Installer Refused Install Due To No Ground Available

[TheTechGuru]

Family member bought a condo, it's part of a 4 unit building and it's the 2nd unit in and the electrical boxes are way on the end.

Family member wants it on their own roof with a simple single line though their own wall to tv.

Well since the electrical is on the end of the building there is no ground available. They didn't specify but I assume the installer was MasTec crap.

What to do? I really can't drive all the way to them to install it for them, plus how would they get a free dish from DirecTV for me to install for them?

 

[raoul5788]

You don't often hear of an installer refusing to do an install due to no ground.

 

[Hutch1814]

Technically, the installer is in the right. We've been given the guideline of "if it can't be 100% up to code, we don't install it". However, I'd call back in. We see this every now and then and we end up getting the work order signed off on and given the green light to install it

 

[TheTechGuru]

You don't often hear of an installer refusing to do an install due to no ground.

Must have been a real lazy ass.

They've called DirecTV Movers connection again and have requested them send a private contractor not robot brain Mastec crap.

 

[Jimbo]

Must have been a real lazy ass.

They've called DirecTV Movers connection again and have requested them send a private contractor not robot brain Mastec crap.

I don't think D* uses Private Contractors.

A Private Contractor would have to be on thier dime I believe.

 

[Joe Diamond]

See if an in house installer will do it.
The HSPs encourage new guys to git''er done.....make a good impression....make big bucks...........Then back charge them months later for failure to ground the system per spec. DirecTV gets a customer. They pay the HSP (home service provider). The HSP does not pay the tech for any of the installation...no time / no materials. After a few of these the tech quits. They get another one.

OR the wise tech just refuses the work that will never be paid. AND yes, there are other ways to run a business...this model eats its young.

Joe

 

[TheTechGuru]

See if an in house installer will do it.
The HSPs encourage new guys to git''er done.....make a good impression....make big bucks...........Then back charge them months later for failure to ground the system per spec. DirecTV gets a customer. They pay the HSP (home service provider). The HSP does not pay the tech for any of the installation...no time / no materials. After a few of these the tech quits. They get another one.

OR the wise tech just refuses the work that will never be paid. AND yes, there are other ways to run a business...this model eats its young.

Joe

I thought MasTec was AKA DirecTV's in-house? By private contractor I mean independent dealer that uses their own pick up truck. I know they exist because there are ads on CL of those kind hiring.

 

[Jimbo]

I thought MasTec was AKA DirecTV's in-house? By private contractor I mean independent dealer that uses their own pick up truck. I know they exist because there are ads on CL of those kind hiring.

Sorry, by Private Contractor I thought you meant getting a Non D* company to do the install ... yellow pages type thing, there are usually some in most cities, some very good.

 

[LER]

why didn't the installer just go get a copper rod from Home Depot or Lowe's? That's what I did for mine when he couldn't reach the BreakerBox.

 

[Jimbo]

why didn't the installer just go get a copper rod from Home Depot or Lowe's? That's what I did for mine when he couldn't reach the BreakerBox.

I think according to thier rules you have to tie to the house ground ... I do not know if there are exceptions to the rule though.

I too am using a ground rod other than the house ground as the house ground is not reachable.

 

[T134]

I think according to thier rules you have to tie to the house ground ... I do not know if there are exceptions to the rule though.

I too am using a ground rod other than the house ground as the house ground is not reachable.

Using a second ground rod can cause a ground loop and damage your equipment. When I did this for one of the companies everything had to be up to code. I often got stuck going to clean up messes of other installers that didn't ground and got caught by QA.

I'd have to say the installer was in the right if the customer didn't want wiring ran around to the proper ground point.

 

[TheTechGuru]

Using a second ground rod can cause a ground loop and damage your equipment. When I did this for one of the companies everything had to be up to code. I often got stuck going to clean up messes of other installers that didn't ground and got caught by QA.

I'd have to say the installer was in the right if the customer didn't want wiring ran around to the proper ground point.

It's not a matter of not wanting, it's a matter that it is not possible without trespassing across another condo owner's roof or wall or eave.

