Picture seems to glimmer
- Thread starter Madtown HD Junkie
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barth2k said:
That's not true... ONLY OTA will use such a bandwith and let me say that if you think that these channels are DVD quality then I must get my eyes checked.
vurbano said:
Do not understand your statement? If everyone is using 12mbps what is it that satellite company should do? Start Delivering every single channel at 19mbps. Gee... Even PBS-HD which is OTA and should be 19mbps is not willing to do this. There are restrictions and computations of mbsp/Tps. D*, E* and V* all have limitations on these. There are also business decisions as to what you want to deliver.
Also, I knew we had a discussion like this in the past and before we go ahead and continue in this path again here is the thread
Sean Mota said:
You're wrong. Comcast (not all areas, but most) pass through the signal w/o further compression. Some other cable cos do the same. The only thing they do is encode and encrypt the data.
and like I said, E* is said to be using 19mpbs. Only D* is recompressing b/c of their bandwidth limitation. But that may change with the new satellite (or not).
You say V* is no worse than others. 1) wow, that's a nice standard to aspire to and 2) yes they ARE worse than some.
Sean Mota said:
Well, you probably should. Newer DVDs played on a progressive DVD player look better than most Voom's "exclusive" old, crappy, grainy, blurry, mono or stereo movies.
Pisses me off that some folks on this forum are in constant denial about Voom's PQ issue even after tens of people complained about it here. How can we then expect that Voom will recognize and address this problem when people like you Sean keep marginalizing our posts? There is problem with every Voom channel, including HDNews. This channel look somewhat better than others just because of the constant still picture and not very detailed background. We all know that 1080i works the best with still images.
I pay every month 10+ dollars for Dish's and keep 811 receiver (for which I could get 100-200 dollars) just because of Voom's PQ issue which, apparently, is not likely to be addressed in my lifetime. My anger about it is growing and I am every day closer pull the plug and go back to Dish or somewhere else where I can get some decent HD PQ. Many people already did so and many more keep their old HD provider for the same reason. I just don't see how they intend to stay in the business with this level of ignorance.
Only thing I can say to that Conjuror is that I am "One" of those people in "Denial". I see some issues on some specific channel's but nothing on the grand scale you are "supposedly" seeing. Either I'm blind or you have a 150' screen and sitting 4 feet from it.
If your that disatisfied don't hang around here and go back to dish full time.
If your that disatisfied don't hang around here and go back to dish full time.
Conjuror said:
Cheap shot, I don't see why Motorla's product can be patched, or refined into a good box. With this last firmware, and some tweaking (more needed but not with the box) I don't have problems with the box. PQ problem is not box related. I agree there are some issues, and everyone has different issues, but I guess you're still a Voom customer for a reason right? I know you troll and pester because you want all the issues resolved, all the channels you want added. It just seems to me like you want Voom to cover all these areas so you can finally drop the other providers and stick with them. Other feel the same way they just dont express themselves like you do I guess.
barth2k said:
Please post some back up data for your claim. The data needs to be current and you need to monitor the data over a period of time. Then take the average of that and come and post the data with your graphs. I also would like to know the equipment that was used to collect the data since every equipment has its own scale. Since you seem convinced that this is the case, let's post data analysis.
Conjuror said:
Conjuror,
no denial. You have been fixated on the same thing since you started posting here. I can give, you like other had posted, that not everything is well in VOOM land but on a grand scale of things, I take any programming PQ in the 21 exclusive compare to the same DVD (progressive or not). Your claim that we are in denial is quite out of this world...
Sean, maybe Conjuror's using a DVI connected upconverting DVD player while the rest of us lowly bums are using a pisspoor component connected progressive player? I have yet to see a DVD look as good as the worst Voom exclusive (except EquatorHD). I may change my mind once I take possession of the D3, if it ever ships.
I have an HTPC and I watch DVD through my HTPC at 1368x720p and I still say that the HD on Voom looks much better.
Conjuror I will be the first to admit that Voom has issues. While it's frustrating, it is to be expected that there are going to be growing pains associated with Voom becoming a mature business entity.
So, you either accept the fact that Voom is going through some issues or cancel your service. If you are so concerned about getting a message through to Voom, then use your wallet and show them that their current offerings are unacceptable.
Evidently Dish is not satisfying your HD needs or else you would not be a Voom customer. I guess you could go back to Dish or over to Directv, but guess what??? I could point to a variety of different forums where members gripe continually about the PQ of those two providers. So whatever satellite provider you choose to go with there are going to be issues....period.
So, you either accept the fact that Voom is going through some issues or cancel your service. If you are so concerned about getting a message through to Voom, then use your wallet and show them that their current offerings are unacceptable.
Evidently Dish is not satisfying your HD needs or else you would not be a Voom customer. I guess you could go back to Dish or over to Directv, but guess what??? I could point to a variety of different forums where members gripe continually about the PQ of those two providers. So whatever satellite provider you choose to go with there are going to be issues....period.
DarrellP said:
That is not the point I tried to make but I clearly said that newer DVDs look better than those old, grainy, and mono movies. You can upgrade a black and white movie to 1000080i but It'll still be black and white and cannot look and sound better than Matrix on DVD, for example.
the point is, whenever someone complains about PQ on Voom he gets bunch of responses basically about how he/she is blind and probably needs to buy a color TV. It happened again on this topic, it happened to me, and almost to everyone else who dared to say that Dish or whoever, has better HD picture than Voom.
Nevertheless, I give a lot of credit to Voom for pushing HDTV on the market and that is why I still pay my monthly TV bills. I understand that Voom is new on the DBS market and I expected many problems you normally don't have with Dish or DirecTV. In fact, I have far less problems than I was prepared to take initially when I switched to Voom.
However, I do expect from them to address PQ complaints from many of us. If they would just say that, for example, that their PQ will improve when they apply new compression technology or introduce new STB version, whatever. In that case I would be willing to wait for that to happen even a year or so. However, if they don't see PQ issue at all or if the PQ would never improve, I will pull the plug. In the meantime, you all will still have to deal with my posts
.Conjuror, I think your missing the point.
If all of us saw PQ problems or all of us had no PQ problems then you can look at a single source and denounce them or applaud them. That, as you have seen is not the case. So we either have people lieing, don't know what there talking about, or having individual problems with there equipment.
Personally I think its a little of both not knowing what there talking about and individual equipment problems but thats just me.
If all of us saw PQ problems or all of us had no PQ problems then you can look at a single source and denounce them or applaud them. That, as you have seen is not the case. So we either have people lieing, don't know what there talking about, or having individual problems with there equipment.
Personally I think its a little of both not knowing what there talking about and individual equipment problems but thats just me.
Sean Mota said:
I see. I have to be a video expert with all kind of equipments, which of course I'm not and I don't. I'm just going by what I see, what's been posted by people in this group and at avsforum. Yeah, okay, you win. Voom's pq is just great. Nobody is any better.
Conjuror said:
How in this world do you expect the same quality from a 2003 DVD to a 1965 HD Transfer?
This is basic man. We have been telling you the same over and over again. Of course, the 2003 DVD would look better than the 1965 HD Movie whose masters has gone through temperature changes, deteroriation and who knows what else. When you compare DVDs to HD transfer, you need to compare the same DVD for the movie to the HD transfer. That is only fair. You cannot take a 2003 DVD and say to me I get better quality on this than the 1965 movie HD transfer I saw on Cinema 1. That is not the way to do it.
