Hopper and Joey malfunction every day, spontaneous reboots and screen blanks

[HipKat]

I actually thought a surge suppressor was better than an extension cord! I was always cautioned that, in general, an extension cord is not desirable unless there is absolutely no choice, so I try to use them very sparingly. And I also don't see a reason for a non-technical customer like me to question why Dish put a big red label on the Hopper cord that recommends using a surge suppressor. I understand that technological or electrical experts might understand the issues differently but I expect that the system should work when I have set it up according to the provider's recommendations.

The Belkin is plugged into the wall. The cord on the Belkin is a few feet longer than the Hopper cord. It is long enough to reach the wall outlet. The only way to plug the Hopper in directly would be if it would be placed on the floor next to the couch. That works for a brief experiment but it is not a long-term solution.

The only other thing plugged into the surge suppressor is a 32" TCL TV.

I don't know why I should be suspicious about the surge suppressor or how to figure out if there is a reason to be suspicious about it. I bought it from Amazon, plugged it in, turned it on, saw the green light, it works, hallelujah. Never observed a problem. Asked the tech if it was the appropriate strength for the Hopper, he said it was fine. Why should I suddenly suspect that the surge suppressor is the source of all the problems? Why, for example, would it affect the satellite signal itself, which shows the same malfunction every morning on the Dish status page?

As to the Tuner 3 issue, I hope you are right. To me it is really meaningless unless it is a part of the overall problem. I will try the experiment you suggested as soon as I figure out how to record two channels? I don't usually use the DVR. I thought you could only record one channel at a time. I will try to figure that out.

I got the Hopper with Sling because I asked for a setup that would let me use Dish Anywhere when I am not at home. If everything else would work properly, I would never have even known what a tuner is. Actually, I still don't. I just know there are 3 tuners in the system.

The red tag is there the same way the do not remove tag is on mattresses. Actually, Dish is talking about removing the tags. ( I DID get good feedback on making the plug itself red so we can still differentiate which is the receiver plug in a surge protector, etc)

As for what Bobby said about the tuner 3 showing ,I have to disagree. I've never seen Tuner 3 showing all the Main Networks if no TV was tuned to one of the those channels. I've only seen it say Available, if no Network Channel was tuned to. I'm not saying it can't happen, just that I've never seen it

The 0 of 0 Tuners issue on Joeys IS a software issue that Dish announced on the last upgrade that they were addressing, but possibly, it wasn't fixed after all (Not unusual for software patches to not work).

I still say the problem is either your electric - a hot ground or reverse polarity possibly, a grounding issue, a surge protector issue OR in MY opinion the Hopper itself or the LNBF. If the LNB is losing signal, and the Hopper is not getting signal, they do reboot at times. The last tech may not know how to use his meter to check for LNB Drift, for example. Regardless, the cause are being eliminated 1 by 1 and only a few things are left. You've come this far, I would have the next tech remove any ground attached to the Hub or ground block, replace the LNBF, ensure that any unused Client ports on the solo hub are terminated and possibly replace the Hopper itself

 

[HipKat]

Another thing just popped into my brain. Which Belkin Suppressor are you using? Do you have your satellite incoming coax going through it? There are suppressors out there that allow for that. It is not recommended to attach your satellite to a suppressor. Just another base to touch.

Good point! I would hope the last tech would have seen that and bypassed the coax pass through on the surge protector

 

[falconress]

The Dish rep who remotely enabled Prime Time Anytime earlier this week wrote me:
"The prime time anytime being turned on is exactly what I did when I was logged into your box during our call. I know you just turned it off again but if you want the morning error messages to stop I know turning prime time anytime back on should and will fix that issue from occurring. "


I am paying a higher cost for the Hopper With Sling because it has three tuners, but now they are saying that the system won't work unless one of those tuners is unavailable because it must be dedicated to Prime Time Anytime. Not acceptable.

As to whether turning on Prime Time Anytime will indeed solve the daily malfunctioning - which happened again, exactly on schedule, this morning, I'll test it out tonight.

It's not just during "prime time" hours. Tuner 3 is now always in use by the four nat'l networks. Sometimes, it says "watching" next to one of them. Needless to say, we're not watching.



I've read everyone's thoughtful advice about the surge protector, etc., but since this message came out of left field and seems to point in a whole other direction, I will try his suggestion first.

