Is anyones HD locals even close to OTA?

[mike1002]

The Houston channels are all very good EXCEPT Channel 13 KTRK ABC. IT continues to have audio drop outs 1 -3 every hour

I have had the audio dropouts on KTRK since my 811 days OTA. I don't have the HD LiL with dish. I believe it is a problem with the signal KTRK is sending out. My 622 does the same thing. If it doesn't happen on other recievers then it is some sort of incompatibility with the Dish receivers (or, horrors, Dish has managed to mung up 2 models the same way). I have been very happy with my VIP622 but when I heard the audio dropout was still there my eyes just rolled.
I, too, would like to get the HD LiL for catching 2 or more local channels on at the same time.

 

[HDTVFanAtic]

E* doesn't offer HDLiL to my location, but I have a hard time believing that once E* mashes several Mbps out of the image that it could look almost exactly the same.

I know that my OTA HD locals are significantly sharper than any HD channel I get from E*, with the sometimes exception of ESPN HD and the rare exception of HBO HD.

If people are saying that E*'s HD locals are as good as their OTA HD channels, then those HD locals must be better than all of the other E* HD channels. Well, except for the HD Demo channel, which is superb.

They don't look as good - but as you are well aware - anything better than 480the majority of viewers (and posters) think its great.

Unfortunately this is why E* and D* know they can downrez when people cannot tell the difference - all it takes is something better than 480.

 

[bub]

Nashville locals via DN HD suck rocks!

I'm in the Nashville market and the local HD channels via Dish Network suck! And, I mean they suck bad.

Sports is completely unwatchable, pixelation is horrible during pans (it is so bad that even pans during normal non-sports programming is horrible). Even a stationary target like the grass of the playing field, even when the camera is static, shows compression artifacts that shift and twitch.

I'm getting pretty bent out of shape about it. I only get a couple of OTA channels where I'm at so need the network HD from Dish Network to fill out my network channel listing.

A joke, a complete joke.

George -bub
VIP622

 

[BuddyBoy]

Here in San Francisco the Dish HD locals are almost as good as OTA. There is a slight decrease in overall sharpness on the channels received from Dish, but it's not enough to be objectionable at all. On a scale of 1 to 10 with 10 being best, OTA is a 10, Dish HD locals a 9.

Ugh. Right now the Saints-Bears game on Fox (KTVU channel 2 in SF Bay Area) is about a 4 from Dish and unwatchable. OTA is fine. It is truly the worst quality I've ever seen since I've had HD locals from Dish.

Update: Flipped back to KTVU-DT from Dish at halftime, they've fixed their problem and I'd say it's around an 8.5 if OTA is a 10.

 

[AVITWeb]

Here is NE Phila PA 19154 you can barely tell the difference between the two. OTA is a bit clearer but I think most people could not tell the difference.

Jay

Just cruising, but Jay...thats good to know...I am in Trenton, and am upgrading and the locals were starting to worry me because my SD locals are quite crappy now...I can only imagine what they will look like 15" larger.

 

[jayiw]

Just cruising, but Jay...thats good to know...I am in Trenton, and am upgrading and the locals were starting to worry me because my SD locals are quite crappy now...I can only imagine what they will look like 15" larger.

My HD TV is a large screen 55". With SD the locals are pretty bad, and certain channels are horrible, not only locals. The larger the TV, the more high res the TV, the more apparent the bad quality is, especially when you have to stretch and zoom.

Jay

 

[kennya]

I wish they had my locals in HD (Tulsa). Heck, I can't pick them up on an OTA either....

 

[LineNoise]

I subscribed to local dish HD channels back in March 2006. I had it for few months and since they were dramatically worse than channels from comcast, I stopped paying for them. Now, starting in Jan 2007 I subscribed again, and I noticed that
the pictures seems to be much better - much closer to what I get from comcast.
Note the quality is still slightly worse than cable signal, but it's seems way better than in March of 2006.
This is locals from Chicago (CBS, NBC, ABC, FOX) Note I was comparing CBS and NBC only. Now a question - did they really improve or my eyes are going? Did they switch to mpeg4 sometime last year? Do they use a better compression codec? Better bitrate?
Note I'm using Vip622, DishHD 1000

Note: it depends also on what size your TV is, my is a mid size HDTV - 42 Inch sony LCD projection... I bet you on a 30 inch HDTV set it would be very hard to see a difference between comcast and Dish HD locals.

I am newb with HD, i've only had it since the day after thanksgiving.

The locals through dish are terrible compared to comcast. Although, I feel that the Network HD channels (9420, Etc.) are better than Comcast's.

