HBO Max/Discovery+ Merger

[Bruce]

If that's what they're going to do, that's taking a big step toward having Max effectively duplicate WBD's piece of the cable bundle. Max may not include live streams of their linear cable channels (yet), but may be set to offer all their new content on-demand the same time as it airs on cable. The only big things that would be missing are live sports and live news (CNN). And, as the post above states, it looks like they may be bringing at least some of TNT's and/or TBS's live sports to Max too, following the lead of Peacock, which live streams nearly all the sports aired across NBCU's networks.

I've said for awhile now that I think this is the logical evolution of DTC streaming services that are owned by traditional TV companies: include all the new content airing on their legacy broadcast/cable nets in the DTC app, while also offering additional streaming-exclusive new content too.

Rumors are Live Feeds of all Warner/Discovery Channels on MAX by the end of the year at the latest.

Reason is, attract more Cord Cutters to subscribe and increase Advertising Revenue ( more eyes watching) and no real costs to add them since owed by Warner/Discovery.

 

[Stuart Sweet]

I certainly wouldn't be surprised if they add live feeds, after all it's not terribly expensive to do. I'd question the value of it in an app that's probably already going to be unfocused and overstuffed.

As I see it, this whole thing could be very very good or very very bad. If the doofuses who wrote the original Discovery+ app haven't learned from their mistakes, it's going to be a nightmare at launch. And I think there's a good chance that quality content will continue to be deplatformed in favor of yet another house hunting show and yet another reality competition cooking show. As I see it, the world doesn't need any more of either.

Or, it could actually become a destination I want to visit again. It was, and then when Discovery took over it went straight into the dumper.

As for live feeds, I have to say I hardly ever watch them unless there's a real "halo" show to watch like GoT or Barry or whatever. But if they are there in the app, it's not gonna offend me nearly as much as another show with Joanna Gaines would.

 

[Bruce]

I certainly wouldn't be surprised if they add live feeds, after all it's not terribly expensive to do. I'd question the value of it in an app that's probably already going to be unfocused and overstuffed.

Peacock already does it with Hallmark, already announced the NBC RSNs will be added, expect the rest of the Universal Channels on there also before year’s end

CBS does it also, expect the rest of the Viacom/Paramount channels on P+ also by year’s end.

As I see it, this whole thing could be very very good or very very bad. If the doofuses who wrote the original Discovery+ app haven't learned from their mistakes, it's going to be a nightmare at launch. And I think there's a good chance that quality content will continue to be deplatformed in favor of yet another house hunting show and yet another reality competition cooking show. As I see it, the world doesn't need any more of either.

That is all Warner/Discovery has been doing since the merger, keep tossing stuff at the wall and see what will stick.

Or, it could actually become a destination I want to visit again. It was, and then when Discovery took over it went straight into the dumper.

AT&T did a number on Warner well before Discovery took over, but Discovery has proven not to be much better.

As for live feeds, I have to say I hardly ever watch them unless there's a real "halo" show to watch like GoT or Barry or whatever. But if they are there in the app, it's not gonna offend me nearly as much as another show with Joanna Gaines would.

Just news Inwatch live right now, even the shows on Broadcast/Cable Channels I watch on the streaming services for the better quality.

 

[NashGuy]

Rumors are Live Feeds of all Warner/Discovery Channels on MAX by the end of the year at the latest.

That's interesting. Where'd you hear that? I haven't seen anything about that. Although it is something that I've been predicting that we'd eventually see across all the DTC services owned by traditional TV network companies. This is how I see the cable bundle break apart into a few mini-bundles, with each DTC app having its own set of live cable channels and their related on-demand content (plus additional streaming-exclusive on-demand-only content, e.g. Max Originals).

Those companies have resisted making that move so far because they didn't want to cannibalize their cable networks and further erode subscriptions to the cable bundle. But a couple of developments may be changing their thinking now. The first is the fact that cable subscriptions have already fallen off so much and the bundle is a slowly sinking ship. At some point, rather than continuing to play defense, they may as well give in to the trend and embrace it.