 

[ekilgus]

I have always had that prime time turned off in my HWS and have all three tuners available, and i never had the problems with this being off that the Dish rep alluded to. Give my suggestion of getting a UPS a try, I think it just might solve your problems.

 

[Bobby]

View attachment 139632

As for what Bobby said about the tuner 3 showing ,I have to disagree. I've never seen Tuner 3 showing all the Main Networks if no TV was tuned to one of the those channels. I've only seen it say Available, if no Network Channel was tuned to. I'm not saying it can't happen, just that I've never seen it

I have seen this since day one of the Hopper PTAT on both Hopper 1 and 3. Mind you they are not doing anything and they are not in use and will go away if you tie up all of the tuners otherwise whether it be 16 tuners or 3. I note that falconcress is showing the same thing on her 3 tuner HWS. I see this whether PTAT is enabled or not.

 

[Bobby]

It's not just during "prime time" hours. Tuner 3 is now always in use by the four nat'l networks. Sometimes, it says "watching" next to one of them. Needless to say, we're not watching.

I'm curious, when it says "watching," where does it say watching from? There is a location immediately to the right of where it says watching. Could it be that one of your Joeys is not in standby and was watching one of network channels? Just because the TV is off doesn't necessarily mean that the Joey is also turned off. When you might see that again and it shows watching from a Joey location, go to that location and see if the green power light is still on. There will be a 5 minute time after powering down with the 54 remote that the Joey, or Hopper, will remain on. After that 5 minute period the Receiver will go into standby.

 

[HipKat]

The Dish rep who remotely enabled Prime Time Anytime earlier this week wrote me:
"The prime time anytime being turned on is exactly what I did when I was logged into your box during our call. I know you just turned it off again but if you want the morning error messages to stop I know turning prime time anytime back on should and will fix that issue from occurring. "


I am paying a higher cost for the Hopper With Sling because it has three tuners, but now they are saying that the system won't work unless one of those tuners is unavailable because it must be dedicated to Prime Time Anytime. Not acceptable.

As to whether turning on Prime Time Anytime will indeed solve the daily malfunctioning - which happened again, exactly on schedule, this morning, I'll test it out tonight.

It's not just during "prime time" hours. Tuner 3 is now always in use by the four nat'l networks. Sometimes, it says "watching" next to one of them. Needless to say, we're not watching.

View attachment 139631

I've read everyone's thoughtful advice about the surge protector, etc., but since this message came out of left field and seems to point in a whole other direction, I will try his suggestion first.

I know this sounds harsh, but these CSR's are notorious for making things up. He is dead on wrong. 100%, no question. That is total BS is what it is. I have NEVER used PTAT and never seen that issue. I'm this close to accusing him outright lying to you

 

[HipKat]

View attachment 139632

I have seen this since day one of the Hopper PTAT on both Hopper 1 and 3. Mind you they are not doing anything and they are not in use and will go away if you tie up all of the tuners otherwise whether it be 16 tuners or 3. I note that falconcress is showing the same thing on her 3 tuner HWS. I see this whether PTAT is enabled or not.

View attachment 139633

I don't know why yours is doing that, but this is mine taken just now:

 

[falconress]

I'm curious, when it says "watching," where does it say watching from? There is a location immediately to the right of where it says watching. Could it be that one of your Joeys is not in standby and was watching one of network channels? Just because the TV is off doesn't necessarily mean that the Joey is also turned off. When you might see that again and it shows watching from a Joey location, go to that location and see if the green power light is still on. There will be a 5 minute time after powering down with the 54 remote that the Joey, or Hopper, will remain on. After that 5 minute period the Receiver will go into standby.

It says watching from Living Room 1. Tuner 1 says the same. We were actually watching Tuner 1. No one was watching CBS. The TV with the Joey was turned off several hours prior. There was no recording going on, no timer scheduled, DVR empty, only the green light was lit on the Hopper (not the red DVR light), and PTAT was off.


The next morning, same thing. Tuner 3 and Tuner 1 both watched, simultaneously, by Living Room 1. We were actually watching Tuner 1. No one was watching CBS, there was no recording, PTAT off, the Joey TV was turned off, etc.



