Random results when blind scanning 127W

[Titanium]

I wonder what it would take to modify one of those for 3800 -4200, or even 4000-4200? Maybe changing one of the surface mount inductor or capacitor values? I don't design cutoff filters so maybe someone can enlighten me?

And every neighbor who gets 5G internet will become a new source of interference.

Potental 5g interference? Yes. Reality? No.

The majority of 5g home Internet in urban/suburban locations will not use the slower throughput mid-band frequencies. The high speed services occur in the mm bands and these frequencies do not interfer with C-band. Of the dozens of frequencies used for 5G, only one band interferes with C-band satellite.

A band pass filter LNBF is a complete PCB design not simply a changed component.

 

[N6BY]

Potental 5g interference? Yes. Reality? No.

The majority of 5g home Internet in urban/suburban locations will not use the slower throughput mid-band frequencies....

Not true.

The mm bands are being used for urban areas (downtown areas and stadiums). C Band is for the suburbs (like where I am).

See: Verizon Doubles Down on 5G Home Fixed Wireless After C-band Win

For more: Verizon customers to see speed and performance benefits from 200 MHz C-band spectrum
And: How 5G coverage is expanding: Understanding C-Band

 

[N6BY]

...
A band pass filter LNBF is a complete PCB design not simply a changed component.

Yes, of course. But that is not what I was talking about.

I was talking about modifying an existing 5G filter LNBF's cutoff frequency from, for example, 3800 to 4000 MHz.

 

[Titanium]

Not true.

The mm bands are being used for urban areas (downtown areas and stadiums). C Band is for the suburbs (like where I am).

See: Verizon Doubles Down on 5G Home Fixed Wireless After C-band Win

For more: Verizon customers to see speed and performance benefits from 200 MHz C-band spectrum
And: How 5G coverage is expanding: Understanding C-Band

I am only relaying the reality of 5G roll out vs "the sky is falling". 5G in C-band is used to provide wider area coverage and deeper penetration, but it is limited due bandwidth and only can provide a fraction of the speed achieved in the mm bands. The small area cells being installed for neighborhood coverage (small nodes on utility poles) are primarily short range high throughput mm bands.

Have several friends in the local cell build out , who tell me this is what is being installed in Sacramento and the foothill communities. A few sentences in national Verizon press release articles about their C-band usage does't provide much detail on how it is actually being integrated with the other bands to provide robust coverage in urban and suburban areas. Yes, C-band is being used in areas requiring fill and penetration, but it isn't the primary band for high speed home 5g internet.

Consider for a moment that as a seller of C-band interference mitigation products that I should want everyone to think that 5g interference is everywhere and promote reasons to buy my products. What do I gain by suggesting that cellular 5g in the C-band might not be an issue at the magnitude that your posts suggests for most hobbyist here on the forum.

Like yourself, my goal is to enjoy and support the C-band satellite hobby. There is not one mitigation solution that fits all. Some users may not require any filtering, others will only need intermediate filtering like provided internally in LNBs and LNBFs. In extreme cases, a servo feed (you do not need an expensive orthomode design) or fixed feed inline waveguide mechanical filter(s) or physically blocking interference with RF barriers.

Yes, I understood that you were referring to modding a 3700-4200 BPF to cover instead 3800-4200 range. Filtration is achieved with PCB printed pin cushion filtering of the primary frequency prior to conversion and component changes to limit the IF range. It is a combination of front end filtering addressing the conversion overloading and IF shaping for receiver desense. To shift the conversion filering, the printed filter traces on the PCB would need to be physically retuned (length, demension and spacing). IF bandpass modding with component changes would limit the IF output bandwidth. It isn't a simple component swap.

 

[Cham]

Current signal from 4008V from 127W, EBS Pro:

Not a great signal here either, but plays on the Edison MIO just fine this am through the network.
40mph winds though this am, likely shaking the dish a bit... Don't want to scare you with the temperature right now.

 

[N6BY]

I am only relaying the reality of 5G roll out vs "the sky is falling". 5G in C-band is used to provide wider area coverage and deeper penetration, but it is limited due bandwidth and only can provide a fraction of the speed achieved in the mm bands. The small area cells being installed for neighborhood coverage (small nodes on utility poles) are primarily short range high throughput mm bands.

