About to switch to D* from E*, but have some doubts. Convince me!

[dslate69]

It will be much easier to read your post if you used DirectTv and Echostar (or Dish) in your posting, and not this D* or E* crap.

If you know E* = DISH (Echostar) and D* = Dircectv how is it hard to read?
With 11 post under your belt you may want to take a different tone in your future request.

 

[dslate69]

FYI you may also need to know some the other shorthand or request that no one abbreviate these in their post either.

OTA = Over the Air
OP = Original Poster
LOS = Line of Sight
PPV = Pay Per View
SD = Standard Definition
HD = High Definition
DBS = Digital Broadcast Satellite
DVR = Digital Video Recorder
EPG = Electronic Program Guide
GB = Gigabyte
HDMI = High-Definition Multimedia Interface
ISP = Internet Service Provider
LNB = Low Noise Block frequency converter

 

[cedarwood]

OK, so my E* contract is due up in a couple months, but due to a nasty price increase (about $17 on our package, which is just an old 250 package with all the HD, we don't have any premiums). Basically... Yes, E* is truly having their cake and eating it too. Just the way they "re-structured" our bill let them find a way to screw us, nothing we can do about it, we tried.

We are also fed up with still no HD locals (even though we are at least on a list now) while D* has had HD locals here since last year.
As for programming, assuming E* adds the viacom HD channels this coming week like they said, that would make things pretty much even. At that point E* will have a few channels that I will miss (the non-premium Encore HD channel for sure), Travel HD, & WFN HD (my dad loves that one). But at the same time D* will give us a few new channels to look forward to.

Anyhow, its crunch time. If we are gonna switch, we want to do it now, not have to pay that insanely high bill for another month.

So here are some things I've noticed that make this switch less easy:

1) Future programming. I'm looking to see what D*'s plans are for adding new HD in the near future, and find nothing. With E*, they give updates all the time about the channels they are planning to add this month, even this year. I see nothing of the sort from D*. Nothing in the press releases, no retailer chats.
So for all I know, D* had gained the lead with HD, but E* is coming out with 5 new HD just this coming week, and there is another handful or so listed to come out after that this year. Could E* retake the national HD lead here, maybe even run away with it?

2) I hear awful things about the recievers. I hear the remote control commands are very unresponsive and can be a total pain in the ass. I'll mainly be using the HD DVR's, and I've heard other stuff about how glitchy they are.

3) Dual DVR Recievers. D* doesn't have them! I just learned that I was apparently spoiled to have an HD DVR (vip722) where I could easily schedule and watch my DVR'd programs on 2 different TV's. I mean, I could watch 1 dvr'd program on 1 tv, somebody else could watch another on a different tv. All from the same reciever, which came with 2 remotes as well for 2 tv's.

Now I found out that D* not only can't do that, but since I have 4 tv's, I actually need a reciever for each one! That is crazy to me after all this time of the 2 recievers in a single room controlling 4 tv's, different programming could be on each one at any time. Now I'm going from 2 receivers sitting a top eachother to needing 1 reciever in each room.

And, I need to pay $99 for a DVR just to be able to do the same thing I could do with a single vip722 for free. & instead of just paying $5 per month for an extra reciever, now that jumps to $15 since I need 3 more (on top of the 1 free one). The $15 doesn't bug me much, but the $99 does, considering I had this service luxury for free before.

On the plus side of this, I guess it will be nice to record 4 programs at one time with the seperate dvr's(although I've never needed to do this), but more downside is that what I record on one dvr won't be on the other, & vice-versa. Other than that, everything else about the entire reciever setup and the recievers themselves is a downgrade from E*. Another possible plus is maybe better reception on the SDTV's without the long cable runs, but overall this will take some getting used to.

4) Price. D* really isn't going to be much cheaper, if anything probably just as or more expensive thant E* was for us before we started getting screwed on our bill.

