If ever there was a reason to be mad at big business
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I read the article. Why should I be mad at "big business"?
There were several valid reasons listed why the vehicles aren't sold in the US, none of which made me mad.
It's just plain business. You don't build or sell something if you don't think you could make a profit on it, which Ford feels they can't.
Perhaps if Ford gets one of these loans....
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/5988292.html
There were several valid reasons listed why the vehicles aren't sold in the US, none of which made me mad.
It's just plain business. You don't build or sell something if you don't think you could make a profit on it, which Ford feels they can't.
Perhaps if Ford gets one of these loans....
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/5988292.html
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Its not the first story like this that I've heard about over the last few years but the article states that they'r burning through their savings so why not build a plant here or rather retool one of the plants that they mothballed and reinvest in the country and people that made them big? There's a definite market here yet they'r throwing out a lame excuse that Americans have no interest in a diesel vehicle yet all you have to do to see its bogus is look at the price of diesels vehicles like VW's to see that there is a definite interest.
I expect there is another piece of the puzzle that the press isn't mentioning. Ford has lost their shirt on every vehicle the have imported from their european operations. That includes Cortina, Capri, Merkur (Sierra and Granada, brought in as XR4Ti and Scorpio), Fiesta and Festiva.
I've owned 2 Capris and an XR4Ti out of this bunch and found them to be sporty cars that could run head to head with much more expensive BMWs, Saabs and Toyotas of their day.
The downfall was that they were serviced by Ford/Mercury dealers that didn't understand them. Further, Ford kept obsoleting the parts after 3-5 years. This pretty much guaranteed a reputation for unreliable cars and poor resale values. Those last year of Merkur sales, you could buy a new one for 80% of sticker or less (I bought an 87 factory exec car in '88, with 6k miles and a sticker of $26k for $12.5k)
They were good cars. Those Capris of the '70s were some of the few sport sedans available in a period of boring sedans. It was that, Datsun 510s or Celicas.
My Merkur was good enough to help me take second for the season in SCCA national rally competition in 1989. However, to be effective, you needed to know how to import parts from europe, where to find the few specialists (Rapido), and to either do your own maintenance or be able to find a european car specialist who was willing to work on lowly Fords (not easy).
I would bet that this is the biggest stumbling block Ford has. The only diesel these mechanics know is the one that goes into F250s. The lightweight chassis and suspension is totally foreign to them. Ask me sometime about the time I caught the Ford dealer trying to hammer a strut into place with a sledge! I would say that lack of experience, and lack of enthusiasm by dealers, especially service departments would be enough to kill it.
I've owned 2 Capris and an XR4Ti out of this bunch and found them to be sporty cars that could run head to head with much more expensive BMWs, Saabs and Toyotas of their day.
The downfall was that they were serviced by Ford/Mercury dealers that didn't understand them. Further, Ford kept obsoleting the parts after 3-5 years. This pretty much guaranteed a reputation for unreliable cars and poor resale values. Those last year of Merkur sales, you could buy a new one for 80% of sticker or less (I bought an 87 factory exec car in '88, with 6k miles and a sticker of $26k for $12.5k)
They were good cars. Those Capris of the '70s were some of the few sport sedans available in a period of boring sedans. It was that, Datsun 510s or Celicas.
My Merkur was good enough to help me take second for the season in SCCA national rally competition in 1989. However, to be effective, you needed to know how to import parts from europe, where to find the few specialists (Rapido), and to either do your own maintenance or be able to find a european car specialist who was willing to work on lowly Fords (not easy).
I would bet that this is the biggest stumbling block Ford has. The only diesel these mechanics know is the one that goes into F250s. The lightweight chassis and suspension is totally foreign to them. Ask me sometime about the time I caught the Ford dealer trying to hammer a strut into place with a sledge! I would say that lack of experience, and lack of enthusiasm by dealers, especially service departments would be enough to kill it.
gotta love business.. yeah the price of diesel is out of control here in florida.. about a buck higher than gas (when gas was around 4.50 a gal).. I always blamed the boat population in florida for keeping prices high, now I know the taxes could also be causing this... nice.. how the gov taxes crap really needs to be looked at for stiffling advancements..
Diesel, kerosene and home heating oil are very similar products. Most refineries shut down twice a year to retool the mix between gasoline and these fuels. It is actually easier to make diesel than gasoline. But demand and what the market will bear are the prime price drivers.