Have several friends in the local cell build out , who tell me this is what is being installed in Sacramento and the foothill communities....

Those spikes in the spectrum graph in my post #1 are not mm band spikes, they are 5G spikes in band N77. mm waves are above 25 GHz and the N77 band is from 3.7 to 3.8 GHz. Verizon paid a lot of money for N77 and they are using it in my area!

I challenge you, Brian, to show me anything in writing from Verizon that they are not using C-Band N77 for Home Internet in the suburbs. Not talk from "friends" -- your so called "reality", which directly contradicts my spectrum graph in post #1 and public statements issued directly by Verizon on their website, such as the excerpt below.

"Increasing the amount of C-band spectrum being used turbo charges Verizon’s 5G service, offering significantly higher speeds, much greater capacity to accommodate more customers and more robust services, and allows Verizon to offer 5G Home broadband and Business Internet services to more customers."

And I never said "the sky is falling" for C Band. But the situation is not ideal. My 8.5' Birdview dish is no longer able to get C-Band reliably. However, as I stated back in post #14, with the C138 on my 10' Unimesh I can now get NASA TV (as long as I don't do a blind scan). Blind scanning usually gets me a random number of transponders on 127W. I tried another receiver with the same result.

So now I know I need the 10' dish for C-Band and as long as I don't blind scan, all is well for now.

 

[N6BY]

Not a great signal here either, but plays on the Edison MIO just fine this am through the network.
40mph winds though this am, likely shaking the dish a bit... Don't want to scare you with the temperature right now.

On 4008V I am seeing about 14 dB now. Sky is clear and no wind. I have seen it as high as about 17 dB.

Your 12.2 dB is getting close to the minimum which I think is around 10 or 11 dB

... I changed the title of this thread. As stated earlier I can now get NASA.

 

[Titanium]

I did not say that mid-range was not being used in your area, only to the level that it was being installed and utilized.

I apolgize to anyone in this community that I offended with my previous posts. I will let you work out these issues and refrain from further participation in these conversations.

Best regards and Merry Christmas to everyone in the forum.

 

[arlo]

Good reading guys. So, what's the deal with 127 and signal anyway? The sun perhaps?
On the East coast twice a day a bunch of tp's rapidly lose signal for, oh let's say 1/2hr, 45 minutes. Just like in the summer when you can almost track sats that die in the arc where the sun is in proximity of line of sight. I see mention of the Alaska mux. A tp that seem to lose little if any signal would be 4080V. Nope. didn't check the footprint in my area yet. Anyhow.
Reelz on 4020H, 3900H, 4140H, 3940H, NASA. And more. H & V tp's signal hits 0.
Timeframe? Lets say late morning (don't hold me to it) and always 2:30-3:00am-ish.
Thoughts?

Has anyone used an SDR to use as a SA to monitor the TP spectrum?
If so is there an idea or a link to a sort of "dirty" tap into the coax coming out of a receiver?
I have an SDRPlay RSP2 and looks like there's a pretty slick spectrum analyzer application for them. Not exactly wanting to my bench SA around.

 

[primestar31]

Best regards and Merry Christmas to everyone in the forum.

Merry Christmas, Brian!

 

[N6BY]

...
Has anyone used an SDR to use as a SA to monitor the TP spectrum?
If so is there an idea or a link to a sort of "dirty" tap into the coax coming out of a receiver?
I have an SDRPlay RSP2 and looks like there's a pretty slick spectrum analyzer application for them. Not exactly wanting to my bench SA around.

That's an excellent idea.

To tap into the signal, you just need a splitter and a blocking capacitor to protect the SDR Play from the satellite receiver's power.

I will give that a try later.

 

[N6BY]

That's an excellent idea.

To tap into the signal, you just need a splitter and a blocking capacitor to protect the SDR Play from the satellite receiver's power.

I will give that a try later.

Merry Christmas everyone!

The SDR Play can only see 10 MHz of spectrum at a time, but I have a program that can display 16X of the normal bandwidth nearly simultaneously: DR Processor Testing and Discussion

Will be able to see up to 160 MHz of spectrum at a time. After trying it with the 10' Unimesh I plan to use it with an unfiltered old C band LNBF and the most directional 4 GHz antenna that I can come up with. I hope to be able to find the 5G sources in my area.