I am actually very encouraged that Dish reached out to me. First, they are on the ball, because this team somehow found me. It was the day after I posted here the first time. Maybe that's just coincidence. Maybe it's because I called the telephone tech support so often. But I like that they are so pro-active. I actually like almost everything about Dish. I like the channel package I have for the price, the remote, the support and tech people are nice, and now we see that they have teams actively working on more difficult problems.

I'm also relieved that they knew all about the malfunction, and exactly when and how it occurs. This is clearly an issue they have identified even if it is rare. I can stop obssessively taking photos of every diagnostic screen every morning at 5:00 AM. They already know what and why it happens. Their solution - allow PTAT recording - seems odd, but if it works, it's a good sign. At least we can progress toward a reasonable solution. I want to have the tuners available, and I don't want to record Prime Time every night, but at least knowing the details is a start.

The mystery of the malfunction was causing me a lot of anxiety. I take very seriously the recommendations about the electrical power, and I was starting to worry what kind of major problems my home might have that aren't visible. Especially because the Dish tech, who actually saw it, said that the setup is fine. But at the moment, it seems like in this particular situation there might be a specific, known, and unrelated reason for the problem. So it is a relief.

I will still keep in mind the issues that everyone mentioned about grounding, etc., but am less anxious about it for the moment.

Re the surge protector:
It is a Belkin 8-Outlet Power Surge. Protector, Specs: 3550 Joule-energy rating / 6,000v maximum spike voltage / AC 15A, 125V, 1875W. It is less than 6 months old.
The coax cables do not go through the surge protector. They run from outside into the house and are directly connected to the Joey and the Hopper.
The only other item plugged into the surge protector is the TV, a 32" . On a practical level, the surge protector is also serving as an extension cord because its cord is long enough to plug into the wall.

 

[Bobby]

It says watching from Living Room 1. Tuner 1 says the same. We were actually watching Tuner 1. No one was watching CBS. The TV with the Joey was turned off several hours prior. There was no recording going on, no timer scheduled, DVR empty, only the green light was lit on the Hopper (not the red DVR light), and PTAT was off.
View attachment 139635

The next morning, same thing. Tuner 3 and Tuner 1 both watched, simultaneously, by Living Room 1. We were actually watching Tuner 1. No one was watching CBS, there was no recording, PTAT off, the Joey TV was turned off, etc.
View attachment 139636


I am actually very encouraged that Dish reached out to me. First, they are on the ball, because this team somehow found me. It was the day after I posted here the first time. Maybe that's just coincidence. Maybe it's because I called the telephone tech support so often. But I like that they are so pro-active. I actually like almost everything about Dish. I like the channel package I have for the price, the remote, the support and tech people are nice, and now we see that they have teams actively working on more difficult problems.

I'm also relieved that they knew all about the malfunction, and exactly when and how it occurs. This is clearly an issue they have identified even if it is rare. I can stop obssessively taking photos of every diagnostic screen every morning at 5:00 AM. They already know what and why it happens. Their solution - allow PTAT recording - seems odd, but if it works, it's a good sign. At least we can progress toward a reasonable solution. I want to have the tuners available, and I don't want to record Prime Time every night, but at least knowing the details is a start.

The mystery of the malfunction was causing me a lot of anxiety. I take very seriously the recommendations about the electrical power, and I was starting to worry what kind of major problems my home might have that aren't visible. Especially because the Dish tech, who actually saw it, said that the setup is fine. But at the moment, it seems like in this particular situation there might be a specific, known, and unrelated reason for the problem. So it is a relief.

I will still keep in mind the issues that everyone mentioned about grounding, etc., but am less anxious about it for the moment.

Re the surge protector:
It is a Belkin 8-Outlet Power Surge. Protector, Specs: 3550 Joule-energy rating / 6,000v maximum spike voltage / AC 15A, 125V, 1875W. It is less than 6 months old.
The coax cables do not go through the surge protector. They run from outside into the house and are directly connected to the Joey and the Hopper.
The only other item plugged into the surge protector is the TV, a 32" . On a practical level, the surge protector is also serving as an extension cord because its cord is long enough to plug into the wall.

Thanks for your last photos. I see an issue in that the photo shows that your Living Room 1 TV is watching two things at the same time. Somehow something isn't happening when you change channels. I don't see how that can happen unless something is going on with the hybrid arena. Your hub has been changed, your Hopper has been changed. If I were them I'd change the LNB. That's the last of the hybrid equipment.

