Torre says - NO

[dantheman77]

i dont think tony ever said he was tied to walt. though no contract had been signed, it looks like he will return to st. louis. see stltoday.com

 

[dantheman77]

Tony says yes!!

2 year contract to stay with the cards!!

 

[Diamond Jim]

This takes me back to about this time of year in 1960 when Casey Stengle "retired." Fact was he was pushed out because he lost a World Series that he should have won. That's the position Joe was in, what have you done for me lately. I have always believed that a manager has a lot to do with how a team performs, but when it comes down to it, the manager is not the one that hits and fields the ball. If the players don't produce for the manager, the manager does not produce for the owner and everybody knows what that means.

Being a fellow Hoosier I am a "Donny Ballgame" fan, but I don't think he has the experienc to take over a team of this caliber. I hope Joe Girardi gets the job.

 

[Paul Wozniak]

I have a different spin, so to speak. He came on TV and basically said that 'he will do anything' and that 'all I want to do is be a Yankee'. The contract was full attainable incentives where he would reach 8 million a year. Did you HONESTLY expect him to get a raise? How sincere was Joe when he said he 'would do anything to stay a Yankee'?? Or did it REALLY mean 'I will do anything to be a Yankee IF you give me the money I want'? I think his agent was whispering that he can get a multi-year contract in the 8, 9 or 10 million from somewhere else....and quite honestly...I don't think that is going to happen. And besides, the manager of a baseball team has THE LEAST amount of impact of whether a team wins or loses of ANY coach/manager of ANY of the major sports....ESPECIALLY the American League manager with that communist rule of the DH.

And Mariano Rivera....and his little declaration of 'if Joe aint' back, I am gone....'?! Riiiiiggghhhttt....wiggle a couple million more in his face, and I am sure he will stick around.

Let me throw yet another spin. Maybe this was done to allow Torre a chance to walk away without being fired. With agreement from both sides, the Yankee's wish to change management, but don't want to publicly fire Torre. So they offer him that contract, which he refuses, and leaves on his on terms. Everyone saves face this way. The truth to this matter is only known by the parties involved, but my scenario does have some credibility.

 

[salsadancer7]

Let me throw yet another spin. Maybe this was done to allow Torre a chance to walk away without being fired. With agreement from both sides, the Yankee's wish to change management, but don't want to publicly fire Torre. So they offer him that contract, which he refuses, and leaves on his on terms. Everyone saves face this way. The truth to this matter is only known by the parties involved, but my scenario does have some credibility.

ABSOLUTELY....but wait....just wait...the dirty laundry will come out soon.

 

[Paul Wozniak]

I have a different spin, so to speak. He came on TV and basically said that 'he will do anything' and that 'all I want to do is be a Yankee'. The contract was full attainable incentives where he would reach 8 million a year. Did you HONESTLY expect him to get a raise? How sincere was Joe when he said he 'would do anything to stay a Yankee'?? Or did it REALLY mean 'I will do anything to be a Yankee IF you give me the money I want'? I think his agent was whispering that he can get a multi-year contract in the 8, 9 or 10 million from somewhere else....and quite honestly...I don't think that is going to happen. And besides, the manager of a baseball team has THE LEAST amount of impact of whether a team wins or loses of ANY coach/manager of ANY of the major sports....ESPECIALLY the American League manager with that communist rule of the DH.

And Mariano Rivera....and his little declaration of 'if Joe aint' back, I am gone....'?! Riiiiiggghhhttt....wiggle a couple million more in his face, and I am sure he will stick around.

I don't agree 100% with that statement, (I feel that Jim Leyland had as much to do with the Tigers reaching the WS in '06, as the players did), I've often thought that ANYBODY could manage a team with as much talent as the Yankee's.

 

[salsadancer7]

I don't agree 100% with that statement, (I feel that Jim Leyland had as much to do with the Tigers reaching the WS in '06, as the players did), I've often thought that ANYBODY could manage a team with as much talent as the Yankee's.

Please tell me what does an American manager contributes as far as wins to a team?

