The End of DIRECTV?

[raoul5788]

There have been multiple dates given in the letters people have shared online, and the letters talk about losing their locals. It looks like they are shutting it down with different markets at different times. I think the latest date was like July or August, I can't remember.

It is bizarre that Directv keeps this so close to the vest. Why wouldn't they simply have a web page somewhere that lists the markets, their schedule, and when all MPEG2 SD is shut down if not in tandem with the last local market? If they think they might change the schedule, put a disclaimer that schedule is subject to change.

Directv be open about what they are doing? Ha ha ha ha!!!!!!!!

 

[slice1900]

Isn’t there a time limit to squatting on slots? Use it or lose it?

Or can they/are they using a single transponder sending a signal no one is using?

My understanding is that they so long as they have a satellite up there broadcasting on those transponder frequencies they are meeting their license conditions. Even if no one is listening. Because they could always start using it again someday if they needed the extra capacity.

Even when they have to retire a satellite and vacate a licensed slot completely, it could be years before the FCC will "repossess" the license. When a license is first issued, the licensee typically has five years to "launch and begin operations", though the FCC seems to be pretty generous about granting extensions if you are most of the way there and just waiting for a launch slot or the like. All the satellite needs to do is visit that spot and broadcast and you have met the conditions for your license, even if the satellite immediately leaves for a new permanent destination (Ciel did this with the Ciel-6i satellite)

So I don't think there's a time limit for "squatting" with an operational satellite (even if no one is listening) but there's a time limit for abandoning the slot completely. But I don't know what that limit is, other than that it is probably measured in years.

 

[Jimbo]

I assume you are not aware that traditional cable/ satellite service is dying...its too expensive with not enough options...streaming allows a customized experience for the customer..they only buy the services they want..no longer forced to buy 250 channels they mostly don't watch

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Right ....

So, you think in another few years, these great packages won't have a bunch of channels you don't watch, just like it is now ?

Sats too expensive ?
Seems it worked out pretty good for the last 20+ years ....
ATT may have decided that they are too expensive, but others may jump into the game.

Your spreading info that Sat is dying if your way of saying you don't like it ....

As mentioned everywhere, its not going anywhere for at least another 10 years ... the Sats are working fine up there.

 

[Juan]

Right ....

So, you think in another few years, these great packages won't have a bunch of channels you don't watch, just like it is now ?

Sats too expensive ?
Seems it worked out pretty good for the last 20+ years ....
ATT may have decided that they are too expensive, but others may jump into the game.

Your spreading info that Sat is dying if your way of saying you don't like it ....

As mentioned everywhere, its not going anywhere for at least another 10 years ... the Sats are working fine up there.

Its gets more expensive as subscribers drop...someday there will be a tipping point where it is just too expensive of a service to provide and they will sell the fleet off but keep the customers..if you see how dish is down to 10 million its not hard to say cable and sattelite are going to have to change direction to survive

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[navychop]

The sats are paid for. The uplink facilities are paid for. Truck tools and STBs are the ongoing expenses.


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[nelson61]

The next step will be when the SATs refuse to pay for locals and the local station has to decide if they want to give up the advertising revenue generated by their neilson numbers when they go dark or accept free retransmission of their local.

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[Juan]

The sats are paid for. The uplink facilities are paid for. Truck tools and STBs are the ongoing expenses.


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And employees to run the satelllite...electricity to transmit signals..fiber to connect to uplinks

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[Jimbo]

And employees to run the satelllite...electricity to transmit signals..fiber to connect to uplinks

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Fiber to uplink sites are already in place ...
Electricity is not going to make or break them ... employees they have what they need and the get rid of people on a regular basis.

 

[rad]

Fiber isn't free, they're paying someone for that connection every month. But I'd be willing to guess that that feed is also being used to supply the local channels for DIRECTV Now.

 

[Inclined Orbit]

You are speculating because ATT/DirecTV has stated their 5yr plan is to deliver content via broadband and ditch the satellites. It costs a fortune to keep the broadcast centers running with all the payroll, electricity and upkeep. Station keeping also costs $$, especially if Intelsat is involved. How many installers does DTV have across the country and what does that cost in payroll? DirecTV had the largest privately owned fiber ring around the entire country before ATT stuck their finger in it and all that fiber had to be a huge reoccurring expense.

The Netflix type of business model they would like to adopt has no satellites, no installers, no warehouses full of receivers and dishes, etc. Lets talk again in 5yrs and see how things are doing then.

Must be some reason for what? Are you one of those people making the assumption that Directv is dropping satellite and going all IP? Because that's a ridiculous idea with no sound business case. They will continue to offer satellite for years to come, because they will already have the satellites and it makes zero financial sense to quit offering the service so long as the satellites are still viable.

They are going to offer an IP version because 1) it will be cheaper to install thanks to no home visit or Genie needing to be deployed and 2) to expand their potential market since there are many people who can't/won't subscribe to satellite because they live in an apartment building, have trees in the way (that would be me) or simply don't want a dish on their roof for whatever reason.

Its doubly ridiculous to suggest that a company would offer video via LEO satellites that offer internet (as was suggested earlier) when that would be FAR more expensive to deliver than via nationwide broadcast like Directv is already doing.

 

[navychop]

There is this continuing fantasy that satellite subscribers will easily transition to Internet service. I suspect many if not most of the truck rolls will continue.

ESPECIALLY as more WiFi bandwidth is consumed by IoT and other drains.


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[Inclined Orbit]

Fantasy or not it will be an ATT problem as its their stated desire to pull it off.

