Who LOVES Dish over DirecTV

[pfef98]

D* has been talking about possibly adding HMO to their Tivo units forEVER, just go to tivocommunity.com and see what people are saying.

All I know, is I've been listening to my mp3s through my standalone for over a year, and all I've heard from D* is talk.

--Matt

 

[GaryPen]

Tony - My son has a DirecTivo. I have a Dish 721, but had a 510 briefly, as well as an 811. He is jealous of the speed and ease of use of the 721's guide and other features.
I'm jealous of the stability of his DirecTivo, as well as all the additional channels that DirecTV offers that Dish doesn't, and only needing one dish to receive all DirecTV programming, instead of two for Dish (or the horrific-looking "Superdish").

Forget the 510, as it only has one tuner, and there will be times you want to record one thing, and watch another, or record to overlappong events. The 522 (lease-only) might be better for your use. But, see below regardng reliability of new Dish models.

Finally, the 811 is still very much a work in progress. It's still not in proper working condition for a released product. Dish has a history of releasing products well before they are ready, and often taking years before getting them to work correctly.

 

[rad]

Unthinkable, please point out in this thread where I bashed E*. I didn't say one untruthful thing at all, in fact didn't I say the 510 wasn't a bad receiver now that E*'s got the bugs worked out? The only down side I mentioned was the lack of NBR on the 510.

On the 811 I just pointed him to the 811 section and said what others have said, there are still RECENT post from CURRENT E* sub's that say the 811 is a POS.

As for your rant, He's also the same poster who ripped the company for not communicating better dates and information last fall only to turn around months later lambasting them for communicating anything to subscribers.

Are you saying that you have no problem with E* making statements that such and such will be available on such and such date, then having them miss that date by months or years? Maybe you don't but I do. Yes I said that E* needs to communicate better dates but since E* never has been able to plan their a** out of a hole in the ground I changed to saying that they should just shut up and not say a thing until they actually have something ready to ship.

Let's step back and look at some of E*'s more famous mis communications.

- It was just about 1 year ago that E* announced SuperDISH. Remember Charlie and Jim showing how 105 would be for up to 50 new HD channels. Remember how the date that they announced started to slip and then all of a sudden no HD on 105, in fact it's moving to 110/119.

- Did you buy your 921 earlier this year and a JVC D-VHS deck so you could archive your HD recordings from the 921 to the D-VHS. I mean officers of E* sat there on various chats and said you'd be able to do it. The product brochure even said that there were DishWire ports on the 921 that you could connect selected D-VHS decks to. So how's that working out for you? Oh, E* changed their mind, you don't say. So you spend $2,000 on hardware thinking you'd be able to do something that E* has now said you can't. Ah, but that's alright, it's E*, they're know for things like this.

So my idea is for E* to just shut up until they can fulfill their promises made to their customers.

 

[mrschwarz]

I have a series 1 Tivo on a 322 and a 522 PVR. There are some features of the 522 that I like: 2 TVs, the ability to sort listings, the slightly superior picture quality over the standalone Tivo.

The list of things I don't like is longer. Topping that list is the instability of the device, although with V202 of the software has helped somewhat. It is unreliable when it comes to recording. Just because you set up a timer doesn't mean that it will work.

For programs that we care about, we always use the Tivo. In the 3 months we have had dish, it has misfired once and not recorded the program.

The 522 misses recordings on a daily basis.

My Tivo has been heavily hacked, so I don't see slow response times with the program guide.

If it were me, I would think twice about giving up the Tivo (especially if there is a wife/child factor to consider). I have no experience with DirecTV, though.