Conclusion. For us, we got screwed by E*, and not in the same way as everybody else, they screwed us extra special. Wasn't really just an annual $3-$5 increase and everybodys happy sort of thing. If it were, we'd be fine with that and still want dish.

As for HD locals, we'll probably have them with E* pretty soon, but how fast is never guaranteed. Assuming we do get them real soon (on the list for after april 1st), it will be an absolute shame that E* had to screw us cuz we would have been real happy otherwise.

I think E* offers a much better & cheaper setup for those with multiple TV's, for sure, better hardware, much better DVR situation. And any E* people that have their HD locals, plus the addition of the viacom 5 HD channels coming this week, should be pretty happy for the most part.

So what I'm saying is that we are 99% sure switching anyhow, and cancelling the last 2 months of E* (assuming D* can here by apr 3rd to install, which would be the last day of E* after we cancel, else we gotta wait another month). We aren't rich enough to keep paying this revised bill from E*, so we don't have much choice.

Just tell me its gonna be OK with D*! It will be inconvenient from what we have now, and I'm spending much more $$ off the top than with E* due to the need for the extra DVR.
But will it all be worth it? Will D* keep adding more HD than E*? Will the hardware hold up?
I hope so. I know when we ordered E* it was the popular choice, then of course after we signed the contract, E* did go downhill quite a bit. Now, with our contract ending, its seemingly making a comeback, of course just as I'm switching to D*! Will D* now become the new E*? Hope not!

JUst Do it DO IT

 

[KAB]

It will be much easier to read your post if you used DirectTv and Echostar (or Dish) in your posting, and not this D* or E* crap.

Your newness if showing. That's the way we do it here. Get on the train, or get off.

 

[lern4483]

dish or direc

Your newness if showing. That's the way we do it here. Get on the train, or get off.

Ah Kab,

First time I agree with you. You and I have always been on opposite sides of the fence in regards to Voom...Yes I dared to say the word that people cant speak of..

Ok, dish equipment, I cant seem to leave because of it.
Its that good.

In my opinnion its the best unit out there.

Yes, I have direcs HR22. While they have grown on me they are just inferior units.

Dish- Great Dvr...Programming has become average (too me) plus they take down channels at will. Just not exciting anymore.

Direc- Average units. Great for sports! Hands down. Customer service one of the best!

 

[Rey]

Dish- Great Dvr...Programming has become average (too me) plus they take down channels at will. Just not exciting anymore.

Direc- Average units. Great for sports! Hands down. Customer service one of the best!

sounds right to me :up

 

[robx46]

Thanks for all the replies! I made my move! From what I gathered on my own, from forums and all of you, is that things kinda even out in the end no matter which way you go. Your preference factors in a little.

I don't buy any extra packages such as NFL network, nothing like that. I also don't buy premiums (no HBO, ect. too expensive).
So it seems the whole premiums vs sports thing doesn't apply to me, although I am a sports fan. So I'll take whatever sports perks I may get from D*. Not a huge deal, but it is a plus that D* went full time HD with FSN (Pittsburgh for me). Also with E* we got STO (ohio sports), but with D* we get STO & FSN Ohio (not into ohio sports, but hey its a free channel!).

Anyhow, let me tell you how my ordering experience was. I got a person from the US and could understand them! A real nice lady. I don't care a ton about phone service, service in general won't make me switch providers, but again its a nice perk.

I explained to her my situation with E* and how our bill got really jacked up, on top of a hidden optional service fee they were tacking on and how it got to be over $90 per month (when others with the same package that is now under a different name, not even counting promotions, are paying $17 less for the same thing we have). I explained how we just couldn't do this with E* anymore, but wanted some assurance from D* that they will be more honest with us, less hidden fees, ect. She had a great response to this.

She said that unlike with E*, if after the promotional period packages change or prices get jacked to where we don't like it, we are NOT locked into our old package. She said we could add/subtract this or that, get a new package, which was good news. So in this case D*'s better service/flexibility might really help us save a few bucks if need be.

