VIP722 DVR questions (Switching from TiVo)

[bryus]

A little background:

I had Dish back in 2002-2003 but switched because they didn't have any deals on their new DVR and DirecTV had a deal on their TiVo receiver.

Last year my TiVo died and I couldn't get a new one since DirecTV ditched TiVo. So, I went with a pair of TiVos and Comcrap cable.

I was OK with paying $26/mo for the crappy limited cable I had because of the TiVo, but I'm not paying the new $56/mo bill for the same package now that my promo period is over.

I am interested in going back to Dish and getting the VIP722. I have read through the manual but still have some questions. Before I can commit to Dish I have to make sure that the 722 does a few critical things that my wife demands that our TiVo does now.

1. Are timer recordings by time or show? If the show is bumped a few hours or is on a different day will it still record the show?

2. Can we watch any show, recorded or live, in either room?

Also, I would like some clarification about the live buffer. Does it work on both tuners or just one at a time? If I pause live TV can I navigate the menus and even watch a show then come back to paused live TV? Can I switch between live buffers, watch one pause it, watch the other then pause it, continue?

Thanks for your help!

 

[HailScroob]

1. The 722 has named-based recording; picking up a show either on just one channel (normal timer) or on all channels (DishPass). So for a show like American Idol which, as the season goes on, shows up on different nights and different times, a standard "New Episodes" timer on my OTA Fox station picks them all up... season after season.

2. Absolutely. I have mine in Single View mode (so both TV1 and TV2 see the same thing), but Dual mode lets TV2 work totally independent of TV1.

 

[Fiveft20in]

Also, I would like some clarification about the live buffer. Does it work on both tuners or just one at a time? If I pause live TV can I navigate the menus and even watch a show then come back to paused live TV? Can I switch between live buffers, watch one pause it, watch the other then pause it, continue?

Thanks for your help!

If you are in Dual Tuner mode, which you have to be in order to have independent programming in two rooms, you cannot view live programming using the tuner that is dedicated to the other TV.

You can pause live TV (on either TV) and you can rewind up to 60 minutes, provided you have not changed channels. Once you change channels, the live buffer is cleared.

You can navigate the menus with live TV paused. Just don't change channels. You can also navigate menus while you watch TV. The picture appears in the upper right quarter of your screen, while the menu takes up the other three quarters.

 

[ncted]

If you are in Single Mode, you have dual live buffers a la Tivo.

Ted

 

[bryus]

Thanks everyone for the great information. That really clears up those issues. I think I'm going to be ordering this weekend.

Anyone want a pair of 6-month-old Series 2 TiVo boxes?

 

[kvnfl]

The 722 has a pretty nifty feature were it time shifts recording if conflicts arise. So if you try to record "ABC" but already have your two tuners tied up recording other events, it will automatically search for "ABC" airing at another time and record it.

It remembers what you recorded so you do not record the same thing twice.

When setting up TiVo-esque Season Passes it gives you the option to record All Episodes so that you can record all New episodes as well as all previous episodes without recording duplicates.

You can search by genre. Such as Movies>Action and view all movies in the specified Genre. The genre list is nowhere near as extensive as TiVo.

It has a working Wish List feature were you can auto record by keyword in Title or Description. One glitch, It does not work with genre. All keyword searches must be done on All programs to work.

The Univeral Remote that comes with the unit is pretty good for Home Theater. Mine is set up to turn on/off the TV/DVR/Receiver. It controls the DVR tuning and functionality, Receiver volume and TV source. My Harmony remote feels neglected.

PS. My TiVo has Lifetime Membership and I still use its EPG to find things to record - use it like TV Guide. The TiVo EPG is easier to navigate.

 

[kb7oeb]

Also, I would like some clarification about the live buffer. Does it work on both tuners or just one at a time? If I pause live TV can I navigate the menus and even watch a show then come back to paused live TV? Can I switch between live buffers, watch one pause it, watch the other then pause it, continue?

Thanks for your help!

I have not tried pausing first but the buffer is dumped when you start a recording.

 

[cparker]

Does the TiVo pass through? (or maybe that's not necessary...).... what I'm thinking is... would you want to keep a Tivo on your OTA for recording OTA stuff? Seems to me that would give you added capacity. I have no idea what TiVo service costs per month though as I've never had one.

(I *AM* however working on a MythBuntu setup with a friend at his house. Looking promising so far)

 

[mattopia]

As a TiVo series 3 to Dish 722 convert, I can say I am pretty impressed. I was quite afraid that the 722 would suck after using TiVo.

Actually, I think Dish is a little better at conflict resolution. It took a little getting used to the "Dish" way of DVRing. I use event timers instead of DishPASS, so I might not be taking full advantage.

Most of the TiVo patented features, like the jumpback when you hit play to cover for the delay in hitting the button, and the thumbs/suggestions, I don't miss at all. I've found I prefer the 30-second skip ahead / 10 second skip back more than fast forwarding and rewinding on TiVo.

For awhile I kept my TiVo hooked up recording HD OTA broadcasts as a backup. The Dish DVR hasn't failed me, so I unhooked the TiVo, and it now sits lonely with 1.5 years left on the prepaid subscription. :\

 

[Rancoras]

Regarding the live buffer, there is one thing I don't like about it. If you watch a recorded show, the buffer starts fresh when you stop the recorded show. I miss this greatly, but it isn't a deal killer IMO. I used it all the time on my old Tivo. I would be watching something recorded and when I stopped it, whatever was playing on whatever channel the Tivo happened to be tuned to would look interesting. I usually could rewind to the beginning and watch it. Not so with the 722.

 

[bryus]

I am currently have a pair of Series 2 80 hour TiVo boxes so I can't use them with an OTA signal.