I am very happy with my diesel Jetta, my diesel Dodge Ram 3500, and all the diesel trucks at work, except for the Ford 6.0L diesels. Avoid them. In fact, after a few go-rounds with Ford over their diesels, trannys and fuel systems, we simply don't buy Ford trucks any more. The Chevy and Dodge diesels are working fine for us. With the new clean diesels and ultra low sulfur fuel, you can have a diesel that pollutes less than a gasser. And the resale value of the diesels is far higher than the gassers. Over all, the diesels have been cost effective for us and we generally don't buy gasoline trucks any more.
About half of vehicles on the road in Europe are diesels, and that percentage continues to grow. (Yes, I know a lot of this is in the article in post #1.) And it will continue to grow in this county too, as those of us that remember the Oldsmobile diesels from the 80s die off. Part of the delay in adopting diesels in the US has been that the Europeans gave diesels a break on pollution controls, in order to get the higher mpg.
I'd still be hesitant to buy a Ford diesel after our experiences at work. But there are other diesel engines they could put in their vehicles. But I'd be just as happy to see other brands of diesels eat Ford's lunch. Short sightedness has probably doomed the US auto industry, even with the bailout mentioned in a link above.
I am very happy with my diesel Jetta, my diesel Dodge Ram 3500, and all the diesel trucks at work, except for the Ford 6.0L diesels. Avoid them. In fact, after a few go-rounds with Ford over their diesels, trannys and fuel systems, we simply don't buy Ford trucks any more. The Chevy and Dodge diesels are working fine for us. With the new clean diesels and ultra low sulfur fuel, you can have a diesel that pollutes less than a gasser. And the resale value of the diesels is far higher than the gassers. Over all, the diesels have been cost effective for us and we generally don't buy gasoline trucks any more.
About half of vehicles on the road in Europe are diesels, and that percentage continues to grow. (Yes, I know a lot of this is in the article in post #1.) And it will continue to grow in this county too, as those of us that remember the Oldsmobile diesels from the 80s die off. Part of the delay in adopting diesels in the US has been that the Europeans gave diesels a break on pollution controls, in order to get the higher mpg.
I'd still be hesitant to buy a Ford diesel after our experiences at work. But there are other diesel engines they could put in their vehicles. But I'd be just as happy to see other brands of diesels eat Ford's lunch. Short sightedness has probably doomed the US auto industry, even with the bailout mentioned in a link above.
But Ford's reputation in europe is as good there as it is bad here. They have a reputation for reliable and easily serviced vehicles. Major manufacturing in GB and Germany.
I am confused; isn't the "petroleum distillate" version of diesel actually a by-product of the crude-petroleum fuel refining process; NOT a separate total process? I don't think diesel is easier to produce; in fact I think one process must happen before the other one can.
Now I disagree with that. Both Mercedes and VW seem to own the European market with regards to diesel cars but very few of those seem to make it, much less survive/thrive in the American market. Like it or not, us Americans seem have a HUUUUUUUUGE stigma to diesel powered cars; some rightly deserving those critiques (Oldsmobile of the early 80's anyone?).
On a somewhat related note, if you really get enthused (or is it bored...?) check out the Australian products offered by both GM/Holden and Ford. Not only are those vehicles a hell of a lot better looking IMO, but their performance specs completely blow out their American counterparts.
A by-product is something you get while trying to get something else. Gasoline was a by-product until they found a use for it. IOW, it's in the eye of the beholder.
Refineries "distill" "crack" or whatever to produce various products. There is some leeway in how much of each product you get, depending upon how far you take something thru the process, the original oil (light sweet vs venezuelan heavy, etc), and other factors. One process, tweaked to get different outputs in different amounts. Diesel is a less refined product. One of many that come out of the process. No one can take a barrel of oil and turn it all into just one petroleum product.
To be fair, let us remember that cars overseas tend to be smaller, and often do not have as stringent pollution control requirements.
Cruise through ebay for a while and look over the sales of the compact 70's and 80's diesel powered vehicles, one of the auctions for an 82 vw diesel rabbit was up to $5k and it wasnt anything special to look at. There have been handfuls of news stories on local and national news stations about people turning to diesel powered vehicles and to the hobby of creating waste oil into fuel, its repeated time and time again in magazines ranging from Mother Earth News and Grit to Popular Mechanics and auto enthusiast pubs.
I've seen the offerings in Europe and Australia and othe places that outperform our vehicles in performance and economy and looks but the stigma of the 80's olds is something from the past and if anyones hanging on to something thats nearly 30 years old then they're best left to sit on the front porch playin checkers and talking about how they used to walk 10 miles to school barefoot.
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