostar 5  129.0W 231.1 229.7 32.2  38.2
                AMC 11  131.0W 233.1 231.7 30.8  39.5
             Galaxy 1R  133.0W 235.0 233.6 29.4  40.7
                AMC 10  135.0W 236.9 235.5 28.0  41.8
                 AMC 7  137.0W 238.7 237.3 26.6  42.8
                 AMC 8  139.0W 240.4 239.1 25.1  43.8
            EchoStar 1  148.0W 247.7 246.3 18.3  47.4
            EchoStar 2  148.0W 247.7 246.3 18.3  47.4

   Satellite Finder is (c) Copyright 2004, P. Lutus

 

[ken2400]

1. Get a in-line signal meter. SF-95 works and and is cheap.
2. Don't relay on the elvation marks on the dish. Mine Channel master E84 is off like by 5 or so.
3. Shoot for 121 W once you find 12074 V 20000SR that has the test channel. Move the dish to the right only enought to lose the the signal. Now you should close to getting G10R.
4. Fine tune the dish for the best quility on your weakest transpondor.

Of course my receiver would arrive as the temperature here went from the mid 60's to single digits. So you can imagine that after a rough aiming and hooking up the receiver I got 87% signal strength I thought some tweaking would get me quality which is at zero. After some experimenting with the dish aiming...adjust the dish, thaw, repeat, I find that I get 87% signal strength no matter where the dish is pointed. Obviously something is wrong. I tried changing transponder settings on the receiver and different transponders show different signal levels and no quality. I tried disconnecting the coax to the dish and signal levels went down to zero. Now what?

Here's the setup: Primestar .9 meter dish with separate V & H connectors (I'm using vertical.) Receiver is a DVB express ST-7700. Based on other threads I was trying to get a signal on G10R, transponder frequency 12114 and symbol rate 0444Khz, Vertical polarity, 1.50 ms skew. Under antenna setup, antenna #1 (I only have one), LNB Frequency is set to 10750, 22Khz control is off, DiSEqC is disabled, Tone burst is off, Positioner is off, 12 volt output is off, LNB power is on, and I have it set to scan all channel types, although with no signal quality it can't find anything during a scan. My zip code is 65484.

What would be a good order of troubleshooting?

 

[dishMIKE]

It helped me to strap a DBS LNB to the side of the primestar lnb if you didn't have a signal meter. When I got a signal from 119 I knew I was close. You could use your ST-7700 or a Dish receiver to get to 119 or 121(KU LNB) and tweak it from there. I know that I haven't good luck getting a signal honed in when it's cloudy or overcast ( the receiver/TV combo on the roof method). Hope you get it in soon. It is the greatest feeling when you finally get that quality meter to register. This is head and shoulders the best forum for getting help from others. Mike

 

[123tim]

It is the greatest feeling when you finally get that quality meter to register.

There's no better feeling than seeing that "Quality signal pop up!" Especially after several hours "days" of aiming. My first time took several evenings before I finally found it.

I'll add my personal opinion/comment here: Get yourself a good Lensatic compass. They're the ones with the small lens that you pop up to look through. I think that they're much more precise. (My opinion.) I got mine at a sporting goods store for around 15 dollars. Some look like they could cost hundreds...I don't think that you need to go that far

My technique is to loosen all adjustments slightly and to move the dish left to right,
and up and down by very small increments while watching the TV parked right beside me. Of course, I have the luxury of having my dish at ground level.

A word of encouragement - Someone once said on this forum that they could align a a dish without needing a compass. I didn't believe them at the time, but I know now that it can be done!

It sounds sort of odd to me that you're getting a an 87 percent no quality signal everywhere. Maybe that's just a charactersitc of you receiver. But like Pete said "signal strength means zippo." (!)

Good Luck!

 

[penguinsix]

I aligned without a compass, but I did check with "Starry Night" to determine how 'off' the Sun was to due South (turned out it was 11:52 or something). It was a sunny day and I put a stick in the ground and when the Sun was directly at due South, I put several other sticks (pencils) in the ground in the shadow of the first stick. I then laid a long stick down directly along the line of the pencils in the ground and had my true due South.

A bit of overkill I know, but I didn't use a compass.

and for what it is worth--it worked. The elevation was another matter as I was looking at the wrong mark for about three hours....

 

[speedy1906]

So what happen? I am just curious since I am trying to do the same in the cold.

 

[techpuppy]

Almost there!

Hi Everyone,

Thanks for the tips and advice. Before I went to work today I managed to get a 76% quality and 100% signal level (on the 12114 transponder), but the picture was still pixelating and freezing so there's some more work to do. The primestar elevation scale is so far off it is sad. The correct elevation for my location is 36, but the primestar elevation scale shows 52 degrees. So, as mentioned elsewhere, don't count on the elevation marks on the primestar dish to be accurate. I was about to give up when I started getting a signal.

My next step will be to go back outside, tune to one of the weaker transponders and try for better aiming and perhaps adjust the skew a bit as well. I know it doesn't matter, but it is annoying to get a 86% signal strength level no matter where the dish was pointed (even north).

 

[techpuppy]

Hooray! Just after the post above I unplugged my receiver to move it. When I plugged it back in and turned it on I now have 35 channels of FTA! No pixelization and no freezing. I'm sure pulling the plug reset something other than the clock. I'm still going to try for better dish aiming tomorrow. This is like the first time I got cable and stayed up most of the night just to see what was on. Thanks again everyone!

 

[PSB]

Well Done!

I still remember that feeling!

 

[7720driver]

Hey techpuppy, you said you were using the "vertical" output of the Primestar LNB. I was just wondering how you could get the horizontal channels too. Guys, how would he do that? I'm sure he'd have to use switch. Would it be a diseqc switch? What about a 22KHz switch? And how would you set the receiver up for that situation. Maybe you could enter two satellite entries for one location (one satellite entry would be for vertical and use diseqc switch position 1....and the other satellite entry would be for horizontal and use diseqc switch position 2).

My equipment:
Coolsat 5000, sg2100 motor, Primestar dish, Invacom QPH-031 quad LNB
Echostar 710 analog receiver, 10 BUD, ASC421 C-band LNBF
Echostar 811 receiver, 510 receiver, two 301 receivers, DP34 switch, Superdish

 

[Mr Tony]

You can do it one of two ways

-either a Diseqc switch or 22K switch. Just set it up in the receiver menu properly
-use a DirecTv 3x4, 2x4, 4x4, etc multiswitch. It might be overkill if you have just one receiver (but if its all you have handy)

 

[7720driver]

Thanks for the info, Iceberg. I might need it some day.