 

[hancox]

Couple of things to keep in mind here:

(Preemptive warning - I'm a Dish sub, never had DirecTV, but keep my ears to the ground)

1) Locals availability / location? Obviously this is only if you subscribe to locals. If you were, say, Scott G, this would mean a lot to you. Dish (E*) currently has more local markets when compared to DirecTV (D*). One thing to keep in mind, however, is that your locals might be moving in the next year or 2 or 5, depending on how SHVIA pans out, and where they are currently. This is VERY location dependent, so it might not mean a thing, it might mean a great deal.
2) HD availability / upgrade ability. Right now, I'd have to give the future-proof edge to D*, mostly because they have more short term impending capacity, and a more available 3 satellite viewing solution. The much-malinged E* SuperDish isn't in a majority of markets, and doesn't (currently) add any HD value. Now, if the wind changes in Colorado, maybe Charlie goes SuperDish for HD. The E* 2 dish (61.6/148 along with 110/119) opens up a host of problems, not the least of which is having 2 dishes for 3 satellites. As for current availability, it's pretty much a wash. TNT-HD is a waste of bandwidth IMHO, as it's 99.9999999% upconverts. D* has FOX-HD coming for O&O markets, which might benefit some. Again, IMHO, FOX-HD on D* is going to be a disapointment for most, esp those people with Sunday Ticket.
3) Ah, Sunday Ticket. This could be the deal breaker for some. Me, it's not the biggest issue in the world.
4) PQ. I have no point of reference. I've heard both ways on this. I'll leave that opinion to someone who has seen both on the same TV, which I have not.
5) HD boxes. The 811 is polarizing, to say the least. Keep in mind that (for the meantime) it's free to new E* subs, which is something D* has yet to match. Also - D* is planning to streamline receiver manufacturing to a single source in the near future. Who knows what this will do to availabilty / quality / etc.


So - the major q - would I switch to D*? I would certainly think hard about it if they offered a free-ish HD box to new subs. They seem to have a better vision as to where they are headed now. E* has been zig zagging for a couple of years now as to their direction for HD. If they offered the HD Tivo for, say, $500 for new subs, I would probably switch quickly.

Just a thought...

 

[dodge4322]

I've got to say that I have been a dish customer for a couple of years with a 508 and I wouldn't change it for anything other than a dual tunner 522. I have never had mine miss a recording event yet. I am a installer and have installed both DTV and Dish and I have to say that I like Dish over DTV as far as the DVR's are concerned. The caller ID on the tv is what really tops the cake for me. Yes name base recording is ok but then you may get alot of reruns you don't want.

 

[Neutron]

I've got to say that I have been a dish customer for a couple of years with a 508 and I wouldn't change it for anything other than a dual tunner 522. I have never had mine miss a recording event yet. I am a installer and have installed both DTV and Dish and I have to say that I like Dish over DTV as far as the DVR's are concerned. The caller ID on the tv is what really tops the cake for me. Yes name base recording is ok but then you may get alot of reruns you don't want.

Not the way the Tivo is designed. I have yet to get a repeat because I have mine set to first runs and new episodes. If you have it set to every episode then you get what you said would happen.

Caller ID was nice on the E* DVR but I didn't buy my sat receiver for caller ID. I have plenty of that with my cordless phones.

 

[mrschwarz]

I have tried to use the caller ID on my 522, but it's more of a pain than it's worth. When the phone rings, sometimes the name is shown on the screen. My natural reaction is to pause the DVR and answer the phone. Guess what? I can't pause the DVR until I select the OK button on the Caller ID box which sometimes clears it (other times the entire DVR locks up). Then I can pause and answer the phone. What were they thinking when they designed this?

On my hacked Tivo, a caller ID message appears, but does not impede any operation of the DVR.

The other comment about getting all the programs with name-based recording is misleading. Tivo will only record everything if you ask it. As a previous poster wrote, you can set it up to only record new episodes.

 

[Neutron]

My wife absolutely LOVES our Dtivo box. She won't give it up. She liked the 510 but hated not having name based recording.

The Tivo is now on our bedroom TV as the HD box is here. I plan on upgrading the hard drive in our Tivo. That is something else that you CAN NOT do in a DISH DVR.

 

[Mike Greer]

I was a Dish Network customer but I wanted an HD PVR. I was on 2 waiting lists for a 921 for 6 or 7 months and on a third list for more like 9 months. As it turns I was lucky to not be able to a 921. I had a friend that did get his 921 and he only kept it for 3 months. The last I checked (yesterday) the 921 was still a joke. I had never used Tivo anything until I got my HD-DirecTivo. Tivo is far from perfect but any objective PVR user would be insane to say that the Dish version of PVR was ‘better’ especially the 921!

