is there any way to check to see if the receiver is actually receiving a signal from the lnbf. or to put it another way, to check if the receiver is damaged or not
is lnb working
- Thread starter iceroadman
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Yes, kinda. If you have a "signal strength" reading (not quality) then the LNB is probably good.
There is no way to actually test, everything else must be eliminated.
Can you list your Equip in detail:
Receiver Make and what you have entered in the Sat Setup Menu for the LNB
LNB Make / Model and L.O.
Dish type / size
Switches
There is no way to actually test, everything else must be eliminated.
Can you list your Equip in detail:
Receiver Make and what you have entered in the Sat Setup Menu for the LNB
LNB Make / Model and L.O.
Dish type / size
Switches
IceRoadman,
It would be really sweet to have some sort of a signal generator that you could use on the bench to simulate the output of the LNBF and inject it into the receiver or to simulate a satellite transmission and direct it into the feedhorn of the LNBF, but alas, there isn't anything available for a general consumer of satellite equipment that will accomplish this within our budgets. Nothing off the shelf anyway.
You could probably improvise and develop some sort of signal generator to at least simulate the L band frequency carrier to inject into the receiver (to simulate the LNBF), but you would have to have the equipment at hand. Most people don't have this sort of equipment and wouldn't ordinarily go out and purchase it due to the cost vs use ratio.
The least expensive method would be to have enough redundant components (LNBFs and receivers) and an actual real-world dish so that you can utilize an actual satellite signal and troubleshoot through a trial and error and swap and test method.
If you are certain that you have your receiver parameters set appropriately to match the LNBF type (i.e. the L.O. / local oscillator or LNB Frequency) and polarity and any switching concerns (not for external switches, but for any switching that might be processed internal to the LNB itself) then you should be able to extrapolate the health of the LNBF or receiver from what you detect on the signal level meter of the receiver.
As Lak stated, you should at least detect some indication on the signal level meter, even if you don't see anything on the signal quality meter.
The signal level meter not only registers a valid signal from a satellite, but it will also display oscillator or amplifier noise from the LNBF if the LNBF is "alive". Every amplifier (LNBF) generates some level of background noise so that even if you seal it up in a lead box, you should detect some signal from it if it is not totally dead.
If you disconnect the cable from the back of the receiver and look at the signal level meter, it should show virtually zero signal indication. Connect the LNBF to the receiver and the signal should "POP UP" to some weak level regardless if it is attached to a dish and aimed at a sat or laying on the bench in the house.
If the receiver and LNBF are working and it is the dish alignment that you are questioning, then if you have the LNBF attached to a dish, and especially to a motorized dish, you should see the signal level increase and decrease and increase again as you drive the dish (or manually pan the dish) from east to west and back. The signal level meter may not switch from an invalid to a valid signal (like changing from red to green or whatever color scheme your receiver uses) but it should increase and decrease as your dish comes near to a satellite and then passes it by. As long as your dish is somewhat reasonably aimed, this should work. If your dish is aimed so far off (like in the opposite direction from where the satellites are) then don't count on this. Truly, some people have aimed their dish off a north facing balcony towards the north pole in the northern hemisphere and couldn't understand why they weren't finding a satellite signal! It does happen.
The signal level meter will act somewhat like the beeper on a metal detector in this regard.
If you show absolutely NO signal level indication on your signal meter, then either your LNBF is dead, a cable or switch is open or dead or the receiver tuner is dead, or the receiver's setup parameter(s) are incorrect for the specific LNBF that you are using.
Therefore, if you know what signs to look for, you don't really need any laboratory test equipment to verify the health of your components. You can use logic and deduce from the results what the likely problems are, if any.
Hope this information gives you something to chew on and play with. Good luck.
RADAR
It would be really sweet to have some sort of a signal generator that you could use on the bench to simulate the output of the LNBF and inject it into the receiver or to simulate a satellite transmission and direct it into the feedhorn of the LNBF, but alas, there isn't anything available for a general consumer of satellite equipment that will accomplish this within our budgets. Nothing off the shelf anyway.