The second is that the DTC streaming wars have shifted from their first phase, which was to grow the subscriber base at any cost (i.e. by running up a lot of debt), to the second phase, which is to turn these DTC services into profitable next-gen replacements for the cable bundle. One way they're trying to do that now is to cut costs. A steady flow of fresh streaming content costs a lot. So why are they continuing to divide their content spending between traditional and DTC? Why not take all the content they're buying for traditional and put it on DTC at the same time? Doing so could also allow them to increase the price for the DTC service, which would also speed them along the path to profitability.

When the dust settles in a few years, I suspect we'll be left with only two major DTC streamers containing the bulk of today's broadcast and cable networks. One will be Disney+ and the other will be some combination of WBD, NBCU and Paramount. Smaller players, such as Fox, Hallmark and AMC, will probably need to either be acquired by one of those two or strike a licensing deal with one or both (as Hallmark has already done with NBCU's Peacock).

 

[meStevo]

Live feeds of premiums (sports/news the exception) don't matter as much when all the content is readily on demand IMO.

 

[NashGuy]

Live feeds of premiums (sports/news the exception) don't matter as much when all the content is readily on demand IMO.

Yeah, true. But with regard to basic cable channels, a lot of the new content still isn't available even next-day on the related DTC service (much less same-day). We have gradually seen more and more basic cable content showing up next-day though. For instance, Peacock now streams some, but not all, shows next-day from SyFy and MSNBC (but nothing from USA, I think). Hulu has everything from FX, FXX and Freeform next-day. Paramount+ does little, if anything, next-day from their channels except for CBS. (For instance, you can't stream a new ep of Yellowstone next-day in Paramount+.)

What I think will eventually happen is that those live channels will stream inside the related DTC app and as soon as a new episode airs on the live channel, it's also available to stream on-demand. At that point, DTC will have fully absorbed traditional cable TV, with distribution of those channels broken apart from a single bundle into each company's own mini-bundle via their DTC app.

 

[Bruce]

Yeah, true. But with regard to basic cable channels, a lot of the new content still isn't available even next-day on the related DTC service (much less same-day). We have gradually seen more and more basic cable content showing up next-day though. For instance, Peacock now streams some, but not all, shows next-day from SyFy and MSNBC (but nothing from USA, I think).

USA quit offering scripted new content, just reality shows like Race to Survive, new episodes are on Tuesday according to the Peacock app.

I found all the SyFy on Peacock, most is on next day, the other stuff are shows not produced by Universal, which is not much.

MSNBC they do live feeds of certain shows, expect all to be by the end of the year.

Hulu has everything from FX, FXX and Freeform next-day.

Correct, along with Nat Geo on Hulu and Disney+.

Paramount+ does little, if anything, next-day from their channels except for CBS.

Nick, MTV and Showtime also, BET no.

(For instance, you can't stream a new ep of Yellowstone next-day in Paramount+.)

One of the reasons why Yellowstone is ending after 5 Seasons, the sequel series will be on Paramount and next day on P+.

What I think will eventually happen is that those live channels will stream inside the related DTC app and as soon as a new episode airs on the live channel, it's also available to stream on-demand. At that point, DTC will have fully absorbed traditional cable TV, with distribution of those channels broken apart from a single bundle into each company's own mini-bundle via their DTC app.

As I have written before, these next 2 years is a time of transition, by the end of 2024, all of what you wrote is correct except for certain things, like ESPN being it’s own service, changing ESPN+ into all of ESPN to make up some of those per sub fees lost, along with it still being available on Traditional Providers services.

 

[Bruce]

That's interesting. Where'd you hear that? I haven't seen anything about that. Although it is something that I've been predicting that we'd eventually see across all the DTC services owned by traditional TV network companies. This is how I see the cable bundle break apart into a few mini-bundles, with each DTC app having its own set of live cable channels and their related on-demand content (plus additional streaming-exclusive on-demand-only content, e.g. Max Originals).