I told her my concern with the reciever situation. How with E* we only needed 2 of them to get different programming on all 4 tv's. I said this is a big thing that was making us a bit unsure about switching. I told her if she could find us some kind of extra deal in regards to this, it would be great.
So I told her about how I wanted an extra HD DVR for my 2nd HDTV, but told her that with E* I got DVR on that 2nd tv for free and with D* that would cost me $99 for the DVR. Since I want an HD DVR, its $199 (a lot of $$ up front).

I told her that I read about people on these forums and other places that were able to get HD DVR's for $99 via rebates and such and if she could do that for me then that would pretty much seal the deal.
She said she couldn't discount the HD DVR, but to help me out, she offered me an extra additional promotion (one that you don't get unless you ask/beg like I did!). Something that a person earlier in this thread mentioned they could offer. She said if I get the HD DVR at normal price, she would throw in 12 free months of showtime!

Considering I was secretly going to buy an HR22 online for about $180 total (if they couldn't get me any kind of deal), this was great news! So basically, for paying $20 more to lease the HD DVR through them, but in return am getting over $120 worth of free showtime! This was really great news considering the one thing I was gonna miss with E* was our free Encore HD channel.

So it's great to know that we are gonna have 4 HD showtime channels all the way 15 months into our contract (counting the 3 free months we already are getting up front). At least I'm assuming the 12 free months of showtime will kick in after that 1st 3 months, if somebody could confirm that that is indeed how it works, please let me know.

She was also able to confirm that we will get all our locals in HD, including PBS. After 16 months of awful SD locals from E*, this is really the biggest perk of them all. However I think E* will be adding, finally, HD locals in our area real soon. Probably the day after we cancel with my luck!
But even then I don't know for sure that E* is going to add all 5 HD locals at once, we'll see.

HD locals aside, the biggest perk is honestly just getting promotional deals again & knowing our bill will be much lower for a full year & locked in, no worry of price increases. I did read that the 12 month promotional period was locked in, so correct me if I'm wrong. Either way, whether E* adds HD locals real soon here or not, I know that our programming is gonna be just as good with D* plus we know we'll have showtime for free for a long while.

All that while out sat bill drops $20+ a month for 12 months is a pretty good feeling, finally having HD on my other hdtv is great (even though I am paying to have it & its just a tiny 22" bedroom tv, still nice though), and having 2 seperate DVR's will be real nice. Recording 2 things at one time while still being able to watch normal TV on both TV's at the same time is pretty sweet & will save the family some hassle during prime time.

We have 4 tv's, but only having a reciever on 3 as one in our basement doesn't get used enough to pay $5 more a month. So what we are gonna do is just link the 4th tv up (just an SDTV) with our main HDTV since we already have a cable running to it from where the main HDTV is.
Now when I workout late at night and nobody is watching the main TV, I can just grab the main TV remote, take it downstairs, and watch what I want in my basement, and have DVR down there too (since the main HDTV has an HD DVR). Kinda like have 2 1/2 DVR's, I guess!

Better wind this post down now! I know its long winded, but I really want to share this, cuz switching is a real big decision for anybody who isn't filthy rich! & I know a lot of people with E* are considering the swtich to D* (or maybe vice-versa), and maybe this post will help them out since I've now been with both E* and now D* in the past 16 months.

As for the installation, I told the lady it would be real convenient if they could get somebody here to install by april 3rd and it has to be afternoon (cuz the 3rd is the last day of E*'s bill for this month that we already paid, and we want to cancel before the 3rd comes to not have to deal with paying E* for another month, or lose programming for any period of time).
She was able to set us up for the afternoon of april 2nd. Perfect!
Now as for how good or nice the installers will be, how good a job they do, how efficent and helpful they are...that remains to be seen. I guess as long as the day is over on the 2nd and we are watching D*, I'll be happy. Were hoping that while they are on our roof they help us remove our 2 E* dishes, but its up to them if they will.
Also, I heard that with D* everything runs from 1 dish (not 2). Is this true?