You could probably improvise and develop some sort of signal generator to at least simulate the L band frequency carrier to inject into the receiver (to simulate the LNBF), but you would have to have the equipment at hand. Most people don't have this sort of equipment and wouldn't ordinarily go out and purchase it due to the cost vs use ratio.
The least expensive method would be to have enough redundant components (LNBFs and receivers) and an actual real-world dish so that you can utilize an actual satellite signal and troubleshoot through a trial and error and swap and test method.
If you are certain that you have your receiver parameters set appropriately to match the LNBF type (i.e. the L.O. / local oscillator or LNB Frequency) and polarity and any switching concerns (not for external switches, but for any switching that might be processed internal to the LNB itself) then you should be able to extrapolate the health of the LNBF or receiver from what you detect on the signal level meter of the receiver.
As Lak stated, you should at least detect some indication on the signal level meter, even if you don't see anything on the signal quality meter.
The signal level meter not only registers a valid signal from a satellite, but it will also display oscillator or amplifier noise from the LNBF if the LNBF is "alive". Every amplifier (LNBF) generates some level of background noise so that even if you seal it up in a lead box, you should detect some signal from it if it is not totally dead.
If you disconnect the cable from the back of the receiver and look at the signal level meter, it should show virtually zero signal indication. Connect the LNBF to the receiver and the signal should "POP UP" to some weak level regardless if it is attached to a dish and aimed at a sat or laying on the bench in the house.
If the receiver and LNBF are working and it is the dish alignment that you are questioning, then if you have the LNBF attached to a dish, and especially to a motorized dish, you should see the signal level increase and decrease and increase again as you drive the dish (or manually pan the dish) from east to west and back. The signal level meter may not switch from an invalid to a valid signal (like changing from red to green or whatever color scheme your receiver uses) but it should increase and decrease as your dish comes near to a satellite and then passes it by. As long as your dish is somewhat reasonably aimed, this should work. If your dish is aimed so far off (like in the opposite direction from where the satellites are) then don't count on this. Truly, some people have aimed their dish off a north facing balcony towards the north pole in the northern hemisphere and couldn't understand why they weren't finding a satellite signal! It does happen.
The signal level meter will act somewhat like the beeper on a metal detector in this regard.
If you show absolutely NO signal level indication on your signal meter, then either your LNBF is dead, a cable or switch is open or dead or the receiver tuner is dead, or the receiver's setup parameter(s) are incorrect for the specific LNBF that you are using.
Therefore, if you know what signs to look for, you don't really need any laboratory test equipment to verify the health of your components. You can use logic and deduce from the results what the likely problems are, if any.
Hope this information gives you something to chew on and play with. Good luck.
RADAR
Last edited:
equipment
Nfusion HD Nuvenio
CaptiveWorks CW-700S
36" Fortec Star Satellite Dish
Dreamstar FTA Linear Dual LNB
coax is identical to the stuff bell installed with their setup
I had both of these units receiving 97w until I tried to look at another sat.
had no luck with that so i pointed it back at 97 but couldn't get anything at all
Replace the lnb with a new one and set up the units as follows
Satellite = 97w
LNBF = standard
Freq = 10750
disqc = off
legacy = off
at one point i tried to access the bev system just to see what i could get and i did turn on the 22khz power with a disqc switch in the system.
two bev lnbs and one linear lnb hooked up
i think i blew the disqc switch doing this
now i have only the linear dual lnb, one for each receiver and the dish pointed at 97w again.
nfusion has "nf_hd_v1.3sR_25 (Maintenance release)" installed
Nfusion HD Nuvenio
CaptiveWorks CW-700S
36" Fortec Star Satellite Dish
Dreamstar FTA Linear Dual LNB
coax is identical to the stuff bell installed with their setup
I had both of these units receiving 97w until I tried to look at another sat.
had no luck with that so i pointed it back at 97 but couldn't get anything at all
Replace the lnb with a new one and set up the units as follows
Satellite = 97w
LNBF = standard
Freq = 10750
disqc = off
legacy = off
at one point i tried to access the bev system just to see what i could get and i did turn on the 22khz power with a disqc switch in the system.