The SDR program I made is free. The download link is broken as I quit paying the domain name fee for n6by.com. But If anyone wants it just let me know. It works with SDR Play, AirSpy, and RTL-SDR. The program still has some bugs but works most of the time.

 

[arlo]

Merry Christmas everyone!

The SDR Play can only see 10 MHz of spectrum at a time, but I have a program that can display 16X of the normal bandwidth nearly simultaneously: DR Processor Testing and Discussion

Will be able to see up to 160 MHz of spectrum at a time. After trying it with the 10' Unimesh I plan to use it with an unfiltered old C band LNBF and the most directional 4 GHz antenna that I can come up with. I hope to be able to find the 5G sources in my area.

The SDR program I made is free. The download link is broken as I quit paying the domain name fee for n6by.com. But If anyone wants it just let me know. It works with SDR Play, AirSpy, and RTL-SDR. The program still has some bugs but works most of the time.

I would like to check out your program. Perhaps you could throw it up on a site like wetransfer.
The application I was looking at is here:

Spectrum Analyser - SDRplay

May 25th 2024 Update: Steve Andrew developed his popular Windows Spectrum Analyser software specifically for the RSP line of products. Steve has his own website from where you can download the latest Spectrum Analyser (V1.21). This includes upgrades to the software introduced in April and now...

www.sdrplay.com

It appears as if seeing a wider spectrum is possible from the screen shot. Haven't had the RSP2 hooked up since building a patch antenna for Inmarsat/Aero months ago.
Also. Looking at the Othernet site. They are using their Bullseye universal ku lnbf without a dish for the Dreamcatcher board. No dish! In the conus using SES-2 at 87W.
If even that it would be possible, it seeds a thought of using an unfiltered c band lnbf with some sort of a waveguide to hunt down the source(s) of 5G terrestrial interference.

Merry Christmas to all.

 

[N6BY]

I would like to check out your program. Perhaps you could throw it up on a site like wetransfer.
The application I was looking at is here:

Spectrum Analyser - SDRplay

May 25th 2024 Update: Steve Andrew developed his popular Windows Spectrum Analyser software specifically for the RSP line of products. Steve has his own website from where you can download the latest Spectrum Analyser (V1.21). This includes upgrades to the software introduced in April and now...

www.sdrplay.com

It appears as if seeing a wider spectrum is possible from the screen shot. Haven't had the RSP2 hooked up since building a patch antenna for Inmarsat/Aero months ago.
Also. Looking at the Othernet site. They are using their Bullseye universal ku lnbf without a dish for the Dreamcatcher board. No dish! In the conus using SES-2 at 87W.
If even that it would be possible, it seeds a thought of using an unfiltered c band lnbf with some sort of a waveguide to hunt down the source(s) of 5G terrestrial interference.

Merry Christmas to all.

Certainly. I'll put a link to it on my website naturalgfx.com after I verify its still working (I haven't looked at my DR Processor program in a few years). It might take me a few days to get it working with the latest versions of the SDR device drivers.

Thanks for the link to the other program. It looks like it will do 500 MHz of spectrum. However, if I remember correctly, my AirSpy SDR had a much faster update speed than my SDRPlay RSP1A. But its been a long time since I worked with them so my memory could be wrong.

As for a directional antenna, I am considering a 12 inch parabolic dish I already have. Its a fairly deep dish with a low F/D ratio. I can just mount an unfiltered C Band LNBF to it and get a 13 volt power source and my Windows laptop with an SDR and I'll have a portable signal hunter (I hope).

Come to think of it, making and using a portable signal hunter will give me far more enjoyment than watching FTA TV.

 

[N6BY]

Certainly. I'll put a link to it on my website naturalgfx.com after I verify its still working (I haven't looked at my DR Processor program in a few years). It might take me a few days to get it working with the latest versions of the SDR device drivers.
...

Just an update -- I'm still working with DR Processor and it's taking longer than I predicted. My SDRPlay RSP1A quit working but I still have my older RSP1. Also, Windows 10 is giving the program problems that I need to address before another release.