Newbie trying to setup dish with 2104D USB

[disco]

I am trying to setup a dish using my DVBworld 2104D. This is my first dish setup. I am using a new universal LNB with a 80cm dish. I have set the azimuth and elevation according to the dishpointer website.

I am attempting to align the dish by going up on the roof with my laptop, extension cord and 2104D box. Then hooking eveything up and trying to lock onto a satellite. I have been able to get a 90% signal strentgh, but the quality meter behaves strange. The problem I am having with the quality meter is that it will always jump from 10% quality to 95% quality. It will stay at 95% for exactly 3 seconds then drop to 10% for 3 seconds and never alters from this cyclic behaver while I am trying to lock on.

Is this normal for the 2104D? Both the signal strength and quality bars are always solid red in color. I have not been able to lock onto anything.

I am trying to lock on to the amazonas @ 61W.

Unfortunately I do not have any box to try and only have the DVBworld 2104D USB box.

 

[updatelee]

Do you have another stb ? I find many dvb cards are unreliable when it comes to signal strength/snr. some are completly out to lunch on their numbers.

 

[disco]

I only have the USB box to check and receive the signal. I hope that I don't have to buy a set top box just to be able to align te dish properly. It seems like it would be a basic function of any reciever to be able to indicate proper signal levels. I don't understand how they can make receivers and not implament that at least at a functional level.

I am hoping someone else who also owns a 2104D and has more experience than I could tell me that is how the quality meter behaves for this box. I am just trying to rule out that I have a defective unit.

When I remove the signal cable going to the satellite the quality meter still behaves the same. It will go to 95% for 3 seconds then drop to 10% for 3 seconds, but the signal strength meter will slowly over a period of 1 or 2 minutes drop to zero. It just seems to me if there is no signal quality it should read a steady low value and not bounce like described.

 

[updatelee]

well you wont find any stb or dvb card that indicates proper signal levels, thats just a fact. they all just use their own arbitrary numbers.

-74uV on one ird will be 50%, 10%, or 80% on another

you cant compare numbers from one receiver to the next, just cant, been that way forever. wish they would standardize it to uV for strength and db for quality, but they dont, they insist on % which is retarded

could you imaging a voltmeter that gave a % reading insted of volts ? doesnt make sense does it. if an 18" dish read 100% signal, what if you were using a 36" dish, would it read 400% ?

db is a standard but alas many tuners dont report snr correctly either so they just use made up forumlas to give the user a ruff idea of the signal quality. often based off the BER, 0 errors would be 100% quality, but that doesnt tell you anything about the actual snr db level other then its "good enough"

get a 4x8 multiswitch and hook 8 stb to it and you'll get 8 different signal strengths and 8 different quality readings yet they all work fine.

pci/usb dvb tuners have always been on the more unreliable side of the % scale. They often work much better then a stb for tuning, just the signal meters just tend to be more unreliable.

they arent designed for aiming is what it comes down to, use the proper equipment for the job and it'll make your life alot easier. Use the wrong equipment for the job and you can still get it done, it just will be alot harder and more stressfull.

 

[disco]

OK thanks for the information about the short comings of the meters built into the boxes. I am still wondering about how the quality meter behaves. If it somehow indicates I have a defective box.

The way I am trying to align the dish using the box is by first aiming the dish using data from the dishpointer website. Then by going into the settings page of the DVB World program and selecting the satelite I am trying to lockon. This provides a list of TP's on the right hand side of the page. Then I select a TP and try to lock on to it. After this a big child window containing nothing but signal and quality bar meters is displayed. Both meters are solid red. I have made adjustments to the dish to get the signal strength meter as high as possible, but the quality meter always behaves as described earlier, it never alters from that.

I have set all other settings I could see in the settings page to correct values, such as the LNB type L.O. freq's etc.

 

[crackt]

well disco i have the pcie2006. the meter behaviour you see indicates no lock. when you do lock a tp the meter will turn green and the numbers repsond normally then. how much az / el adjustments have you made while aiming. the dvbworld tuners grab signals way outside of where my stbs do (will hold a lock while the other tuners fail when moving the dish off signal). in my opinion if the dvbworld is supported by the fastsatfinder software id use that. i use it with a prof 7500 and its a snap to aim a dish. from your posts id start by verifying the tuner is actually outputting power. a cheap multi meter on the coax end will verify this. secondly it isnt uncommon with cheap lnbs to find that they are just that, cheap. i once had a universal lnb that came with a 36" fortec i bought. i could never get a lock with it. pulling of the cover revealed that the silicon they applied to seal the cap was in fact blocking any signal to the probes. also check that there isnt any sheilding material shorting your coax. it may not be the tuner.

crackt out,.

 

[crossbow]

IThe problem I am having with the quality meter is that it will always jump from 10% quality to 95% quality. It will stay at 95% for exactly 3 seconds then drop to 10% for 3 seconds and never alters from this cyclic behaver while I am trying to lock on.

Is this normal for the 2104D? Both the signal strength and quality bars are always solid red in color. I have not been able to lock onto anything.