two bev lnbs and one linear lnb hooked up
i think i blew the disqc switch doing this
now i have only the linear dual lnb, one for each receiver and the dish pointed at 97w again.
nfusion has "nf_hd_v1.3sR_25 (Maintenance release)" installed
signal
i have from 89 to 91 % on the signal from the lnbf depending on what tp i am selecting
with the coax disconnected it has about 30% showing
the first time i had it receiving 97 with all the channels it has about 82% on the signal
and about 80 on the quality
i have from 89 to 91 % on the signal from the lnbf depending on what tp i am selecting
with the coax disconnected it has about 30% showing
the first time i had it receiving 97 with all the channels it has about 82% on the signal
and about 80 on the quality
IceRoadMan,
In light of the information in your last two posts, I don't think there is anything wrong with your LNBF or receiver.
Troubleshoot your system by removing your external DiSEqC and all other external switches and route a cable directly between your receiver and the LNBF. Then work on realigning your dish antenna.
Don't worry about changing any of the switch settings within the receiver parameter menus. You can leave them as they were before the problem arose. If you remove the actual, physical (external) switch(es) then it doesn't matter what switch parameters you set up in the menus as there will be no switch to listen to the commands anyway, so they are simply ignored and won't interfere with any other operation.
However, if you have an LNBF that has an internal switch, you will have to ensure that these switch settings are properly set. You cannot remove or bypass those internal switches from that type of LNBF so you have to follow their rules (usually).
RADAR
In light of the information in your last two posts, I don't think there is anything wrong with your LNBF or receiver.
Troubleshoot your system by removing your external DiSEqC and all other external switches and route a cable directly between your receiver and the LNBF. Then work on realigning your dish antenna.
Don't worry about changing any of the switch settings within the receiver parameter menus. You can leave them as they were before the problem arose. If you remove the actual, physical (external) switch(es) then it doesn't matter what switch parameters you set up in the menus as there will be no switch to listen to the commands anyway, so they are simply ignored and won't interfere with any other operation.
However, if you have an LNBF that has an internal switch, you will have to ensure that these switch settings are properly set. You cannot remove or bypass those internal switches from that type of LNBF so you have to follow their rules (usually).
RADAR
DiSEqC switches are easily blown out by connecting or disconnecting coax on them while there is a receiver powering the line. The receiver can be in standby mode (or what we would normally think of as "OFF"), and this will still happen. Therefore, before removing or connecting coax from a DiSEqC switch, always either unplug any connected receivers or turn them completely off via the switch on the back of the unit.
thanks
thanks for the help guys, took the tv and receiver outside and hooked it all up to the dish on a 5' coax then did numerous adjustments to the dish but not quality.
the nfusion hd doesn't seem to have a setting in the software to turn the lnbf on or off so i take it that it is on by default.
is there anything in the software upgrade i may have screwed up?
thanks for the help guys, took the tv and receiver outside and hooked it all up to the dish on a 5' coax then did numerous adjustments to the dish but not quality.
the nfusion hd doesn't seem to have a setting in the software to turn the lnbf on or off so i take it that it is on by default.
is there anything in the software upgrade i may have screwed up?
Start at the beginning, what do you have entered in the Receiver's Sat Setup menu?
What is your Long and Lat?
What do you have the Dish Elevation set at?
What do you have the LNB Skew set at?
What is your Long and Lat?
What do you have the Dish Elevation set at?
What do you have the LNB Skew set at?
i'm pretty sure i have the dish pointed correctly, pretty much the same settings as i had it when it was receiving 97w
the box is set for 97 w, lnb is set to 10750 most other settings are off as i have no switches just straight to the lnb
i've scanned all the tp's, done a blind scan with not quality.
if i turn off the switch at the back with it set for 97w it will do about four or five beeps on the quality at about 80% then nothing.
the box is set for 97 w, lnb is set to 10750 most other settings are off as i have no switches just straight to the lnb
i've scanned all the tp's, done a blind scan with not quality.
if i turn off the switch at the back with it set for 97w it will do about four or five beeps on the quality at about 80% then nothing.
