Hearst Television Inc. blacks out DISH customers in 26 markets

[Tampa8]

I'm still not quite clear on why Dish can't provide OTA guide data? My tv pulls in guide data for free, why would Dish pay the broadcasters extra for it? Who pays for the guide data that displays on my tv?

DISH does not use OTA guide data, and I don't think their modules are capable of receiving OTA guide data. DISH simply uses the Satellite guide data for OTA channels. People seem to be confusing paying for OTA guide data and not having the capability to receive it. Btw my TIVO does not receive OTA guide data either. If the info isn't in the data base I pay for there is no data.

 

[AlaJoe]

Well I now have my OTA Dongle and the guide data to go with it so as far as it matters to me I hope dish digs in and refuses to put the Hearst channels back until Hearst agrees to cut the fee they were getting in half.

 

[The Fat Man]

Yes. As Tampa is saying, our sets and OTA boxes (not cable or satellite) receive the PSIP data directly. On Dish, they get their data from a separate source. That source is used to provide the same data for locals received through Dish and locals received over your OTA adapter. It's like most car radios. Some cars get the digital text sent over the FM waves that displays car radio. Others only get the audio signal. Dish gets the OTA signal, but does receive the PSIP guide info.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using the SatelliteGuys app!

 

[docdaddy]

For me, the OTA (and I just ordered a new OTA dongle) is still not a replacement if my locals go out unless only one goes out, as we record a lot on the networks and often are recording on all 4 networks at once. Plus, for us, the antenna has to be moved to get different local channels, so it's not set and forget (and even when they add the two tuner capability for the dongle I wouldn't be able to record two OTA networks at once.

However, I do still feel that Directv and Dish need to make their next boxes extremely OTA friendly (e.g. built in OTA with 4 tuners, good channel guides, etc.) in order to lessen the blackmail power of the locals.

 

[sam_gordon]

he channels don't have a say, the guide data belongs to Rovi. The reason the guide data disappeared is that in the backend, Dish links OTA channels to the satellite channels so that they don't have to keep up with duplicates. It requires them to make changes in the backend, changes that probably aren't trivial to do. If they expect the outage to be short, like a few days, why bother. If it's going to be long and drawn out, then they'll make the change like they have now with Hearst stations.

That makes sense. Thank you.

I don't think it is necessarily the money, but rather the additional effort (and bandwidth usage) it would take to uplink the separate guide data for the OTA feed (instead of simply mapping down the guide data from the satellite-delivered channel) just to have to turn around and reverse that change only a few hours to a few days later. (

There is no "additional bandwidth" used. PSIP would come from your OTA signal, not satellite (if Dish enabled it).

Sam, it goes back to my point with you. PSIP only goes so far. Much shorter than Dish, Directv, and the Cable Companies have in their guides. I bet that will take up bandwidth to push, which simply isn't needed at most times. Hence, not cost effective.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using the SatelliteGuys app!

1) No bandwidth restrictions. See above.
2) IMO, even 3 hours of data would be better than 0 hours.

 

[ChadT41]

Not if it has to update the night before... like the rest of the EPG. Otherwise the guide will just say "no information available".

 

[sam_gordon]

Depends on how Dish would write the programming. Again, every TV manufacturer has been able to figure this out for the last decade. Why are people acting like I think Dish needs to find out how to do the impossible?

 

[The Fat Man]

1) No bandwidth restrictions. See above.
2) IMO, even 3 hours of data would be better than 0 hours.

I need to concede that bandwidth was not the right word. But, although I'm struggling for right terminology, I'm wanting to say that whether it's memory on the devices, etc., it would take something up. Frankly, for me, OTA Guide Data is not a top priority, especially when deciding the amount of time it needs to be used, versus, what some of these receivers might need to give up in performance to receive it.

My opinion of what you're writing is, you're lucky to be able to get the channel that was blacked out through an alternative means, yet, that alone isn't good enough. Now, we need guide data. It's a crappie situation. But, I would rather focus on resolving the peeing contest that both companies are having, over finding ways to help the niche group of us lucky ones in OTA range, with adapters or the inserts for the 722k, etc. It just makes better sense to think of this macro instead of micro, the overall subscriber base over a small percentage.