I am trying to lock on to the amazonas @ 61W.

Unfortunately I do not have any box to try and only have the DVBworld 2104D USB box.

I used my C band dish and 2104D to simulate your problem by moving the dish off then on to a sat as if searching. I suggest you pick a known active TP on a strong sat and enter the info in the set-up menu, freq, SR, polarity, FEC. Ensure you have the LNB settings correct, probably 10750 for Ku or 5150 for C. Now you need to click on "lock TP" and that will tune the receiver to whatever you set in and bring up the big meters you refered to. They will probably be red and doing what you described, thats what it does with no signal. Now slowly in small increments move the dish azimuth pausing for 3 or more seconds with each move to give time for the receiver to react. If you hit the sat the meters will turn green and indicate the S and Q, adjust for best Q. If you miss then adjust the dish elevation a little and try again. Keep it up untill you find the sat. It takes time and patience. Once aligned perform a blind scan to find all the channels. If you provide your nearest city I can recommend a sat and a fewTP to start. Once you have a feel for it then go for the one you are after. Probably nothing wrong with the box, just not the best for dish aligning, but great at viewing.

 

[disco]

I have measured 14 volts coming out of the 2104D box. The cable I'm using is new RG-6 cable, but I still checked for a short and did not find any. Tried also the fastsatfinder program, but it always reads 0% strength and 0% quality, maybe the 2104 is not supported.
I have made small adjustments 2 or 3 degrees in both azimuth and elevation, also big adjustments of 10 or 20 degrees. The problem I am having is the meters or not changing when I move the dish in small increments. The strength meter will change about 3% if I make adjustments of 20 degrees or so at the dish. The meters will also change if I select a different satellite or tp.
I have tried rolling back the driver to an earlier version that shipped with the box. This made the meter display different values, but the behaver was simular as described earlier. I have spent consideraable time on the roof moving the antenna approx 2 or 3 hours in total trying to get the box to lock on to something. I have changed out the LNB and am now using a sharp bs19rel100a, before I was using a skyflex brand. I have also tried locking onto to different satellites and tp's that others in my area seem to have no problem with. In the settings I have selected universal LNB and am using the preloaded values for the transponder as supplied by the DVB World software program.
I have come to the conclusion that if I'm ever able to get the 2104D box to lock onto a satellite, it won't be by using the meter values displayed by the 2104D driver. Do those analog meters you see on ebay work for trying to lock onto a sat? Are the other more recomended cost effective alternatives?
I was thinking of buying a motor to drive the dish, but am assuming that I would first need to be able to lock the dish on to a known satellite first. Is that correct? Is the motor able to move the dish around until it detects that the dish has locked onto a satellite, then the user would figure out which one by scanning and entering in which one has been locked? Then from that point the motor would be able to function from a known point.
I would definetly not recommend buying the 2104D if there is no other equipment to adjust the dish, unless you like spending a lot of time on the roof with the antenna and your luck is better than mine.
Thanks for all the sugestions and adviced offered, even though no success yet it has helped.

 

[updatelee]

I wouldnt recommend buying ANY dvb pc tuner without proper aiming equipment.

It can be done with a decent stb, but hell even then it shouldnt be done with a stb.

Use the right tools for the job, if you dont have them, either suffer with what you go, or preferably pay someone who does todo it for you.

For a basic install I used to charge $60 for intown aiming and $100 for out of town aiming, that included me running the coax, but not configuring the receiver (a customer needs to know how todo that themselves)

I own a satlook NIT spectrum analyzer, any decent installer will have a good spectrum analyzer, satlook being the lowend. Those Prodig's are beautiful but I never had the $4k for one. If he uses an acutrac or a beeper he's junk, same with crimpers insted of compression.

For someone who doesnt have the tools thats well worth the price to have a professional install done.

 

[crackt]

you dont need a spectrum analyzer to aim a dish. we are hobbiests not cable headend techs. haha. a coolsat 8k is one of the best tuners to aim with. i use a laptop and a prof 7500 to aim with and i have very good results. not everyone needs thousands of dollars of euipment to set up their 250 dollar sat system.

as for the OP... if you have a circular lnb try to start aiming with that.

crackt out,.

 

[crossbow]

. I have changed out the LNB and am now using a sharp bs19rel100a, before I was using a skyflex brand. I have also tried locking onto to different satellites and tp's that others in my area seem to have no problem with. In the settings I have selected universal LNB and am using the preloaded values for the transponder as supplied by the DVB World software program.

I find no reference to these LNBs. You want Linear not Circular. If they are not universal but standard select Custom 10750. This could be your problem. Not all TPs in the list are active so I repeat make sure you are on a good one. You can find a Sat with a 2104D.

 

[disco]

as for the OP... if you have a circular lnb try to start aiming with that.

Actually I do have one from a dtv dish, but why is a circular lnb recomended? the satellites that I have been trying to lock are linear.

 

[disco]

Both the lnb's I have been using are universal linear types and the satellites I am trying to lock are linear also.