 

[Paul Wozniak]

Please tell me what does an American manager contributes as far as wins to a team?

I'll only address this as how it pertained to the Tigers -- Do you think 2006 would have happened with Alan Trammel as manager? Granted we added a few pieces that Alan didn't have, but the core of the team was the same, and they had no respect for Alan or Kirk Gibson (bench coach). The players even had the nickname "2 swings" for Gibson. (Referring to his two game winning homers for the Tigers and Dodgers in the world series). The difference in respect given to Leyland by the same players is very telling, as is their win-loss record under Leyland. For the record, I don't like the DH either, and yes, it is easier managing in the AL, but there is a lot more to managing than pulling the double-switch. Leadership is also very important.

 

[salsadancer7]

I'll only address this as how it pertained to the Tigers -- Do you think 2006 would have happened with Alan Trammel as manager? Granted we added a few pieces that Alan didn't have, but the core of the team was the same, and they had no respect for Alan or Kirk Gibson (bench coach). The players even had the nickname "2 swings" for Gibson. (Referring to his two game winning homers for the Tigers and Dodgers in the world series). The difference in respect given to Leyland by the same players is very telling, as is their win-loss record under Leyland. For the record, I don't like the DH either, and yes, it is easier managing in the AL, but there is a lot more to managing than pulling the double-switch. Leadership is also very important.

Come on Paul....could it be that the players became better one year later? So by the same token....if the team sucks the next year....do you give credit for THAT to the manager as well? ALOT has to do with player improving and just good ole fashion luck. To make the playoff....you gotta be lucky AND good. Lucky that breaks go your way and lucky that you have NO major injuries.
TO ME, a manager MAYBE...MAYBE is worth 4 or 5 wins max....if he is one of the so-called "elite managers". Because in the end, IF the player DOES NOT COME THROUGH.....it does not matter how 'good' or how 'smart' the manager is.

 

[Ramy]

Come on Paul....could it be that the players became better one year later? So by the same token....if the team sucks the next year....do you give credit for THAT to the manager as well? ALOT has to do with player improving and just good ole fashion luck. To make the playoff....you gotta be lucky AND good. Lucky that breaks go your way and lucky that you have NO major injuries.
TO ME, a manager MAYBE...MAYBE is worth 4 or 5 wins max....if he is one of the so-called "elite managers". Because in the end, IF the player DOES NOT COME THROUGH.....it does not matter how 'good' or how 'smart' the manager is.

Look at the Braves and Twins from 1991 when they both went from worst to first the next season.

 

[salsadancer7]

Look at the Braves and Twins from 1991 when they both went from worst to first the next season.

with the same team....

 

[Ramy]

with the same team....

For the most part, I can't remember back that far whether they added anyone major to the team.

 

[Paul Wozniak]

Come on Paul....could it be that the players became better one year later? So by the same token....if the team sucks the next year....do you give credit for THAT to the manager as well? ALOT has to do with player improving and just good ole fashion luck. To make the playoff....you gotta be lucky AND good. Lucky that breaks go your way and lucky that you have NO major injuries.
TO ME, a manager MAYBE...MAYBE is worth 4 or 5 wins max....if he is one of the so-called "elite managers". Because in the end, IF the player DOES NOT COME THROUGH.....it does not matter how 'good' or how 'smart' the manager is.

Find my analysis of this year's Tigers in the Tiger thread. (Post #606) You are right about injuries. I still stand behind my comments on Leyland though. No way the Tigers would have accomplished any of this with Trammel.
Curious, you coach baseball, are you saying that your kids would be just as good without you?
Or maybe they might be better without you.

 

[salsadancer7]

Find my analysis of this year's Tigers in the Tiger thread. (Post #606) You are right about injuries. I still stand behind my comments on Leyland though. No way the Tigers would have accomplished any of this with Trammel.
Curious, you coach baseball, are you saying that your kids would be just as good without you?
Or maybe they might be better without you.

Yep....they would be just as good without me...as long as they produce. Hell, I wouldn't doubt some might be better if I was gone....