I got to try it out at the local electronics store and my wife and I were impressed. It seems to do all the core things that we would like it to do. The way it handles live TV is a bit annoying but not a big deal. Occasionally on my TiVo I will see it on a live show that looks good so I hit record. Loosing that isn't a big deal.

One thing we're going to have to work out is our Season Passes. We currently have 4 tuners, now we'll have 2, maybe 3. Most nights we only record one or two shows but there's that odd day or two where we record 5+ and we'll need to work out our priorities on those.

I never used Genre in my searches so that's not going to bother me.

 

[Jenny_Piccolo]

I'm a Series 2 Dual Tuner Tivo convert as well.

What I miss from Tivo:

- Pause a live show when I "catch up" and watching something previously recorded and then watching live again to "catch up". The buffer is dumped when you watch something recorded. You can solve this by recording the live show, but I'm used to the Tivo way.

- FF and REW are much more predictable with Tivo. With the VIP722, you just have no clue where you are going to be when you 60x or 300x FF or REW, stop and play. I do rely more on the 30sec skip/10sec back more, but even that doesn't seem as predictable as Tivos.

- My Tivo was a bit less buggy. Sometimes my VIP722 will not show the proper (or any) "time remaining" in the bottom bar.

- The EPG isn't as elegant as Tivo's. I like the dual pane browsing where I can see way far in advance on a specific channel. With Dish, you need to scroll right to see more than 3 hours.

- the Tivo remote is more intuitive to me. Fewer buttons and more forgiving.

What I would miss if I dumped my VIP722:

- 3 tuners in HD!

- Both Single mode and Dual mode rock. I have 3 SD Tvs hooked up in dual mode and love being able to watch, delete, schedule programming all over the house. When I'm just watching my HD TV, I'll switch to single mode and I feel like I'm using a TivoHD on steroids.

- 250gb drive. That's pretty generous compared to the 80gb in my S2 Tivo. I haven't filled the VIP722 yet and needed the external drive, but it's nice knowing I have that option. I did add a larger drive in my Tivo, but that was time consuming.

- For $40/mo with an HD package & the VIP722, I think it's a deal.

 

[bryus]

I am looking forward to the massive hard drive in the VIP722. I got by for 2 years with a 35 hour Phillips DirecTiVo box. I upgraded it to a 70 hour box just a few months before the second satellite tuner went belly up.

I've really liked having two 80GB TiVos for the last few months, but sometimes I still run out of space. Now, I'm going to have up to 350 hours? Wow!

I don't have an HDTV now but may upgrade next year so I wanted to get the best box now while I can and not have to upgrade it next year.

As for being buggy, my TiVo is buggy now. The update last fall caused all kinds of little oddities to show up.

• If I delete an item from a folder it will tell me there is nothing left in the folder, even if there is. It takes 20 seconds to update this and be correct again. Or, I can just exit and re-enter the folder.
• If I delete something from the todo list it doesn't leave me where I was, it puts me back to the first page or two, several screens higher than I I was when I deleted the program.
• It won't let me cancel a recording if it's recording two shows at once, sometimes. I think it has to do with it transferring/downloading a show at the same time.
• It sometimes "looses" my other TiVo. The bedroom won't see the family room but the family room sees the bedroom. I have to reboot the invisible one to fix it.

 

[kb7oeb]

- The EPG isn't as elegant as Tivo's. I like the dual pane browsing where I can see way far in advance on a specific channel. With Dish, you need to scroll right to see more than 3 hours.

Its not the same but if you hit the right arrow while watching tv (not in the EPG) you can quickly see listings for a single channel

 

[Jenny_Piccolo]

Thanks Kb7oeb. I was aware of that feature but hadn't tried it much. I'll give it shot now that I've cleaned up my favorites and locked out a bunch of redundant channels.

I do like the Tivo EPG better, but the VIP722 lets me do more "DVR management" while watching TV.

 

[mattopia]

What I miss from Tivo:

Unfortunately I think the following in your list are patented by TiVo:

- FF and REW are much more predictable with Tivo. With the VIP722, you just have no clue where you are going to be when you 60x or 300x FF or REW, stop and play. I do rely more on the 30sec skip/10sec back more, but even that doesn't seem as predictable as Tivos.

TiVo patented a feature that accounts for the average delay in a human seeing where he wants to play and hitting play. It will jump back a second or two to correct for that.

- The EPG isn't as elegant as Tivo's. I like the dual pane browsing where I can see way far in advance on a specific channel. With Dish, you need to scroll right to see more than 3 hours.

I think TiVo has some patent on that as well. I do miss that feature a TON. I'm sure it would be implemented elsewhere if it could be. MythTV had a similar feature, but as an open source project with a very small install base, I doubt TiVo has them in their sights.

- the Tivo remote is more intuitive to me. Fewer buttons and more forgiving.

Yep, I think TiVo has some kind of patent on that too. I miss the TiVo remote, but I actually gave it up long before Dish. I gave it up when I started using a Logitech Harmony remote to eliminate some clutter.

 

[bryus]

I did like the "Browse" function when I had Dish way back when. It was cool to be able to keep watching your show while you browse the guide without blocking the whole screen.

 

[Illinifan]

"TiVo patented a feature that accounts for the average delay in a human seeing where he wants to play and hitting play. It will jump back a second or two to correct for that.



I think TiVo has some patent on that as well. I do miss that feature a TON. I'm sure it would be implemented elsewhere if it could be. MythTV had a similar feature, but as an open source project with a very small install base, I doubt TiVo has them in their sights.


My old TW SD8300s (both SD and HD) would do that do. I miss that feature.

But the buffer feature is the one my wife misses the most. The SD boxes would save everything in the buffer since the last channel change no matter how long it had been. Hit "Record" and get the whole thing. Very nice.