The battle over which is better Dish or Direct will never end. The fact is people have different ideas of what is the right way to do something.

My advice is to just make a list of what is important to you and use the provider that gets you closest to what you want. In my case I put a functional PVR and HD Picture Quality at the top of my list. DirecTV has the ONLY HD PVR that I would consider so far but Dish Network had better HD picture quality. I had a tough decision to make because my top priorities were split between the two. I chose to go with DirecTV because I figured it was only a matter of time before Dish Network also lowered their HD picture quality. As it turns out just last week Dish Network started cramming 3 HD channels per transponder. This makes me feel better about choosing DirecTV because now I’m not giving anything up to have an HD Tivo – well at least Dish doesn’t have anything that I care about that beats DirecTV.

Check the programming available, hardware available and decide which provider is best for YOU. We are not all created equal.

By the way, for those of you that think I am just ignoring DirecTV problems I am not. I may say screw the whole small dish deal if DirecTV doesn’t fix the HD Net audio problems. It may be time to just go back to the Big Ugly Dish!

 

[GaryPen]

Tony17 - I didn't really talk about programming in detail, in my brief comparison. It seems that you are happy with your current DirecTV programming. So, it's important to realize the differences, before switching.

With Dish, you will gain things like the "Superstations" and quite a few internationals available at extra cost. (WPIX and TVJapan are important to me. The only things that keep me tied to Dish.) Dish also has more markets' locals available. (I assume you're already set with locals, though.) And, there is Sirius Satellite Radio (music-only. No talk stations.) HBO Comedy is nice, too. TNT-HD gives Dish's HD pack one more channel than DirecTV's.

OTOH, you will lose a number of channels by switching to Dish, such as NFL Network, Trio, Fit TV, Fine Living, Newsworld Int'l, Oxygen, and the availability of NFL Sunday Ticket. Also, if you currently have the TC package, Dish's equivalent $40 package (AT120) is missing Fox Movies, Hallmark, and Nat'l Geographic, which are in the higher priced Dish packages (AT180, AEP). DirecTV also looks to be adding substantial numbers of additional HD, due to their recent launch of the 7S satellite, and it's corresponding increase in bandwidth.

Personally, if I were you, I'd contact DirecTV's Customer Retention Dept, and request the $99 HD upgrade. (HD reciever, Triple LNB dish, and installation if necessary.)

 

[DishDave]

Wish DTV had Extasy

 

[VonL]

I have had a 501 and a 721 since they became available. I have always been mostly a lurker but have responed to some of the posts. I have never had name based recordings so I can't give a response. My 501 had a power switch failure a year or so ago but other than that I haven't had a problem with it performing as it should. It has never missed a scheduled recording and it is used daily. The only problem I've had with the 721 was when the last software update was downloaded, I lost caller ID, which the Tech people at Dish helped me get working again. It also has never failed to record when programmed or lost any recordings. My wife is a big Gunsmoke and Bonanza fan and uses the 721 to record every episode that comes on. We both love the caller ID feature on both machines. Maybe I've been lucky compared to alot of you and I have been very satisified with function of the units. I'm sure Direct TV has fine products but for my wife and I Dish has been everything we thought satellite tv would be. I will never bash either company because I believe both has its place and the increased subs to both companies comfirm that.

 

[GaryPen]

Since I have no need for porn, I have no idea how Dish differs from DirecTV in that area.

 

[WeeJavaDude]

Look, I just wanted to give my input of previous experience with DISH's hardware. I would hate to see a D* sub leave for E* to later regret it and have to go through the hassle of changing back. RAD has a valid point in is input as well. You may be an E* lover but that is your view. There is nothing wrong with us former E* subs giving our views. I would think the original poster would also want to hear from people who have had to deal with the 510 and 811.