IceRoadMan,
I believe you are just off target with your dish alignment. Since the problem basically arose as a result of trying to reaim the dish for another sat to test. Now you are trying to go back to 97 W and aren't picking it up. You probably just don't have it aligned perfectly back to where you started.
Have you tried the other receiver (the CW-700S) out at the dish in the same manner that you were trying the NFusion?
I am not sure if the following is going to be helpful to you in this instance, but I will relay the information just in case:
Are you also setting the receiver up to look for a signal from one of the transponders that you KNOW that you were receiving before?
With my Coolsat 5000 receiver, I always use either the MOTORIZED SETUP or the MANUAL SCAN mode so that I can personally choose the transponder that I want to detect a signal from (this way I always know that I am looking at a good transponder with a strong signal). If I use the Coolsat's DISH SETTING menu, the Coolsat itself picks the first transponder in its list to monitor the signal levels. If you have any modes or menus in your two receivers that allow you to select the transponder yourself, use those menus so that you are certain what you are looking at.
Also, don't scan for anything until you get your dish realigned properly at the proper satellite. Hopefully, all the original 97 W channels are still in tact within your receiver. If you were to misalign your dish to 99 or 101 or some other sat and scan it as if it were 97 W, you will scan in a bunch of junk (really) and mess up your list of 97's channels. This is not a huge deal to correct with most receivers, but why put yourself through additional work that isn't necessary and wouldn't provide any beneficial results to begin with (you already have the channels logged in, so why rescan). Use those logged-in channels to your advantage to help confirm that you get back to proper alignment with 97 W.
I would continue experimenting with trying to realign the dish. Don't forget to set your LNBF polarization angle back to what it should be for 97W.
Good luck
RADAR
P.S. I am assuming that you are using a fixed point dish and not a motorized one. You didn't mention a motor. If this assumption is incorrect, let us know right away. There may be some alterations in how we analyze the problem and what we tell you.
I believe you are just off target with your dish alignment. Since the problem basically arose as a result of trying to reaim the dish for another sat to test. Now you are trying to go back to 97 W and aren't picking it up. You probably just don't have it aligned perfectly back to where you started.
Have you tried the other receiver (the CW-700S) out at the dish in the same manner that you were trying the NFusion?
I am not sure if the following is going to be helpful to you in this instance, but I will relay the information just in case:
Are you also setting the receiver up to look for a signal from one of the transponders that you KNOW that you were receiving before?
With my Coolsat 5000 receiver, I always use either the MOTORIZED SETUP or the MANUAL SCAN mode so that I can personally choose the transponder that I want to detect a signal from (this way I always know that I am looking at a good transponder with a strong signal). If I use the Coolsat's DISH SETTING menu, the Coolsat itself picks the first transponder in its list to monitor the signal levels. If you have any modes or menus in your two receivers that allow you to select the transponder yourself, use those menus so that you are certain what you are looking at.
Also, don't scan for anything until you get your dish realigned properly at the proper satellite. Hopefully, all the original 97 W channels are still in tact within your receiver. If you were to misalign your dish to 99 or 101 or some other sat and scan it as if it were 97 W, you will scan in a bunch of junk (really) and mess up your list of 97's channels. This is not a huge deal to correct with most receivers, but why put yourself through additional work that isn't necessary and wouldn't provide any beneficial results to begin with (you already have the channels logged in, so why rescan). Use those logged-in channels to your advantage to help confirm that you get back to proper alignment with 97 W.
I would continue experimenting with trying to realign the dish. Don't forget to set your LNBF polarization angle back to what it should be for 97W.