Cannot reveal, involves my last employment, but the same rumors have been on Reddit also, written just like I have heard it, so I assume by someone posting there who does not care about a NDA.

 

[NashGuy]

USA quit offering scripted new content, just reality shows like Race to Survive, new episodes are on Tuesday according to the Peacock app.

I found all the SyFy on Peacock, most is on next day, the other stuff are shows not produced by Universal, which is not much.

MSNBC they do live feeds of certain shows, expect all to be by the end of the year.

Correct, along with Nat Geo on Hulu and Disney+.

Nick, MTV and Showtime also, BET no.

Yeah, looks like Peacock is now doing at least some USA reality shows next-day on Peacock. I think the only thing they're streaming live from MSNBC is Morning Joe. But most of their other shows stream on-demand next-day (although not Rachel Maddow).

But you're wrong about new eps of Nick and MTV shows on Paramount+, at least as a general rule. The Nick websites touts a few current series (Loud House, Danger Force, etc.). You can watch new eps there with a cable login but Paramount+ doesn't show any episodes from those shows' current seasons, only past seasons. Same with current MTV series like Ridiculousness and Jersey Shore: Family Vacation -- they're not on P+ yet. Unlike Disney's Hulu and NBCU's Peacock, Paramount is still trying to protect their linear cable nets by keeping their new episodes off of Paramount+. Will be interesting to see what they do with the upcoming Yellowstone sequel series. Will they wait weeks/months to bring the season to P+, as they do now with Peacock, or will they stream it on P+ next-day? Next-day would be a big shift for Paramount.

As for Showtime, yeah, that's not a basic cable net but an a la carte premium; its new episodes (and even its live linear feed) have always been available at the same time in the DTC app as on cable.

 

[klang]

Today is supposed to be the big day of changing over to Max. I don't see any app updates so far.....

Edit: The website has been updated.

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

I had to download the new MAX app. The HBO Max app didn't update and while it still works didn't show any of the new content.

I did not have to login again on the MAX app on my iPhone which was kind of cool. On my Nvidia Shield I had to sign it by opening the app on my phone and then give approval for the Shield to login.

I am happy to see my favorite show How its Made on there now I don't need Discovery Plus anymore. Since I am not home I am unable to cehck if I still have 4K.

 

[klang]

My account shows as a Legacy subscription. I'm assuming/hoping 4k will still be there until renewal. Probably have to upgrade to Ultimate after that.

 

[klang]

I thought we were supposed to be able to roll our stand-alone Discovery+ subscription over to Max but I don't see a way to do that yet.

 

[Stuart Sweet]

Unless it's a bug, or unless it's just me, satellite subscribers with HBO don't get 4K on Max.

DIRECTV and AT&T Subscribers: You just lost 4K streaming on Max. Thanks, Zaslav. - The Solid Signal Blog

Well Max, I tried to watch. And I'm disappointed.

blog.solidsignal.com

 

[ncted]

I cannot login with my AT&T account. It is just an endless loop of signing in to be automatically signed right back out.

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

Here’s what it shows for mine. Clicking on Learn More does nothing.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

On my a Nvidia Shield I am seeing 4K / Dolby Vision and Dolby Atmos.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Stuart Sweet]

Here’s what it shows for mine. Clicking on Learn More does nothing.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That's fairly similar to what I see. Programs will be listed that are available in 4K/Vision/Atmos but there's a very generic disclaimer that says it depends on what package you have. In other words, the 4K/Vision/Atmos badges show up even if you don't have a plan that supports them.

Really hoping this is a bug.

EDIT: Just saw your more recent post, I would be curious to see if it actually gives you Vision or Atmos when you get home.

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

Yeah we were suppopsed to get 4K for free for 6 months after the switch.

My monitors here at my office while 4K do not do Dolby Vision, not do I have an Atmos setup at my office.

 

[klang]

When I opened HBOMax on my Sony TV it prompted me to install the new Max app. The new app remembered my credentials. The new app did not replace the original so I will need to rearrange things.

Edit: I briefly started up the new Shazam movie and I definitely have Dolby Atmos.