Yeap.. you are right on here. Both sides should have the right to give their opinions without being belittled, called names, told they are idiots. However, since this is a internet forum and people can hide behind they keyboards people tend to say something they would not say if they were face to face. Both sides do the share of bashing the other. Can get old here at times.

The only problem with I see with previous user opinions is that they can be bit dated since they are not currently using the product and may or may not reflect the current state of the service. But none the less, it is yet one data point that a person making an evaluation can use to make a decision.

As for my experiences on the 721, 508 and 811. They have been mostly positive. I have neighbor that has D* and it has been a nightmare for him. So things are not always greener on the other side. As i see it, first thing to decide is programming needs. Match your needs to the provider.. If they both meet your needs equally.. Then start working the hardware issue. That is my opinion and one of the main reasons I am with E*.

As to the 811, Yes go and take a look at the threads. Definitely some mixed opinions on this box. Also check out the polls to get a general overall few from the group. Like Gary said, it is a work in progress. However, in my installation and configuration I do find it ready for realtime.

There is a possibility with the 811 that you might run into some issues. Some have some have not. There is some good suggestions on how to minimize this possibility and how to better your chances in the 811 threads.

In the end, we all have our opinoins based on our experience. People reading these threads should take them for what they are worth. It is the person reading the threads to decide how much weight to give each one.

Good Luck

 

[GaryPen]

Remember. The guy ALREADY has DirecTV. He isn't even unhappy with the service, only with having to pay $300 for an HD receiver, if I remember his orignal post correctly.

 

[WeeJavaDude]

Remember. The guy ALREADY has DirecTV. He isn't even unhappy with the service, only with having to pay $300 for an HD receiver, if I remember his orignal post correctly.

Yes I see that.... And since he was thinking of switching he should check programming and make sure both meet his needs. I was also addressing some of the later comments to the thread.

I got the impression his main concerns was features lost and stability on the DVR. At least that is where the thread seemed to go. He did ask about having cartoons loaded up for the kids. Name based recording makes this easier, but I do it by simply creating a daily timer to record the cartoon. Capture about a dozen shows or so then delete the timer. This give a bank of shows to choose from. When they get stale I do it again. Works fine in my case.

Yes Name based would be nicer for sure, This is one area where it is great value add. but you can acheive the same thing.. Just a bit more manual.

 

[BobMurdoch]

Advantages of E* = Superstations, HBO Comedy, a few Movie Channel stations (including a few in the AT180 pak), and Showtime Beyond (a channel with a SciFi like bent). Some say that the HD channels have less compresson (no empirical evidence to prove this other than the fact that D* can squeeze another 5 hours of HD onto a similar sized drive - could be more compression or E* having more "reserved" space on the drive). I think TNT HD is only available in E*, but I hear D* has a bunch of HD channels coming in September. Plus, if you are a raging Democrat, you are giving your money to Rupert Murdoch (this could be a plus if you LIKE Fox News). If you speak another language, E* is king of the international channels.

Advantages for D*.... Sunday Ticket, NFL Channel, Trio, PBS Kids, and a guarantee that Fox stations will NEVER get cut off for retransmission consent disputes (although I submit that their pricing will start to resemble cable as Rupert the Distributor will have to pass through costs to pay Rupert the content provider). D* also has Freeview concerts vs. Charlie's monthly Charlie Chats where he bemoans the lack of compelling HD content (or the tech chats where the next big software update is ALWAYS two weeks away)

 

[Neutron]

If you tell D* that you're wanting to cancel or are looking to switch because the other guy has a better deal on an HD box chances are they will work with you. They did for me.

 

[Unthinkable]

Unthinkable, please point out in this thread where I bashed E*. I didn't say one untruthful thing at all, in fact didn't I say the 510 wasn't a bad receiver now that E*'s got the bugs worked out? The only down side I mentioned was the lack of NBR on the 510.

