That's right...TAMPA BAY is in 1st place in the AL East!!

[jerseyfla]

Okay, lets get this straight about the Marlins!!!

The 1997 team was that was the team where the World Series was bought.

The 2003 team was a team that just meshed well at the right time and came from nowhere to win the NL Wild Card. (kinda like last years Rockies). They beat San Francisco in the NLDS, they barely beat the Cubs in the NLCS, then rocked the Yankees in the World Series. Believe me this team's World Series was NOT bought like 1997. In fact most of the team was kept mostly intact the next year but by 2005 the team was dismantled with the exception of Dontelle Willis and Miguel Cabrera. I don't remember whether it was 2005 or 2006 that Joe Girardi almost took the Marlins to the playoffs but was fired after that season anyway.

 

[salsadancer7]

The Marlins proved that right twice. They purposely did it to prove a point. After the win they sold off the players and sucked again.

NO...because the '97 Wolds Series winner was middles of the pack payroll...around 85 million dollars. And the 2003 World Series winner had of payroll of barely even MUCH LESS at around 70 million. The '93 winner had a few free agents...but the guys they picked up were trades and a few end free agents.
The '03 team was MOSTLY farm products... WHERE are you getting that they "purposely did it to prove a point"....?? According to Loria, he could not afford the players long term...period.

Edit: The 1997 salary was 52 million....NOT the 85 million I thought.

 

[stevenl]

In 1997 the Marlins bought a championship. Regardless of having the highest payroll or not. They bought the best players available, won the game and sold them off. For the marlins they will never reach the salary of the Yankees, but that does not mean the Marlins didnt buy the game. The Yankees have such expensive long term contracts it would be hard for another team to match.

In 2003 The marlins came from being way down to win the WS.

 

[harveystern]

Dosent almost 50 percent of major league teams try to buy a team to win a world seris every year? Yes im a marlin fan Harvey

 

[iceturkee]

boston is in 1st after sweeping the brew crew!

 

[HD MM]

In 1997 the Marlins bought a championship. Regardless of having the highest payroll or not. They bought the best players available, won the game and sold them off. For the marlins they will never reach the salary of the Yankees, but that does not mean the Marlins didnt buy the game. The Yankees have such expensive long term contracts it would be hard for another team to match.

In 2003 The marlins came from being way down to win the WS.

You just had to bring up the '97 WS, didn't you?!

Us Clevelander's still believe that the Marlins "bought" Joe Table (Jose Mesa/Indian closer) to win that game.

For those who don't remember, the 7th game of the '97 World Series went to the bottom of the 9th inning, with the Tribe up 2-1........

In the bottom of the 9th, Jose Mesa was brought in to close out the series and bring Cleveland its first title since 1948. Moises Alou led off the inning with a single. With one out, Charles Johnson lined a single to right that advanced Alou to third base. Then Craig Counsell hit a sacrifice fly to right that tied the score at 2, sending the contest into extra frames. The Marlins ended up winning in 11 innings.

I am still recovering to this day and periodically experience bad dreams and wake up in cold sweats when thinking about this game. Oh, the agony of being a Cleveland sport's fan!

 

[salsadancer7]

In 1997 the Marlins bought a championship. Regardless of having the highest payroll or not. They bought the best players available, won the game and sold them off. For the marlins they will never reach the salary of the Yankees, but that does not mean the Marlins didnt buy the game. The Yankees have such expensive long term contracts it would be hard for another team to match.

In 2003 The marlins came from being way down to win the WS.

Steven HOW in the world can you say they "bought the best players available" when their payroll didn't even reach 55 million? IF they would have done that, their payroll would have benn in the Yankee, Braves, Red Sox range.... BECAUSE they sold them off had NOTHING to do on whether they were "the best team money can buy". More than half of that roster was either via trade or the farm.

 

[harveystern]

okay compare bosten got beckett and lowell, marlins got sheffield alou and brown, Did boston buy there team also. Harvey

 

[stevenl]

Steven HOW in the world can you say they "bought the best players available" when their payroll didn't even reach 55 million? IF they would have done that, their payroll would have benn in the Yankee, Braves, Red Sox range.... BECAUSE they sold them off had NOTHING to do on whether they were "the best team money can buy". More than half of that roster was either via trade or the farm.

They spent about 80 million building that team, then sold it off at the end of the season.

They bought the best team availible at the time (obvioulsy some players were not able to be bought because of contracts)

The point of the story is, he who has the deepest pockets will have the most titles.

 

[salsadancer7]

They spent about 80 million building that team, then sold it off at the end of the season.

They bought the best team availible at the time (obvioulsy some players were not able to be bought because of contracts)

The point of the story is, he who has the deepest pockets will have the most titles.

The payroll for the '97 was between 45 to 54 million(according to various websites)....in the lower third of payroll that year...

And what do you say about the '03 team...?? THAT team was not bought in ANYWAY.....

 

[Hart5150]

okay compare bosten got beckett and lowell, marlins got sheffield alou and brown, Did boston buy there team also. Harvey

The Marlins got Hanley Ramirez in that trade, I say that worked out for both teams. That is not buying, that is just the Red Sox trading a future super star for current ones.

 

[DanLee]

From what I recall, the Marlins did not have the highest payroll (or even close) when they won. They did have to sell off their stars to avoid their salaries escalating through the roof after their championships, but I don't think their payroll was anywhere near the Yankees, Red Sox or Mets even when they won.