Good luck
RADAR
P.S. I am assuming that you are using a fixed point dish and not a motorized one. You didn't mention a motor. If this assumption is incorrect, let us know right away. There may be some alterations in how we analyze the problem and what we tell you.
thanks again.......
i have a fixed dish.
for the Nfusion HD i have also reinstalled the factory bin and then upgraded again to the newest bin file i could find. i have up to 99% signal strength depending on which TP i select.
on the CW700 i will get about 4 beeps from the quality if i turn the power off and on at the back of the receiver and then nothing. i am pretty sure i have the dish set to what it was when i first had it working and at that time it was pretty easy to find 97w
i have a fixed dish.
for the Nfusion HD i have also reinstalled the factory bin and then upgraded again to the newest bin file i could find. i have up to 99% signal strength depending on which TP i select.
on the CW700 i will get about 4 beeps from the quality if i turn the power off and on at the back of the receiver and then nothing. i am pretty sure i have the dish set to what it was when i first had it working and at that time it was pretty easy to find 97w
also is there some way to put the software back to the original state that the receiver came with, maybe i have screwed up the OS somehow.
Iceroad,
I am not certain, but I believe that there might be a "system clean" file available for the NFusion. I may be confusing the issue with some other receiver. I do know that there is some sort of file out there for this purpose, but what receiver make and model it applies to and where to find it would not be anything that I think I would be able to help with. I just wouldn't know where to start looking for this one. Sorry.
RADAR
No system clean file for this brand, I know the VS and SV have them.
ice, I would just work with 1 receiver at a time, either disconnect the NF or CW and try again. It does sound like your aiming is off...........how about replacing the Linear with the circular LNB, aim for B$V 91 first since it is easier to get? Tighten all nuts & bolts a bit once you get 91 to acceptable levels, change to the Linear LNB and move West 6 degrees to try for 97. Use TP 11898V 22000 3/4, don't forget to change LNB Freq. when switching Circular LNB to Linear and vice versa.
ice, I would just work with 1 receiver at a time, either disconnect the NF or CW and try again. It does sound like your aiming is off...........how about replacing the Linear with the circular LNB, aim for B$V 91 first since it is easier to get? Tighten all nuts & bolts a bit once you get 91 to acceptable levels, change to the Linear LNB and move West 6 degrees to try for 97. Use TP 11898V 22000 3/4, don't forget to change LNB Freq. when switching Circular LNB to Linear and vice versa.
i already have a B*V dish, dish network twin lnb's
can i just use any of the two coax coming from it
can i just use any of the two coax coming from it
You can use the coaxial cables from these dishes and apply the cable to your other system. These cables should be the same as required for FTA use. However, you cannot normally use the dishes or the LNBFs that are on the BEV or DN setups to get 97 W to come in. 97 W is a linear satellite and both BEV and DN are circular polarized and basically a totally different ball game.
The dish antennas might work in some areas, but are generally considered to be too small to amplify the signal sufficiently. The linear satellites that provide most of the FTA signals have lower transmission power and are harder to lock, so a larger dish is ordinarily required.
My statements above are a bit loose. Some people have used these dishes to obtain the lower power linear FTA sats with good results. Also, not all the DN and other providers' LNBFs are circular, there are some which are linear (the old DN SuperDish genre for 105W and 121W would be examples) and these LNBFs can be used as well, with some effort and ingenuity.
I personally don't like to get into the adaptation of DN or BEV or other provider's equipment for FTA use as their equipment is usually "power hungry" devices that many FTA recievers cannot accomodate very well.
You are much better off if you utilize the equipment for the purpose that it was designed in most cases, unless you are just out to experiment and do a DIY project, just for fun.
RADAR
thank u very much guys. i guess the first time i connected to 97w i must have been lucky cause to find it again was pretty tricky, just a hair one way or the other and no signal.
but i have it back again so, again, thank you to all u guys who tutored me.
but i have it back again so, again, thank you to all u guys who tutored me.
IceRoadMan,
I don't know how much that I helped you, but from everyone... You are welcome.
You will find that the more you experiment with alinging your dish antenna to other sats, it will become much easier. You kinda develop a "calibrated" eye and a sense for where to aim at the sat as you go along.
I guarantee that those little signal meters are highly over-rated. If you set up enough dishes, you will eventually get to the point where you can just look into the sky and say to yourself, I need to aim my dish there, and you will be right or damned close. Trust me, if you have even just a fair sense of direction, you will be able to let someone blindfold you and spin you around and still be able to set up a dish with reasonable accuracy.
The talent comes with practice. Lots of practice.
Have fun and enjoy the hobby!
RADAR
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