There is this continuing fantasy that satellite subscribers will easily transition to Internet service. I suspect many if not most of the truck rolls will continue.

ESPECIALLY as more WiFi bandwidth is consumed by IoT and other drains.


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[Juan]

There is this continuing fantasy that satellite subscribers will easily transition to Internet service. I suspect many if not most of the truck rolls will continue.

ESPECIALLY as more WiFi bandwidth is consumed by IoT and other drains.


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Remember when records left and all ypi could get wrre cd"s?

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[slice1900]

The Netflix type of business model they would like to adopt has no satellites, no installers, no warehouses full of receivers and dishes, etc. Lets talk again in 5yrs and see how things are doing then.

You think all the resources required to stream to millions of customers are free? Why has Netflix found it so difficult to turn a profit despite a constantly growing subscriber base? One of the reasons is because each new customer costs them more to deliver to, unlike satellite which has no ongoing per customer delivery cost - it is all fixed cost. The satellites and broadcast centers are paid for. Yes, the employees to staff the broadcast centers costs money, but a lot of that is duplicated for streaming - they still need at least two sites with those huge C band dishes to receive all the uplinks, people to maintain them, equipment to transcode as necessary. They still need all the LRFs around the country to gather the locals. It sounds like you understand a lot about how the satellite business works, but seem to think streaming runs on magic and doesn't require any employees or resources.

They can't get to a "Netflix model" in five years, there's no way they can convert 20 million customers. They will still have millions of customers who don't have a broadband option able to support streaming. You think they will just pull the plug? If they need to charge them a couple bucks more a month to account for the costs you are referring to, then they'll do so. If they want to get rid of their installers and require people to self-install or contact a third party for in-home service like dish installation like they used to, then that's an option.

 

[Juan]

You think all the resources required to stream to millions of customers are free? Why has Netflix found it so difficult to turn a profit despite a constantly growing subscriber base? One of the reasons is because each new customer costs them more to deliver to, unlike satellite which has no ongoing per customer delivery cost - it is all fixed cost. The satellites and broadcast centers are paid for. Yes, the employees to staff the broadcast centers costs money, but a lot of that is duplicated for streaming - they still need at least two sites with those huge C band dishes to receive all the uplinks, people to maintain them, equipment to transcode as necessary. They still need all the LRFs around the country to gather the locals. It sounds like you understand a lot about how the satellite business works, but seem to think streaming runs on magic and doesn't require any employees or resources.

They can't get to a "Netflix model" in five years, there's no way they can convert 20 million customers. They will still have millions of customers who don't have a broadband option able to support streaming. You think they will just pull the plug? If they need to charge them a couple bucks more a month to account for the costs you are referring to, then they'll do so. If they want to get rid of their installers and require people to self-install or contact a third party for in-home service like dish installation like they used to, then that's an option.

You don't need expensive uplink centers filled with expensive engineers to stream....

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[slice1900]

You don't need expensive uplink centers filled with expensive engineers to stream....

They need to RECEIVE the uplinks from all the networks. That one giant elliptical dish they have that has like 30-40 LNBs probably cost more than all the uplink dishes they have combined.

 

[Inclined Orbit]

I'm just repeating what ATT has stated are their plans and if they don't make their 5yr plan its not my fault or my idea gone wrong. ATT is in the business of delivering broadband to customers and I believe they can pull it off to the extent of retaining an acceptable customer base.

At one smaller DirecTV broadcast center they had two OC-192 fiber feeds (10Gbps each) for many years and in the last year or so they upgraded to something so big the employees I asked didn't even know what the capacity is any more. The employees at that site speculate the massive increase in BW will be for streaming services in the future, but who knows.

You think all the resources required to stream to millions of customers are free? Why has Netflix found it so difficult to turn a profit despite a constantly growing subscriber base? One of the reasons is because each new customer costs them more to deliver to, unlike satellite which has no ongoing per customer delivery cost - it is all fixed cost. The satellites and broadcast centers are paid for. Yes, the employees to staff the broadcast centers costs money, but a lot of that is duplicated for streaming - they still need at least two sites with those huge C band dishes to receive all the uplinks, people to maintain them, equipment to transcode as necessary. They still need all the LRFs around the country to gather the locals. It sounds like you understand a lot about how the satellite business works, but seem to think streaming runs on magic and doesn't require any employees or resources.

They can't get to a "Netflix model" in five years, there's no way they can convert 20 million customers. They will still have millions of customers who don't have a broadband option able to support streaming. You think they will just pull the plug? If they need to charge them a couple bucks more a month to account for the costs you are referring to, then they'll do so. If they want to get rid of their installers and require people to self-install or contact a third party for in-home service like dish installation like they used to, then that's an option.

 

[Inclined Orbit]

One General Dynamics TORUS receive only antenna would have more like 75 to 100 LNBs and costs in the range of $2mil. A new uplink dish with all the trimmings is in the range of $5mil on up.

They need to RECEIVE the uplinks from all the networks. That one giant elliptical dish they have that has like 30-40 LNBs probably cost more than all the uplink dishes they have combined.

 

[Juan]

They need to RECEIVE the uplinks from all the networks. That one giant elliptical dish they have that has like 30-40 LNBs probably cost more than all the uplink dishes they have combined.

Fiber is much cheaper..when you own a huge network

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[george99]

You think all the resources required to stream to millions of customers are free? Why has Netflix found it so difficult to turn a profit despite a constantly growing subscriber base? One of the reasons is because each new customer costs them more to deliver to, unlike satellite which has no ongoing per customer delivery cost - it is all fixed cost.

Might have something to do with the fact that I pay Netflix about $13/month and direct about $200/month.