I get where you're coming from, but to me, unless 80% of the subscribers switch to the Flex pack and drop the locals, it will always not be a top priority to focus on the guide data from PSIP.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using the SatelliteGuys app!

 

[pattykay]

There is no "additional bandwidth" used. PSIP would come from your OTA signal, not satellite (if Dish enabled it).

I was not referring to PSIP. I was referring to the separate guide data stream that Dish is uplinking to the satellite to be mapped to the OTA versions of the stations in dispute, while the message about the dispute remains in the guide for the satellite-delivered info channels on the local channel number. Guide data may not take up much bandwidth, but it does use some bandwidth, and that could be a consideration, on Dish's part, about whether to provide it or not.

 

[Joe891]

My local NBC put this up today
http://www.wbaltv.com/article/an-open-letter-to-dish-subscribers/9128167

 

[comfortably_numb]

My local NBC put this up today
http://www.wbaltv.com/article/an-open-letter-to-dish-subscribers/9128167

Aww, Dish is picking on this poor unfortunate completely innocent TV station. /sarcasm

Before I understood what these disputes were really about, I would've bought into that story.

Now that I know better, I wonder why the article doesn't remind people that they can view WBAL for free with an antenna? Or that they declined to leave the station on-air while they are negotiating?

All they are doing is stating that they deserve the deal they got with X provider over there. They demand the price that the market will bear. Market forces.

If that's the case, give them the deal, pass the cost on to the customers as a line item, then let us drop the channel.

Problem solved. Market forces will fix it.

 

[Joe891]

Aww, Dish is picking on this poor unfortunate completely innocent TV station. /sarcasm

Before I understood what these disputes were really about, I would've bought into that story.

Now that I know better, I wonder why the article doesn't remind people that they can view WBAL for free with an antenna? Or that they declined to leave the station on-air while they are negotiating?

All they are doing is stating that they deserve the deal they got with X provider over there. Market forces.

If that's the case, give them the deal, pass the cost on to the customers as a line item, then let us drop the channel.

Problem solved. Market forces will fix it.

Yes I know, I had relatives posting it not understanding and I had to explain the same thing to them

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

 

[comfortably_numb]

Yes I know, I had relatives posting it not understanding and I had to explain the same thing to them

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

Yep. Until providers give the customers the option to opt-in or out, the stations will continue to paint themselves as an injured party. "But we just want what the market will bear," they say. Fair enough. Then once all the customers drop your precious channel that you deem so valuable, the price will come back down. College Econ 101!

 

[Nascarken 91xg]

I ask how far are u from OTA tower's ?

 

[Joe891]

I ask how far are u from OTA tower's ?

Probably about 30 miles or so, I can receive Baltimore and Washington dc via ota but i am in the Baltimore dma

 

[ChadT41]

I like how they make it a point to say The you have successfully negotiated with all other providers while putting Dish down for past blackouts. Hearst just took their stations down off DTV in January. If they consider that successfully negotiating, then so has Dish.

 

[comfortably_numb]

I like how they make it a point to say The you have successfully negotiated with all other providers while putting Dish down for past blackouts. Hearst just took their stations down off DTV in January. If they consider that successfully negotiating, then so has Dish.

Playing the victim card works for them. Let's face it, folks, 99.8% of the population believes it. The tactic works in their favor.

 

[sam_gordon]

My opinion of what you're writing is, you're lucky to be able to get the channel that was blacked out through an alternative means, yet, that alone isn't good enough. Now, we need guide data. It's a crappie situation. But, I would rather focus on resolving the peeing contest that both companies are having, over finding ways to help the niche group of us lucky ones in OTA range, with adapters or the inserts for the 722k, etc. It just makes better sense to think of this macro instead of micro, the overall subscriber base over a small percentage.

I just want to point out, PSIP guide data would benefit more than those with disputes. It would also help those that pick up subchannels OTA that Dish doesn't provide guide data for.

 

[ChadT41]

Then the complaint would be "why does dish only go a couple hours out; how can I set recordings if I don't know what is on?"

It is a no win across the board. Customers still won't be happy.

 

[Bobby]

^^^^^
I'd quadruple like that if I could....