Reread my post again. I merely pointed out your bashing in a DBSTalk thread a few months back which turned a simple Dish PVR vs. Tivo comparison thread into "us vs. them" total chaos. In subsequent threads on the same site, your ranting about poorly designed PVR hardware often spun off into talks of how horrible of a company Dish Network had become and how they couldn't do anything right. Its pretty apparent you're no longer happy with Dish as a company and no longer have a vested interest in following what they do or don't do for current and future customers. Your perceived bias should definately be noted for members anytime a new poster requests a fair and balanced opinion of Dish Network and they wind up running the risk of getting the prototypical "Dish Sucks" response from someone still bitter with them.

As for your rant, He's also the same poster who ripped the company for not communicating better dates and information last fall only to turn around months later lambasting them for communicating anything to subscribers.

Are you saying that you have no problem with E* making statements that such and such will be available on such and such date, then having them miss that date by months or years? Maybe you don't but I do. Yes I said that E* needs to communicate better dates but since E* never has been able to plan their a** out of a hole in the ground I changed to saying that they should just shut up and not say a thing until they actually have something ready to ship.

Let's step back and look at some of E*'s more famous mis communications.

- It was just about 1 year ago that E* announced SuperDISH. Remember Charlie and Jim showing how 105 would be for up to 50 new HD channels. Remember how the date that they announced started to slip and then all of a sudden no HD on 105, in fact it's moving to 110/119.

- Did you buy your 921 earlier this year and a JVC D-VHS deck so you could archive your HD recordings from the 921 to the D-VHS. I mean officers of E* sat there on various chats and said you'd be able to do it. The product brochure even said that there were DishWire ports on the 921 that you could connect selected D-VHS decks to. So how's that working out for you? Oh, E* changed their mind, you don't say. So you spend $2,000 on hardware thinking you'd be able to do something that E* has now said you can't. Ah, but that's alright, it's E*, they're know for things like this.

So my idea is for E* to just shut up until they can fulfill their promises made to their customers.

I'm saying I don't take their dates and rumored future software additions/fixes to be etched in stone and never have. With the right level of expectations in place from the get go you avoid all kinds of disappointments in life. Dish Network as a company isn't the exception to the rule when you look at emerging technologies, software, and hardware which are constantly fine tuned, refined, reworked, and sometimes even delayed a few times over before things eventually evolve to a more finished state. Things change in the technology sector all the time. Its just a fact of life. Thats the nature of the beast if you will. You have to realize this is no different from motherboard and chipset revisions to varying pci express versions and no different from leading edge companies pulling the plugs on "the next big thing" when it becomes apparent what once looked so promising on the drawing boards now looks a bit dated in the grand scheme of things. Whether its Intel, AMD, Microsoft, Nvidia, ATI, Duke Nukem Forever, True Fantasy Online etc... this kind of thing happens all the time[i/] RAD.

As for the Dishwire changes, I never purchased a 921 even though I have an HD ready set. For one, I don't feel the current HD Package on Dish or DirecTV offers enough to justify the cost of having it. Also, I'm not one to be an early adopter where these kinds of things can come back to bite you in the ass and the price of the receiver itself was also too high for my liking personally. You knowingly take that inherent risk when you agree to be an early adopter. I feel your pain, but these are the exact same growing pains early adopters faced buying HD sets which only featured analog component inputs before networks and pay channels made plans to only allow the highest level of 1080i HD detail on sets which featured DVI. These are also the exact same things people run into all the time trying to buy the best PC for the buck, DVD player, or most compatible DVD recorder when standards are constantly evolving.

My two cents. I used to sell DirecTV along with Tivo's, standard DirecTV receivers, and UltimateTV's. I own a 501 and 721 which suits all my purposes perfectly well. Both providers offer very similar results at the end of the day whether you choose one or the other. Two different routes. Two very similar results in the end. I don't think its a night and day comparison. For me, not having to pay any extra Tivo fees for the ability to record what I want when I want to is ultimately a pretty nice savings advantage over DirecTV. I'd just as soon rather spend that money on more important things if I can, so I do. Programming costs and channels offered in my market are both incredibly comparable. Picture and sound clarity are also both very similar from what I've observed. If Verizon winds up offering HD through fiber-to-the-premises rollouts sooner rather then later, I'll be extremely interested in looking at what kinds of television offerings they will be looking to provide to compete with Comcast Cable here.