Arena Football League Returns
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I always thought that arena attendance for the NHL was quite healthy. the TV ratings are another matter.
The correct way to say this is "Most hockey teams either completely sell out, or come very close to filling the arenas they have". While a handful do not. Your post makes it sound like the opposite.
Sandra
I thought that was what I said. Like I said TV is another matter altogether but arena attendance is heatly.
Even when it was real TV (NBC rather than VS) game 2 of the Stanely Cup tied with a rerun of America's Funniest Home Videos last year.
There is no way adding any amount of geography to it (Canada) makes the NHL more popular than the NFL.
There is no way adding any amount of geography to it (Canada) makes the NHL more popular than the NFL.
Wow, I'm a huge hockey fan, and I didn't think tieing even a rerun of AFV was possible. Things are looking up!
Sandra
I think a definition of close is in order. From Biz of Hockey:Derwin0 said:
Team 2008-09 2009-10 % Cap Change/Yr
Blackhawks 22247 20668 105.1 -7.10%
Maple Leafs 19312 19224 102.3 -0.46%
Canucks 18630 18810 102.1 0.97%
Wild 18568 18197 100.7 -2.00%
Penguins 16975 17051 100.6 0.45%
Sharks 17488 17553 100.3 0.37%
Canadiens 21273 21273 100 0.00%
Flames 19289 19289 100 0.00%
Rangers 18172 18200 100 0.15%
Capitals 18097 18277 100 0.99%
Oilers 16839 16839 100 0.00%
Flyers 19545 19413 99.6 -0.68%
Sabres 18531 18360 98.2 -0.92%
Bruins 17039 17193 97.9 0.90%
Blues 18554 18712 97.7 0.85%
Senators 18949 17790 96.2 -6.12%
Red Wings 19865 19128 95.3 -3.71%
Stars 17680 16978 91.6 -3.97%
Kings 16488 16325 88.2 -0.99%
Ducks 16990 14848 86.5 -12.61%
Devils 15790 14854 84.3 -5.93%
Blue Jackets 15543 14641 80.7 -5.80%
Predators 15010 13731 80.2 -8.52%
Hurricanes 16572 14286 76.3 -13.79%
Avalanche 15429 13707 76.1 -11.16%
Islanders 13773 12303 75.5 -10.67%
Panthers 15621 14352 74.6 -8.12%
Thrashers 14626 13667 73.7 -6.56%
Lightning 16497 14403 72.9 -12.69%
Coyotes 14875 98255 6.1 -33.95%
Eleven of thirty venues sell out on a constant basis.
Eighteen out of thirty venues are filled to at least 90 percent capacity.
23 of 30 fill to at least 80 percent of capacity.
As I recall, that is still better than the NBA.
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Yeah, I am sure the NBA, NHL and to some extent the MLB fight over viewer scraps, but to call the NHL more popular than the NFL is silly.
Business First of Buffalo: Buffalo Bills rank 10th in NFL attendance
The worst teams in the league aren't selling out and still getting 45k+ people per game on average to show up. The Jags are known to have poor community support and still have 44k-55k/game (not counting KC's sellout, they average 67k/game). The Bills are the 3rd smallest market and are averaging 70k (Canada loves it some football too).
There were only 22 non-sellouts the entire NFL season, 8.6%, and it was confined to 5 teams - Oakland, Jacksonville, Detroit, St. Louis and Kansas City had it's first non-sellout in 19 years. ( NFL's TV blackout scare of 2009 turns out mild; only poor-performing teams caught the blackout bug - The Huddle: Football News from the NFL - USATODAY.com )
Business First of Buffalo: Buffalo Bills rank 10th in NFL attendance
The worst teams in the league aren't selling out and still getting 45k+ people per game on average to show up. The Jags are known to have poor community support and still have 44k-55k/game (not counting KC's sellout, they average 67k/game). The Bills are the 3rd smallest market and are averaging 70k (Canada loves it some football too).
There were only 22 non-sellouts the entire NFL season, 8.6%, and it was confined to 5 teams - Oakland, Jacksonville, Detroit, St. Louis and Kansas City had it's first non-sellout in 19 years. ( NFL's TV blackout scare of 2009 turns out mild; only poor-performing teams caught the blackout bug - The Huddle: Football News from the NFL - USATODAY.com )
But not the NFL, which Hockey was compared to earlier in the thread.
Someone said that if football was played in hockey sized arena's (20k) than the number of fans would be even. Which was countered that the NHL can't filled most of their current arena's, no way they could hope to fill an NFL stadium on a regular basis.
meStevo said:
The exact statement was, "If they played football in a 200 foot area, then the size of the audience in football would be much closer to what they have in hockey, about 20,000." So I'm fairly certain no one said the NFL wasn't the most popular sport in the United States or for that matter, North America, save for riffjim4069's tongue-in-cheek post separating "North America" and "South America" using the Mason-Dixon line.Derwin0 said:
The problem is that a leap of faith has taken place. When football is played in a 200 foot area, it has pretty much as a business failed; that's why the Arena League went bankrupt. So to assume the NFL would work in arenas is a silly argument, as the AFL didn't and we don't know about the successor league, yet.
No one ever said that if hockey were played in football-sized stadia that they'd sell out.
All I did was counter the argument that "Most Hockey teams don't come anywhere close to filling the arenas they have." Most NHL arenas are filled over 90 percent capacity. That was why I asked for the definition of "close to filling the arenas". It appears to be an unwarranted shot at the NHL, who I believe needs to cut-down the number of games in their season.
Some of the worst network ratings of al time have been hockey ganes. i believe the XFL had lower ratings but not too much else. it just does not attract large TV audiences outside ofa few areas.
You're arguing a facet of the argument, rather than the argument itself.
It all arose from this, which I do not see as tongue in cheek but quite literal.
So to refine my argument in simpler terms: The NFL blows away the NHL in almost every category that can be devised... income, ratings, attendance, etc. If anything is tongue in cheek, it's the initial size of the stadiums comment.
It all arose from this, which I do not see as tongue in cheek but quite literal.
So to refine my argument in simpler terms: The NFL blows away the NHL in almost every category that can be devised... income, ratings, attendance, etc. If anything is tongue in cheek, it's the initial size of the stadiums comment.
Jim and i do not always see eye to eye---in fact we seldom do. But when he made the Mason Dixon line the dividing line between North and South America I think that was a clue that he was not speaking literally.
Sure, but the smiley was left off, and there still isn't any discussion of the NFL.meStevo said:
As a matter of fact, the issue here appears to be equating the NHL to Arena Football.
Who mentioned anything about the NFL and the NHL, other than those that took offense about playing football on a 200 foot surface? As I recall, this thread is about Arena Football, notwithstanding those people that are sensitive to "football" by continuously demeaning other sports.meStevo said:
And then there was a smiley at the end of the paragraph.
I mean, NHL is more popular than the UFL, so the NHL is more popular than "professional football".
