Tivo Statement on Echostar Lawsuit

[Jhon69]

Is Tivo in good enough shape to be able to stay in business?

The last report Tivo had $200 million and no debt.Then there is the DirecTV contract until 2015 with an option until 2018.Think Tivo also has a contract with Comcast.

You don't think that Charlie found someone at the USPTO that needed a swimming pool do you?.

 

[harshness]

what happened to dish quarterly Earnings from August 10?

Concentrate very hard on today's date and I think you might be able to figure it out.

 

[8arrett]

Borg

Good question. Maybe DirecTV will pump more money into them. But in today's economy, I think Tivo's best option is to cut a deal or get absorbed. Excuse me, "assimilated."

Today: Resistance IS Futile.

Future: Resistance WAS Futile.


--Grin&Barrett

Don't Be A Bonehead!

 

[jacmyoung]

Wouldn't that mean TIVO would have to pay back the 105m to DISH ? LOoks like CHarlie being stubborn and fighting these lawsuits would pay off again. Any one remember what happened with the distant lawsuit a few years back?

No, what I said earlier was tongue in cheek The $105M was final after E* exhausted all its appeals.

I was implying, as you did, that while many TiVo supporters over the years cried victims of an "unjust patent system", it could turn out to be the opposite.

Be careful what you ask for, you might get it.

This PTO decision is preliminary, TiVo will appeal to the PTO, but if the PTO makes its decision final, E* can motion the court to stay all related litigations while TiVo continues to appeal the PTO decision to the Board, and ultimately to the appeals court, if necessary, and such appeal process takes years.

For now E* still needs to win the current appeal on the contempt, damages and the injunction. Keep in mind the appeals court had already implied that E* had established a stronge likelihood of success on the merits on the current appeal.

 

[CJPC]

The last report Tivo had $200 million and no debt.Then there is the DirecTV contract until 2015 with an option until 2018.Think Tivo also has a contract with Comcast.

You don't think that Charlie found someone at the USPTO that needed a swimming pool do you?.

Now- $200 million on hand, would be interesting if Charlie managed to win, get a nice settlement (somehow) resulting in him owning Tivo - that would be one real reversal! Would never happen, but still interesting to think about.

 

[jacmyoung]

E* just informed Judge Folsom today of the PTO initial action, in its letter and attachment, it revealed that the PTO pretty much agreed with E* on the interpretation of the software claims and how the design around avoided the claims.

It will be interesting to see how Judge Folsom reacts to such PTO interpretation, it basically goes against what TiVo argued, and what the judge had concluded in his opinions and contempt ruling.

 

[rocatman]

Now- $200 million on hand, would be interesting if Charlie managed to win, get a nice settlement (somehow) resulting in him owning Tivo - that would be one real reversal! Would never happen, but still interesting to think about.

You are right it would never happen but if it did then Dish could develop a DirecTV TIVO HD DVR which would be a Dish box with the TIVO label on it.

 

[MikeD-C05]

E* just informed Judge Folsom today of the PTO initial action, in its letter and attachment, it revealed that the PTO pretty much agreed with E* on the interpretation of the software claims and how the design around avoided the claims.

It will be interesting to see how Judge Folsom reacts to such PTO interpretation, it basically goes against what TiVo argued, and what the judge had concluded in his opinions and contempt ruling.

I wonder if this judge's ego will get in the way of making the right decision now that this new information has been released making the Tivo claims null and void?

 

[cmcnabb]

I wonder if the PTO rejected the claims based on the Bilski ruling. If so, that would be great news for the entire software industry.

 

[jacmyoung]

I wonder if this judge's ego will get in the way of making the right decision now that this new information has been released making the Tivo claims null and void?

This action does not void or null TiVo claims, and the judge will not reverse his contempt ruling and orders because they were made final on 6/2/09. The appeals court can.

E* is asking the judge to take this PTO action into consideration when he makes his next decision on the sanctions, which he will make soon.

My guess is, with this PTO action, there is a possibility the judge will simply delay his decision on the sanctions pending the E* appeal. This is entirely at his own discretion. He could still ignore this new information if he wants to.

 

[jacmyoung]

I wonder if the PTO rejected the claims based on the Bilski ruling. If so, that would be great news for the entire software industry.

I have not read the PTO decision but read E*'s letter to Judge Folsom. The answer appears a no.

The rejection should be based on two prior patents, which were actually used last time by E* unsuccessfully. The difference is, last time each of these prior patents was reviewed separately, but this time they were reviewed in combination, one compliments the other, together making a much stronger case for E* to invalidate the TiVo's software claims.

 

[Claude Greiner]

I hope Tivo has to pay back the 100 million

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

I hope Tivo has to pay back the 100 million

Nope they would not have to.

 

[jacmyoung]

I hope Tivo has to pay back the 100 million

Not by the court but can certainly be done in a settlement

TiVo must now consider the downside of losing the contempt argument on appeal, and the chance that the software claims will be rejected in the end, they will have little to go by to get any more DVR licensing agreement from anyone.

If they settle with E*, by at least paying back some of the money and cross-license with E*, the two can establish a good relationship and make their DVRs the best on the market.

I said this before, as much as I believed E* should fight all the way because they had a strong case of design around, the best of the best scenario would be these two worked together. By doing so they can beat all the rest of the DVR makers hands down.

 

[harshness]

Nope they would not have to.

If it turns out that Echostar was in the right all along with respect to the infringement, why should TiVo get to keep any of the infringement related awards?

 

[jacmyoung]

Because that is how the law works. What is final is final.

Look at it this way, had E* done a better job last time by insisting the PTO combine the two prior art, rather review them separately, it is possible E* did not have to pay the last bill.

The patent law takes into consideration that the PTO cannot possibly get it right every time when granting a patent (in reality often they do not), so the law allows third parties to challenge the patents, not just once but as many times, as long as they can demonstrate substantial evidence questioning the patents. The PTO is therefore not liable for any less-than-perfect decisions in the past.

 

[Tampa8]

Rupert overplayed his hand in the Distants issue. Had he agreed, Dish would simply provide distants to the few who they did not serve, AND were in a white zone. By not agreeing, Charlie now effectively provides SD/HD distants to anyone in a white zone, even if they get Dish locals, or anyone who can convince a separate company to give it to them, thereby leaving Dish out of the worry of qualifying.

As to Tivo - I do not know enough about what level court will do it, but Dish will win out in the end by some court's decision if this holds up. I looked back as best I can, and dish claimed this from the beginning.....

 

[TheKrell]

The PTO is therefore not liable for any less-than-perfect decisions in the past.

I don't imagine anybody is suggesting that the PTO pay back the $100M. It's Tivo who has that money and IMHO should be forced to cough it back up.

You say this is how the law works on "final decisions." Well, if Dish is ultimately vindicated and the Tivo patents are invalidated, then how is this way of the law working any different from theft? (Not saying you aren't right, I'm just surprised and outraged if Tivo gets to keep their ill-gotten gains.)

 

[Jhon69]

Now- $200 million on hand, would be interesting if Charlie managed to win, get a nice settlement (somehow) resulting in him owning Tivo - that would be one real reversal! Would never happen, but still interesting to think about.

Don't see Charlie wanting to own Tivo it was always the DVR software he was after and needed.Now does Charlie want to become like Tivo with Echostar?.That answer is Yes.

 

[goaliebob99]

I can honestly see If dish pulls the rabbit out of the hat and does win this war, I do think Tivo should have to pay the 100 mil back plus court costs. Charlie is frugle enough to ask for it back. Heck, thats 100 mil he could invest somewhere else like marketing. I hope dish can get over this hurdle and win this once and for good.