 

[Bobby]

I don't know why yours is doing that, but this is mine taken just now:

Mine has been doing that since day one!

 

[JSheridan]

Thanks for your last photos. I see an issue in that the photo shows that your Living Room 1 TV is watching two things at the same time. Somehow something isn't happening when you change channels. I don't see how that can happen unless something is going on with the hybrid arena. Your hub has been changed, your Hopper has been changed. If I were them I'd change the LNB. That's the last of the hybrid equipment.

Using picture in picture or a channel on swap might show two things at once.

 

[dweber]

I was thinking the same thing as JSheridan except that my Hopper3 will say “Watching PIP” under status when multiple tuners are being used.
We should keep in mind that a Hopper with Sling may act differently than a Hopper3.


Sent from my iPhone using SatelliteGuys

 

[Bobby]

Using picture in picture or a channel on swap might show two things at once.

I hadn’t thought about that.

 

[HipKat]

Thanks for your last photos. I see an issue in that the photo shows that your Living Room 1 TV is watching two things at the same time. Somehow something isn't happening when you change channels. I don't see how that can happen unless something is going on with the hybrid arena. Your hub has been changed, your Hopper has been changed. If I were them I'd change the LNB. That's the last of the hybrid equipment.

Right. It almost looks like PIP is on.

 

[HipKat]

Mine has been doing that since day one!

That's so odd, because in my Customer Education, I always show them this screen - especially if they have kids and I always have all the Joeys off, to free up the tuners so guides can D/L. etc and I've never seen that before. Very strange. BUT, as long as everything works for you.....

 

[falconress]

"The prime time anytime being turned on is exactly what I did when I was logged into your box during our call. I know you just turned it off again but if you want the morning error messages to stop I know turning prime time anytime back on should and will fix that issue from occurring. "


THIS WORKED. Everyone was smiling this morning

I hope it continues to work.

At the moment:

• Prime Time Anytime is turned on (reluctantly on my part).
• 2 of 3 tuners are available for us to watch TV.
• Tuner 3 is permanently in use, 24 hours, by the 4 nat'l networks (not only during prime time).
• Dish Anywhere (Live TV) works only sporadically. It used to be perfect. Now it disconnects after 3 minutes.

Otherwise, everything works smoothly. Fingers crossed.

There are no more random error codes since the new wiring. The tech explained that the reason for the errors was because even though the signal to the dish was strong, the faulty cable was sending bad information to the Hopper. It’s a shame that Dish doesn’t make it a requirement to put in new cables when a new system is installed. I was just getting the impression that Dish is not as reliable as DirecTV, and not even as reliable as Dish itself used to be when we had it in the early 2000’s – eight years, zero service calls.

The major problem – the daily crash of the system that has plagued us for 3 weeks – is apparently an issue that Dish has identified, and is not related to the setup in my home. I will contact them to send me a different model of Hopper.

If we have problems again, I will reread everyone’s good advice about possible electrical problems. But right now, with the big problem being identified as being on Dish’s end, it looks like the setup in our home is okay.

 

[HipKat]

It’s a shame that Dish doesn’t make it a requirement to put in new cables when a new system is installed.

Dish does make it a requirement to visually inspect cabling, replacing cable that looks worn or isn't the proper rating for the receivers it's connected to, run limit scans at the Receiver and check for excessive line noise (dBM's) in the cabling. The problem is lazy, improperly or overloaded techs skip over those steps too many times - I've been guilty of that, myself

 

[osumike]

I can't tell if op is being facetious or not about someone suggesting electrical interference. Hope not. Anyway, glad to hear it's working now.

 

[HipKat]

I can't tell if op is being facetious or not about someone suggesting electrical interference. Hope not. Anyway, glad to hear it's working now.

It's NOT working, though. Not at 100% like it should be. Seems like the immediate problem may be fixed, possibly only temporarily, but you should not be forced to keep PTAT on to patch an issue that never should have existed in the first place and only having 2 of 3 tuners available isn't right, either.

falconress I'm curious. I missed how many TV's you have, but if you have 3, can you try to put all 3 on non-Network channels and see what happens? Or if you have 2, can you do the same with Dish Anywhere as the 3rd TV? And just for extra merit, get DA going before you power up the Joey. I just wonder if he'll get black screen, TV Activity screen or will it clear the Tuner 3 always showing the 4 Networks