I'll report back on how the install goes and how we like our new D*. But thanks to this forum for all the info & advice, it helped!

 

[mental1]

Yes the 12 free months of showtime kicks in after the 1st 3 months expire, making it 15months.

When you mirror your HD-DVR you will need to get the yellow, red & white lines down to your SD tv. The Directv HD-DVRs dont have a coax out.

Just ask your installer to take the other dishes down for you. I usually do it for free because it only takes about 30secs to get them both down.

 

[robx46]

Yes the 12 free months of showtime kicks in after the 1st 3 months expire, making it 15months.

When you mirror your HD-DVR you will need to get the yellow, red & white lines down to your SD tv. The Directv HD-DVRs dont have a coax out.

Just ask your installer to take the other dishes down for you. I usually do it for free because it only takes about 30secs to get them both down.

Thanks, definitely good to know that they won't try to sneak 3 of those 12 months into the 3 free months I'm already getting. That would be a pretty crappy move if that is how it worked, but after dealing with some of E*'s antics, I watch out for this sort of thing! There are alot of ways these big companies can trick you if they want.
But yeah, good to hear that D* will handle this properly.

Wasn't aware there was no coax out, that's kinda gonna suck. Luckily the downstairs SDTV does have the inputs I for the A/V since its newer. Is s-video or component out also a possiblity? Either way, I'm gonna need to buy a long A/V cable, so that will be expensive enough. I would assume that getting a real long s-video with red/white audio cable will be more expensive, and of course real long component would be super expensive.
Any advice on where to get some cheap but long A/V (or other) cables? I'd say I'll need 20 ft at least, maybe the closest they make to 25 ft to be safe.

Also wondering if any sort of A/V to coax adapters exist, thus I could run some short A/V to such an adapter and have the existing coax take it the rest of the way. If that even is possible, I wonder how bad that might degrade the quality, if at all.

With the dishes, the lady did say it was up to the installer. Assuming they will be going on my roof anyhow (my 2 E* dishes are on the roof), I figure they wouldn't have much of a problem with it since they are up there anyhow. We could do it ourselves, but the installers are better equipped, clearly, to do it. For us it might be a little unsafe!

Glad to hear that you do it. I would assume most installers would be more than happy to take them down. After all, taking down those E* dishes symbolizes more $$ for them, and a good feeling knowing another E* to D* switch being made, good sign of job security!

 

[dslate69]

Wasn't aware there was no coax out, that's kinda gonna suck.

Any rf modulator should do the trick if you already have coax run to a remote tv.

Walmart.com: VS 24 Audio Video Selector with RF Modulator

 

[schaaf]

Hi, Thinking of switching my self, and was wondering if they can use the same poles for the dishes... Example: Our Dish network dish is on a pole on a part of our roof that only one mounting plate with pole and dish could occupy. Can they just take the dish off that pole and put the direct tv dish on it? Otherwise It might be a pain to find a new place to put the dish. Can they also use the existing wiring from the Dish network dish? Or do they have to run new wires?

 

[harshness]

The DIRECTV dish requires a 2" OD tube as opposed to the DISH Network dish that uses the more common 1-5/8" OD tube. The "Slimline" also begs for a couple of "struts" (monopoles) to stabilize it.

If the installation is done properly, it won't leak and it can be installed over the spot where the DISH plate is now as the plate is larger.

 

[KAB]

FYI, the "Slimline" is a Horse compared to the size of the Dish 1000.**

 

[Joewee]

The only reason I have stuck with Dish Over Directv is
the Vip 622 an Vip 722. I have had both my cable HD
DVR and Directv's Hd DVR and the VIP is head and shoulders
above them all. If Dave could match Dish's DVR I would
probably switch.