Oh well, can't beat the price. Just need to figure out how to get a HD DVR now.

 

[destrada]

I was at my sister's house in Houston. I put a set of rabbit ears on to compare OTA and Dish local. It was not very noticable at all. Would give OTA a 10 and Dish a 9.5. Watching a 50" plasma from about 12 feet it wasn't noticable at all.

 

[MikeD-C05]

But did you see any of the green screen pixelations on ABC channel 13 Ktrk? This one channel is STILL breaking up during primetime shows and experiencing audio drop outs about 1-4 every hour. I wonder how the new mpeg 4 encoders will come into play in regards to the ota hd locals? Hopefully the new encoders will do these channels in better resolution withOUT technical flaws.

 

[HDTVFanAtic]

I obviously have not seen the exact green screen screen pixelations you are speaking of, but they are most likely the green grid bug that is in the microcode of the basic chip which occurs with errors.

It's in the microcode of the chip that is in virtually everything and will most likely never be fixed.

 

[MikeD-C05]

The lone channel in the 4 networks I get in hd from Dish that is constantly having problems is the ABC station. I can not tell if this is a ota problem as well becuase I "moved" to Houston . I have sent many many many emails to the dishquality folks and they say be patient it is new technology etc etc. They tweak it and for a while it works fine but then it goes right back to sh*t. The Fox hd station in Houston which is 720p looks fine with NO breakups at all, so I don't understand why the ABC station in 720p looks like this. When they first turned them on last May the ABC station looked fine but it is now constantly breaking up and green screening and audio warbling to the point that I have now switched all my recordings to the ota ABC station in Beaumont which doesnot have hd yet. The picture is constant and no break ups but it is in 480i .

 

[destrada]

But did you see any of the green screen pixelations on ABC channel 13 Ktrk? This one channel is STILL breaking up during primetime shows and experiencing audio drop outs about 1-4 every hour. I wonder how the new mpeg 4 encoders will come into play in regards to the ota hd locals? Hopefully the new encoders will do these channels in better resolution withOUT technical flaws.

I didn't watch that channel enough to notice, sorry. I mainly watched Fox and CBS.

 

[PowerMax]

I picked up HD locals so I could record stuff we watch off of two different channels.

The PQ is terrible. I know people complain about other channels but they are bi far the worse I've seen.

I flipped back and forth today on the Chargers/Patriots game and its not even close to be decent.

Anyone else?

I know that I should have read all the other posts but nobody's HDLILs are as clean as their OTA unless their OTA is split into like 3 sub-channels. It is a simple matter of bitrate and compression. Most local affiliates are full bitrate and uncompressed.

My personal experience, I record local OTA wherever I can on my 622. Primetime network lineup is pristine for all of the big 4.

 

[Dishlover]

I was at my sister's house in Houston. I put a set of rabbit ears on to compare OTA and Dish local. It was not very noticable at all. Would give OTA a 10 and Dish a 9.5. Watching a 50" plasma from about 12 feet it wasn't noticable at all.

I take it that isn't a 1080p plasma. 12 feet???

 

[sprintcarcrazy]

Kansas City HD locals are verry close to OTA, just about a 6 second delay though !

 

[bkushner]

Just the other day I was doing an A/B test of my OTA and Dish local signal and after about 10 minutes I could not see any difference. Granted I'm no expert but I do have a decent Pioneer 61" ProHD panel.

Brian

PS My locals are Philly.

 

[bobinchico]

I have a 50" Panasonic Plasma and at 14 feet if there is any difference it is so small I don't think I could tell any difference if I didn't know what input I was watching here in Chico - NoCal

 

[NOHDjunkie]

why on earth would anyone watch a 50" from 12+ feet?

My Bedroom 50" is at 7'

I watch my 100" at 10'

Rule of thumb for optimal distance is 3x screen height.

50" is 25" tall

3x25=75"

6.25' for a 50" HDTV

It's much more immersive.

 

[Eric_C]

CBS Football is a great thing to watch.

SAT is not even close to OTA.

The rain is wreaking havoc with the compression on sat. Dare I say...mosquito noise!

I think its in the encoder and rain causing problems. The commercials are closer in quality but still very very soft. The close ups in the game look terrible but the panning shots look better, but still soft.

Even OTA I don't see the rain in the panning shots.

BTW, OTA differs too. OTA out of Detroit looks great. Out of Lansing I get way more pixelation although they both have comparable signals. Detroit always looks better than Lansing.

I'm about 11' away from our 1080p DLP in normal seating position and as typing this sitting on the floor about 8'.