Sandra

They may not have equated their payroll, but you are referring to the top 2 payrolls in the game over the past 15 years. in addition, they are the top 2 markets in the mlb (maybe excluding LA). Quite honestly, no one CAN match them. They had to get rid of many fine players (Derrick Lee, Josh Beckett, Lowell, Castillo) after they won the second and brought in some good players as well that made quick exits after the World Series (Ivan Rodriquez, Hollandsworth, Redmond, Encarnacion, Juan Pierre, and Jeff Conine ).

 

[DanLee]

The payroll for the '97 was between 45 to 54 million(according to various websites)....in the lower third of payroll that year...

And what do you say about the '03 team...?? THAT team was not bought in ANYWAY.....

What was their salary the year BEFORE and AFTER the ws in '97 and '03. I am willing to bet 45-54 million dollars that it wasn't even close.

As a result, they did buy players, as all teams do, in order to win a championship. Quite honestly, there is no shame in it. With free agency the way it is, it is impossible not to buy championships. Come on, Florida has 2 World Series trophies, some teams don't have any!!!

 

[salsadancer7]

What was their salary the year BEFORE and AFTER the ws in '97 and '03. I am willing to bet 45-54 million dollars that it wasn't even close.

As a result, they did buy players, as all teams do, in order to win a championship. Quite honestly, there is no shame in it. With free agency the way it is, it is impossible not to buy championships. Come on, Florida has 2 World Series trophies, some teams don't have any!!!

Again, YES...they DID pick up free agents...but they ALSO had picked up players in trades and they had 4 starters that were home grown(Livian, Renteria, Charles Johnson and Luis Castillo). Bobby Bonilla(3b) was via trade, Alex Fernandez, Dennis Cook, Moises Alou....free agents in 1996. In 1997, Cliff Floyd via trade, John Burkett, Devon White, Al Lieter and Kevin Brown via free agency IN 1995. The REST of the 25 man World Series roster was most home grown.

So when you loo at that list....on ONLY was a late season pick-up during the Worlds Series run to help the team....Darren Daulton. The rest of the free agents were pick-up 2 years BEFORE the World Series run....therefore the theory that they were picked-up "as the best free agents available" is nonsense. The year after they picked up the "best available free agents"...which would include MOST of the free agents they had for the World Series run....they went a WHOPPING 80-82 finish! Against, disproving the notion that "they had the best available free agents for the time".....

 

[DanLee]

I didn't agree that they picked up the best available free agents. You just make statements that would lead me to believe that you feel they would have won the World Series without these pickups. I don't believe they would have been able to win without adding a few major free agents to a lineup poised for a great season (Brown, Counsel in '97 and Rodriguez in '03). Just because they added them a year or two before they won, doesn't mean they weren't an important FA addition. Sometimes they need time to gel as a team.

My point was only to get you to understand that in today's game, You will NEVER see a team that relies 100% on home-grown talent to win a championship in the MLB. It is impossible. You really can't even say the teams that spent their major league career with one team are home-grown, because many are traded while they are prospects from one farm system to another.

Without Free agent pickups, NO TEAM WILL WIN A WORLD SERIES!!!

 

[HD MM]

I didn't agree that they picked up the best available free agents. You just make statements that would lead me to believe that you feel they would have won the World Series without these pickups. I don't believe they would have been able to win without adding a few major free agents to a lineup poised for a great season (Brown, Counsel in '97 and Rodriguez in '03). Just because they added them a year or two before they won, doesn't mean they weren't an important FA addition. Sometimes they need time to gel as a team.

My point was only to get you to understand that in today's game, You will NEVER see a team that relies 100% on home-grown talent to win a championship in the MLB. It is impossible. You really can't even say the teams that spent their major league career with one team are home-grown, because many are traded while they are prospects from one farm system to another.

Without Free agent pickups, NO TEAM WILL WIN A WORLD SERIES!!!

The Indian's starting rotation currently has 5 pitchers that were "home-grown" through our minor league system including: Sabathia, Carmona, Lee, Laffey and Sowers.

Plus, out of our starting lineup, only 2 players started with different teams! (Casey Blake and Travis Hafner. The rest ALL started in our farm system!)

As a mater of fact, this is the method best used to compete in a no salary cap league. Build from within and sign young players to long-term contracts. Our GM, Mark Shapiro has been utilizing this strategy for quite some time now....

 

[Hart5150]

The Indian's starting rotation currently has 5 pitchers that were "home-grown" through our minor league system including: Sabathia, Carmona, Lee, Laffey and Sowers.

Plus, out of our starting lineup, only 2 players started with different teams! (Casey Blake and Travis Hafner. The rest ALL started in our farm system!)

As a mater of fact, this is the method best used to compete in a no salary cap league. Build from within and sign young players to long-term contracts. Our GM, Mark Shapiro has been utilizing this strategy for quite some time now....

And they did not win a championship, so you are proving DanLee's point.

 

[HD MM]

And they did not win a championship, so you are proving DanLee's point.

Well yes, but I still consider the Indian's as a competitive team for the World Series every year despite our lack of funding. That's why it will be all the sweater when we finally do make it to the promise land....

 

[DanLee]

And at this point, I think Cleveland is about 1-2 good trades or FA signings away from a championship. As a white sox fan, I hope they stay with their current philosophy!!