 

[dslate69]

The only reason I have stuck with Dish Over Directv is
the Vip 622 an Vip 722. I have had both my cable HD
DVR and Directv's Hd DVR and the VIP is head and shoulders
above them all. If Dave could match Dish's DVR I would
probably switch.

I admit it the experience is not the same. My frustration with E* equipment is the 622\722 has not evolved at all. Stability is there but no new features or functionality. D*'s HR2x series takes some getting used to but features like widgets, MRV, Quicktune, Mediashare are proof they want a kickass product. In truth they are really just a speedier processor away now. With E* you always have to buy a new box to get anything new worth having. How much are the 922's gonna go for again?

 

[Joewee]

I admit it the experience is not the same. My frustration with E* equipment is the 622\722 has not evolved at all. Stability is there but no new features or functionality. D*'s HR2x series takes some getting used to but features like widgets, MRV, Quicktune, Mediashare are proof they want a kickass product. In truth they are really just a speedier processor away now. With E* you always have to buy a new box to get anything new worth having. How much are the 922's gonna go for again?

I am not sure about the 922's cost as of yet. It has been about 2 years since
I have been with Dave, but from what I remember and have read their HD DVR's
still can't do what my 722 can do. That is, have my OTA Antenna hooked up, and
my locals in the guide info. Also, I can record 3 shows at once and still watch a
recorded show at the same time. Believe it or not, I do record 3 shows at the
same time fairly often. So, I have my locals where I live via OTA, then I moved
to Minneapolis/St. Paul and get their locals as well. From what I still understand
the Directv HD Dvr's still can't do this. If, one day, they can do this I would look
at switching.

 

[Ronnie-]

No you can not record three things at once witht he HR, but you can record two OTA at the same time (you can with the new 722k too I think). SO basically the HR is capped at two recordings at any one time (three if you are downloading a VOD) while you watch something that has been recorded previously.
And yes, the OTA is intergrated into the guide with the HR series, the same as the ViP.

 

[DodgerKing]

I never understood why people would list equipment as their #1 reason for choosing a particular provider (I guess you will only find such people on a tech site??? ). For most people it is the programming, channel offerings, price, and/or packages. One providers equipment is not that much better to where it will persuade MOST people.

 

[harshness]

One providers equipment is not that much better to where it will persuade MOST people.

In this day of time shifting and commercial skipping, hardware is a major consideration. I'd trade all the unsupported/unfinished D* features for the ability to easily archive programming.

Most other things being trade-offs, weight shifts to the experience.

 

[dslate69]

I am not sure about the 922's cost as of yet. It has been about 2 years since
I have been with Dave, but from what I remember and have read their HD DVR's
still can't do what my 722 can do. That is, have my OTA Antenna hooked up, and
my locals in the guide info. Also, I can record 3 shows at once and still watch a
recorded show at the same time. Believe it or not, I do record 3 shows at the
same time fairly often. So, I have my locals where I live via OTA, then I moved
to Minneapolis/St. Paul and get their locals as well. From what I still understand
the Directv HD Dvr's still can't do this. If, one day, they can do this I would look
at switching.

E*'s new receivers have dropped the internal OTA as well and I am pretty sure you can still get an HR20 with internal OTA if you wanted. You are right the AM21 OTA addon for D* still only allows 2 recordings at a time. I don't doubt you record 3 things at a time on occasion but are they all non-repeatable? If I need to record 3, one is usually on sci-fi, Discovery or another cable channel that will repeat the showing in a few hours or the next day or so.
I don't miss OTA myself because I gained CW-HD on D* which was the only channel I used OTA for with E*.
For me now it is all about the HD content. Another big plus is D*'s VOD. I can't believe how retarded E*'s offering is in comparison. Truly amazing. D*'s own 101 channel is shaping up to be one of my favorites right up there with HDNET.
DIRECTV: The 101 Network