If it needs to be grounded to the house wiring so bad install a ground block behind the TV connected to the ground prong of the outlet. Wait, don't the receiver already do this internally? I'm gonna do a outer F connector to ground prong continuity test on one of my receivers.

 

[Kraven]

The installer did the right thing....especially in a multi unit building.


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[TheTechGuru]

The installer did the right thing....especially in a multi unit building.


Posted Via The FREE SatelliteGuys Reader App!

I can't count the number of apartments and dishes even on houses that I've seen that are not grounded.

If it were me, I'd just wire up a ground wire directly to the interior breaker panel and out to the ground block.

So basically a electrician needs to be hired to do the install.

 

[Jimbo]

Using a second ground rod can cause a ground loop and damage your equipment. When I did this for one of the companies everything had to be up to code. I often got stuck going to clean up messes of other installers that didn't ground and got caught by QA.

I'd have to say the installer was in the right if the customer didn't want wiring ran around to the proper ground point.

if you only used a Ground rod, you would not have a ground loop.

 

[TheTechGuru]

if you only used a Ground rod, you would not have a ground loop.

Ya I believe you are correct because I just realized the newer receiver models no longer have ground prongs on their cords. So they now rely on the coax for ground.

 

[dishcomm]

You don't often hear of an installer refusing to do an install due to no ground.

Ya know. Each individual shop has their own rules regarding grounding of systems.
Heck, ours changed as much as I changed my socks.
We were a Dish contractor. So we took our marching orders from Dish. For a period of time, we were told Dish waived the grounding rule for apartments. Then they told us "must ground"...Then so many apt installs were going undone, they waived it again. Then there were the new matrix for the QAS.. We were getting busted for not grounding even though we were told "get them done even if we could not ground"....Then it was "Ok use your best judgement"...Which meant, "if you don't ground and something bad happens as a result, it's on you." So techs started refusing Apt jobs where a ground was not available.
Do you see where this is going?

 

[dishcomm]

Must have been a real lazy ass.

They've called DirecTV Movers connection again and have requested them send a private contractor not robot brain Mastec crap.

I'd do them if the customer signed their life away. If it was a rental unit or an apartment, I would make the manager or their agent sign their life away. If they refused, the job was a no go.
I am not sticking my neck out and exposing myself to a lawsuit so someone can watch tv....No way

 

[TheTechGuru]

The thing is, the way MasTech wishes to ground (to electric meter box) IS NOT the only safe way to ground, it's just the only way they're technically qualified to do.

It can be grounded to any electrical outlet or to the inside breaker panel and would serve the same function.

Back when I had HughesNet there was no ground available and the installer grounded it to my metal roof which was grounded as metal roofs usually are and should be.

Something like these should work fine:

 

[dishcomm]

why didn't the installer just go get a copper rod from Home Depot or Lowe's? That's what I did for mine when he couldn't reach the BreakerBox.

That sets up a separate field. Not good.
I found this on another forum..
When you say "in place of", if you mean "in stead of", the answer is "NO"! It may work for a while under perfect situations, but you will find times when your electrical equipment will not work properly,and most important, it is dangerous. This could cause equipment damage, electric shock, or death.

The role of the neutral conductor is three fold:

(1) the neutral carries the difference or balance of current between the two hot legs. For example, if leg A has 50 amps, and leg B has 40 amps, then the neutral will have 10 amps.

(2) the neutral conductor is bonded to the earth or ground at the source only for personal protection purposes and in case of lightning strikes.

(3) the neutral conductor keeps the voltage of all 120 volt circuits steady. The ground rod only will have a resistance that will vary with ground moisture, dryness, etc. Some lights will get dim while other lights will get bright. Some incandescent light bulbs will "blow". Some electric motors will slow down while others will get faster. Because voltages will get low and then high, all electric appliances rated at 110 or 120 will be damaged eventually.

If you try to use the ground rod only without a neutral conductor from main panel to power source, then all neutral current will seek for a path back to the source through the earth and every other source it can find. You will begin to receive shocks around the house. Sometimes it may be slight tingles while other times it may be severe.
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20130914073527AApSHje